Everyday Systems

[Barb221]

How can anyone go 5 days without sweets. I have chocolate everyday and cannot and do not want to ge without it. I would rather eat less calories for dinner so I could have my sweets. I do agree with the snacks. My mother always said that snacking would ruin my appetite. It will be difficult not eating before bedtime but I could do that but not give up the sweets. I will try this but with something sweet with my dinner.

[Mistress Manners]

If you really want to make that work, I'd define a particular quantity of a particular sweet. (Say, 2 squares of high-quality chocolate). Otherwise, it opens the door too wide, I think. I'm a chocoholic as well, but really, drawing a bright line rule works much better for me than planning to eat "just a little." Plus, when it's the weekend I really do enjoy it more.

[Bushranger]

[LA_Loser]

Barb,

Welcome to No S. It's a little hard to know exactly how to respond to your comments. Actually there are many people who actually do survive without having sweets everyday of the week. The most successful No Sers do just exactly that. . . and we find that by limiting sweets to S days and making sure that the sweets we do have are quality ones worth waiting for, we appreciate them even more.

I do know that any modifications to the simple 13/14 word plan are discouraged until you have given the "vanilla No S" rules a significant time to kick in. I would urge you to listen to Reinhard's podcasts on Tweaks and Mods; he has released two new ones in the last couple of months. He makes some really good points about when and how one should tweak the system. As a matter, try to listen to as many of the podcast that you can, particularly those relating directly to NO S. In addition to the website and the book being quite helpful, hearing Reinhard state the concepts clarifies everything a great deal.

Of course, I don't know what your reasons for doing No S are--to lose a little weight, a lot of weight, to build healthier eating habits, etc. ? There are some members who did begin with limiting only one S, then gradually working into all S's. . . those really aren't mods--just a form on "induction" I suppose. Perhaps that's what you're thinking.

In any event. . . good luck.
_________________
LA Loser. . . well on my way to becoming on an LA Winner.

[Mistress Manners]

The fact that you can't imagine going without it might be an extra-good reason to try it. It's freeing to realize that you do in fact have free will. Why not commit to doing pure vanilla No-S for one week, and seeing how you feel at the end.

[reinhard]

Barb, welcome and good luck -- with or without your mod.

No-s is a structure for controlling excess. If you think you can control excess with a slightly different structure, that's just as good.

But I would like to suggest a couple of things to keep in mind:

1) habit really is amazingly powerful. I don't think most of the no-essers here who save their sweets for S-days feel deprived -- on the contrary. I think they enjoy them more than they ever did before. And I think many of them were probably quite surprised to discover this. You might not be able to imagine going without daily sweets now, but give yourself a few weeks of training and you might be amazed. You'll be a different person.

2) if you don't quite buy that, at least for you, mistress manners' advice about having some rule to unambiguously define and contain your daily sweet is a good idea. It can be very hard to stop with just one little square of chocolate or whatever, especially if you haven't firmly decided what the definition of that whatever is.

Reinhard

[reinhard]

At way too long last, part 3 of the mods and tweaks trilogy, "When a mere mod isn't enough: how to roll your own everyday system from scratch."

http://everydaysystems.com/podcast/episode.php?id=37

[chentegt]

My mod is this:

"N" also means Normal food, so: no junk/fast food on N days. If, however, I'm at a very special situation (for example, an office meeting with no other option but eating some junk), I make an exception.
It's worked fine so far for me...

For my glass ceiling, I have a mod also: on Special days (not saturdays, not sundays, ONLY birthdays, holidays, etc.), if I'm not driving (or if someone can drive me home), I have permission to have more than 2 drinks.

[reinhard]

[burnnotice]

Hi-

I'm really fighting at 'bedtime snack' period. I wanted to thank everyone for this section. I saw the FAT, fruit any time, and decided to allow myself a piece of fruit if needed during my trouble time. Knowing I had this option took some of the anxiety from plating my evening meal and anxiety away from 8-10 pm glutton period.

Thanks so much.

Colleen
_________________
Me
The Client

[ksbrowne]

My 1 mod is this, when I sit down to eat, I tell myself I can have 1 average/moderate helping of everything. I love the No S Diet, and follow it strictly, but I think portion sizes might be a loophole that could get people in trouble.

No snacks, no sweets, no seconds - those are the rules that come first, of course, but if people are following these rules and still feel like they want to lose a few more pounds, I'd suggest checking their portion sizes.

Kathy

[Thalia]

I agree that portion sizes matter. For me, the "one plate" rule seems to keep them reasonable without further tinkering, providing that I make sure that most of my plates include a solid amount of real estate devoted to fruits and vegetables.

[Bfrilkins]

Hi all. I am new to the no-S, and already have some mods. Actually decided on them before I embarked up on it. So far so good.

1) Weekends are NOT special days. I really need structure on weekends or they become permasnack way too quickly.

However...

2) Everyday I am allowed a single "S", either snack or sweet. By single, I mean a single measured portion size. Primarily this is a bit of chocolate after dinner. That is a great motivator to keep on track during the day. When I'm thinking of a snack, I remember that if I have a snack now I am depriving myself of the chocolate later. I'm happiest if I save that for later!

3) Fresh plain fruits/vegs are allowed as a snack if I'm really hungry (or just out in the garden nibbling). But I try to walk/get outside & drink some water even before having that kind of snack when I feel "hungry", to make sure it's not stress or thirst that's making me want to eat (and usually that is the case).

4) I've added some additional no-S phrases to help me remember NO SNEAKING and NO SAMPLES. "Sneaking" is when I, barely thinking about it, take a few choc. chips or a couple or nuts or something from the kitchen canisters, or a bite of this or that while I'm cooking. Gotta catch those and stop it, because they do count and do add up and I don't even enjoy them really because I'm not paying attention. "Samples" refers to samples at the grocery store (so far, I haven't quit on those, but it's only one sample per visit).

5) Some calorie counting added to the NO-S system. Not counting per day, but often for lunch. My lunches are usually based on some pre-packaged meal, salad, or sandwich. Those can vary wildly in calories and quickly be more than a meal even though they don't look like much.

[BrightAngel]

[guadopt1997]

That's why I only go to Harris Teater on weekends!

[Dandelion]

I realised the other day I have a couple of mods that I decided to just accept because they aren't excesses but normal everydayness for me.

For quite some time, hot chocolate has been my 'normal' breakfast drink. I heat whole milk on the stove and mix it with good cocoa powder, whole milk and about half teaspoon of sugar. For most people that would be too bitter, but for me it's plenty sweet, and I figure that a lot of people use more sugar than that in their coffee and though I often have tea (milk, no sugar), this time of year I start leaning a bit toward the hot chocolate for breakfast.

The other is a square of dark chocolate after dinner. Usually Lindt 70% or failing that, maybe Ghiardelli 60% (which is what I use for baking). For me it just finishes the meal without being sweet (which I don't enjoy in my chocolates in general, but now I really don't want on an N day) and does not make me feel 'overfull'.

[SavvyV]

I like this idea and was trying to figure out how to succeed with a chocolate mod on N days. This idea would work for me because I don't really have to have it sweet. . .just chocolatlelly
_________________
If hunger is not the problem, then eating is not the solution. ~Author Unknown

You can't lose weight by talking about it. You have to keep your mouth shut. ~Author Unknown

[wosnes]

[Katieb]

I am so excited to try this woe. I tried intuitive eating, but was not disciplined enough. I guess my mod will be to drink skim milk. I love milk, and have at least 4 glasses per day. (Ususally between meals and at bedtime.) I hope that will not hold me back too much!
_________________
KatieBinNC

[Walkingman]

Hi Everyone,

This is my first post. I've been using No S for about three months.

My main modification is that I don't use S days. My release valve is that I allow myself to snack on fruit. I have a hard time going five hours between meals. But I can get by fine with one piece of fruit between breakfast and lunch, and between lunch and dinner. I rarely need it after dinner. Sometime I am hungrier than usual, so I leave open the option to have more fruit. I wish I could build the habit of skipping snacks altogether, but it just does not seem feasible for me. I figure there's no point torturing myself when two pieces of healthy fruit takes away all the pain.

My other modification was in response to my slow pace of weight loss. As a longtime calorie counter, I decided to target about 500 calories per meal. This is a very loose goal, and I routinely go over. But it seems to help me keep my portions a little smaller. Otherwise, I find I can easily load over 1000 calories on a plate without it looking the least bit shameful. I feel obliged to add that it really doesn't make me feel like a food accountant. It's just a quick rule of thumb that takes me just a few seconds, and I don't keep any kind of daily running total.

[Anoulie]

[Walkingman]

[Kevin]

It's interesting. Sweets don't do jack for me. But crackers and crab dip...

[Cantab]

In order to reduce my appetite so that I am less interested in the S's, I am having a few hundred flavorless calories with a no-flavor window around it, an idea invented by Berkeley psychology professor Seth Roberts. In practice, first thing in the morning, I put on swimmer's noseplugs and drink a mixture of 2 T flax oil and 1 c unsweetened soymilk shaken in an empty peanut butter jar (310 calories), and more than an hour later I eat breakfast.

I found that Flavorless Calories by itself were not helpful because I found it disorienting not to have a strong appetite, so I had no idea what or when or how much to eat. No S answers that question for me.

On No S by itself, I found that I was eating more fat in order to reduce my appetite between meals, and I gained a few pounds. That may have been a temporary gain, but it was a reminder to be careful. I decided that additional fat may as well be healthy fat with maximal potential to reduce my appetite. I am not otherwise doing anything other than trying to have intelligent defaults.

See Seth Roberts's <a href="http://sethroberts.net/">website</a> for more information about flavorless calories. There is a Shovelglove person on the forum there. Seth calls it the Shangrila Diet, but I think that makes it sound gimmicky, so I don't call it that. They are doing lots of self-experimentation over there, as people here do. And Seth normally lives in Berkeley, Cambridge's sister city, though he's been teaching in China lately.

[Dandelion]

A few weeks ago I added what might be another 'mod'. I have been at this long enough (five months) to have settled in enough that I just don't care to do anything else, and I can't see myself ever doing anything else. I've been living with this mod for a month and it's working well enough I feel confident adding it to the list.

My weekend esses have always included an extravagant sweet of some kind: Chocolate souffles, creme brulee, chocolate chip pie, that kind of thing and something to eat at tea time (weekdays I just have tea by itself). Nothing noteworthy there.

My mod has evolved to fit my family and our lifestyle. I had designated Wednesdays as 'whatever' night due to our busy mid-week schedule and the desire to reduce food waste. Some days it's a feast of favourites - and other days it feels like common leftovers.

I decided to tip the balance toward the pleasant side by planning a 'non-sweet' dessert. I started out with simple things like fruit and cream and baked apples (and cream ), but as those were successful, I've branched out a bit more into panna cotta, crepes with dark chocolate, gelatin (not a box - just gelled juice) with fruit and cream.

I know these would sound like sweets, but I make them all myself, so I know exactly how much sweet isn't in them , (not to mention additives and other junk), and good cream is a nutritious food (I got over the belief years ago that natural fats are unhealthy or make one fat)

I enjoy the extra opportunity to be creative and 'spoil' my family with healthy, nutritious desserts that do not encourage a 'sweet tooth' and helps keep 'Whatever Wednesday' from feeling like 'leftover night'

And yes - it would all still fit on one plate

[Ragdoll]

[Ragdoll]

I've decided to add mods to the diet (I'm impatient, and gaining weight -- that'll never do). I started the No S Diet in December, taking awhile to add each of the principles until I was fully on the diet.

I reached a month on the diet this past Friday. Unfortunately, I am gaining weight with it. I don't need to continue eating whatever I want (don't think I was that unhealthy, but who knows) for the next two months to know that it is not helping me lose weight.

I agree with everyone in here who is urging Barb to not feel tied to sweets. As someone with an intense sweet tooth, and a constant grazer (seconds have never been a problem), diets worked for me for a month before, shaking with hunger, I devoured entire packets of cookies. I've never been obese, but I am about 30 lbs over weight, with this principle of lose, gain, lose, gain even more, etc.

Though No S hasn't worked as a diet (for weight loss), it HAS worked as an eating plan. What I mean by that is, I now know that I have ZERO problems only eating three meals per day. I don't snack, I don't cheat with sweets, and I never have seconds. My S days have never been idiotic, just N Days with sweets or healthy snacks.

So, now that No S has giving me the foundation of 3-per-day meal structure, AND the ability to tame that beast, appetite, and force it to do my will -- I can tweak and modify the diet until it results in long-term, steady weight loss. I've never been religious, but I do feel like saying Hallelujah.

Even despite the weight gain, taming my habits and appetite is something that, in 28 years, I've never managed in my life for longer than a month.

So, here are my mods:

I'm sticking to No Snacks, Seconds or Sweets during the week, but with the following added mods:

1)One tea plate full of food (roughly around 400 cals -- don't want to count obsessively, but don't mind keeping an eye out for egregious offenders) for breakfast and lunch

2) One normal sized plate for dinnner, half of which must be filled with veg (sweetcorn and peas don't count towards veg portions)

3) On weekend, no Seconds, only healthy Snacks, and Sweets as long as they're either eaten as a meal replacement (i.e., if I want a chocolate croissant, that's breakfast, with a little fruit), or as a very small treat after lunch or dinner. This has worked well the past month to stop me being an "idiot".

Here's a sample menu, from yesterday:

Breakfast: Poached Egg, half a Cinnamon Raisin bagel with spread, two cups of coffee with 2% milk and sweeteners

Lunch: Cup of Sweet Potato and Celery Soup, piece of String Cheese, 6 Snack Crackers (Ryvita)

Dinner: Half a plate filled with Spinach, Carrots & Swede, Turkey Breast Pieces sauteed in Sunflower Spread with Paprika, Salt & Cracked Pepper. I virtually plated for (and calorically budgeted for) a pot of non-fat Yoghurt.
_________________
Height: 5'6"
Starting Weight 01/08/10: 12 stone/168 pounds
Goal Weight: 10 stone/140 pounds

“Some day you will be old enough to start reading fairy tales again.”

-C.S. Lewis

[vmelo]

I know I'm late responding to this, but I had to comment that your plan sounds almost just like a plan I was on for TWO YEARS in my 20's (about 15 years ago). The only difference is that I would allow myself a sweet as breakfast (e.g., a muffin or danish, etc.) if I wanted it. I got down to the thinnest I have ever been in my adult life---too thin, in fact. Also, it was the easiest plan I have ever been on because I didn't have to do any meal planning.

After two years, I went off the wagon big-time, though. I think it was because I was too stringent about not eating sweets or snacks (other than fruit) for so long that all that will-power just exploded one day. In theory, No-S should address that problem. I haven't been successful with it, though, even though I've tried it at least five times. Believe me, I'm not knocking the plan. I think it's great. It's me.

[Kathleen]

Reinhard,

I've ended up withs several mods:

1. A mod of "perfect compliance": Failure is not to be excused. There are some habits which are ones of "perfect compliance" -- I brush my teeth every day. Some other habits are not so perfect. This is a habit of perfect compliance. The reason why this is so important to me is that I don't want to be constantly thinking about eating and food. I want a lifestyle in which my eating habits are about as exciting and worthy of my thought and time as thinking about brushing my teeth.

2. A mod for definition of S Days: All Sundays are S Days as are two additional days per month which are "floaters" and which I can use for any reason whatsoever and carry over to the next month if not used. In one year, I have 52 Sunday S Days and 24 "floater" S Days.

3. A mod of "no portion control": This idea is from the book Intuitive Eating and the concept of "unconditional permission to eat". I can eat as much as I want at every meal and all day on S Days. I refrain from eating sweets except on S Days, but I eat as much as I want of what I do eat. On N Days, the amount I eat (and I only eat at mealtimes on N Days) has to be before me (at my place) before I take one bite.

I've had a long, long detour. Today I weighed 196.6, which is exactly what was my low for last summer. I have lost no weight since June of last year. I'm happy, though, because I think I'm back on track after trying several mods that turned out to be at best ineffective and at worst counterproductive. These three mods are what have stuck.

Kathleen
_________________
Why eat now if I can eat later?

(Week 1) - April 15, 2013: 225.0 pounds.
(Week 6) - May 20, 2013: 219.6 pounds.
Week 6 goal is 220.0 pounds.

[pinkhippie]

I haven't been no s'ing for very long but one mod I quickly realized I have to make is in the morning. I am not hungry for food in the morning and I generally don't get hungry til around 11 am. At which point I have "brunch".

But I am a nursing mom and I actually get lightheaded even though I don't feel hungry if I don't eat in the am. To me, its so important to only eat if Im hungry so what I have started doing and its taking away the floaty head thing is putting a scoop of protein powder in my hot tea... yes tea. I sip on that all morning and it keeps the lighthead at bay. Gross/ yes but it works for me.
Obviously there are calories involved but thats probably good with the whole breastfeeding thing.

Then I either have lunch around two or I wait til dinner to have my next meal. If I eat at two dinner will be later around 6 or 7. If I don't eat my next meal until dinner, then I usually eat dinner around 5 and give myself permission to have my third meal in the evening sometime after 8 usually. This works really well because its hectic with a baby and I get some peace to eat in after she goes to bed.

So far this is really working for me.

[donnao]

here is my current mod- i feel that i need to post this b/cause it may help
another person on this journey

i have posted several times that i am a recovering bulimic.
i no longer purge, but i do binge and restrict

when i first stopped purging, i made the commitment that i would keep WHATEVER i ate, not matter what ( whole gallons of ice cream, a dozen cookies- whatever)

it wasn't long before i no longer wanted to suffer that discomfort , and my pathological binges subsided more to overeating... and then restricting the next day, or two

better, but not optimal

so now, after some research, and talking with others with ED, i am making the commitment to .. guess what >> 3 meals a day, no matter what ever else i might have eaten

this means breakfast , lunch and dinner every single day, no matter what i have or have not eaten the day before, or what i have or have not eaten that day

i will probably gain some weight temporarily, but if it will get me to "normal" behaviour, then it is worth the pain of being frumpy for a while

i love this board, and all of the "normal" people on it
i would have never considered this plan of action, had i not been reading these posts for several years now and seen success with the people here

love you all, wish me luck

xo
Donna O

[AmieW]

So far I totally dig this eating system and haven't really had problems with it. My "mods" if you can call them that:

1) Drinking a small glass of fruit juice between meals is allowed if I am really craving a soda. I would rather have the small "cheat" of fruit juice than go back to drinking sodas.

2) No alcohol except on "S" days. I am not a big drinker, but would regularly knock back several beers or several glasses of wine with friends after work once or twice a week. I am making this an S day food mainly so that I really think about the extra empty calories before I indulge.

3) Sometimes I eat breakfast at 7:30 or 8:00am and don't get a break for lunch at work until 4:00 or 4:30pm. If that happens, I usually allow myself to eat a part of the lunch I've packed early to keep my energy up (usually raisins or yogurt) even though I don't have time to sit down and eat the whole meal yet.


Other than that, I sometimes make Friday night an "S" night if it is a date night with the boyfriend, but that's about it for my mods.

It's been really interesting reading what works and doesn't work for everyone else!
_________________
"It is a mistake to try to look too far ahead. The chain of destiny can only be grasped one link at a time." -Winston Churchill

[mmarchin]

Instead of no sweets, I do "sweet ceiling" of 1 per day. Usually that means no sweets, but if I get a free cookie at work, I eat it. I did this because I like free cookies at work and they're rare enough that I thought it was okay.

Friday night after work is an S night for me too.

Lost 10 pounds since December doing it this way, so I guess it's fine. If I decide I need to lose more weight, I'll re-examine my mods.

[Kathleen]

Reinhard,

My mod of "no portion control" was what my kids would call an "epic fail." I modified it to having two Fast Days, on Wednesdays and Fridays, when I deliberately eat a lot less but not so little as to be noticeable to others. These are the only two days when I have portion control. On all other days, I can eat as much as I want.

In addition, I'm tracking walking 2 miles per day and banking miles like I bank Exception Days.

I'm now 2.2 pounds below my low of 196.6 from last summer, but at least I'm moving lower. I expect to acheive a 10% weight loss (215.0 starting weight - 21.5 pounds = 193.5 pounds) by the end of this week or next.

I just listened to a very interesting podcast from Yale University's Rudd Center on how those who lose a lot of weight need to maintain a high level of vigilence and put a great deal of effort into losing weight. Well, I've put a lot of effort into figuring out how to lose weight, but following this diet is downright easy. I've followed diets where I've literally could not sleep because I felt like I was starving.

Kathleen
_________________
Why eat now if I can eat later?

(Week 1) - April 15, 2013: 225.0 pounds.
(Week 6) - May 20, 2013: 219.6 pounds.
Week 6 goal is 220.0 pounds.

[OT]

I guess my mod is that I don't eat sweets/anything with added sugar/artificial sweeteners.At all.I gave it up for lent last year,before No S,lost a few pounds and all my sweet cravings as a result, and haven't had anything with added sugar/sweeteners since. It was only hard for a few weeks but after that all my cravings disappeared and I started to appreciate the natural subtle flavours of different foods a lot more.Fruit tea actually tastes sweet!I know it may sound extreme to some people,but I don't even miss sugar.I just see sweets and chocolate as empty calories and I prefer fruit anyway. My S Day dessert of choice is cheese and red wine!mmmmmmm

[Graham]

My mods - so far, just one - 2 days a week I fast for @24 hours. After my first month of No S, seeing my weight was not coming down, despite near 100% compliance, I looked to IF to provide the weight-loss I needed to see. On average I now lose about 1lb a week, so that works OK.

My proposed mod, that I'm mulling over: I won't count the size of a salad when I'm fitting my meal onto one plate - I'll treat salad as so benign and desirable that I don't have to do without anything else in order to have it.

My reason for this mod: I noticed I was eating less fruit and salad since starting No S, because I wanted my 3 meals to be really satisfying, so I wouldn't start snacking, and I knew salad was too light to achieve that. Now I'm thinking No S isn't meant to push me away from salads, and this mod of mine would be a solution to my dilemma.

[sheepish]

Mine aren't technically "mods" because there's no rule on number of meals but, after six months or so of eating three meals a day and not seeing any weight loss, I've switched to two meals a day most days and a 24 hour fast once a week. I don't weigh - just measure by clothing - and I certainly feel a bit lighter now.

[Nicest of the Damned]

Half Plate Mod: If you're having a separate vegetable dish (as opposed to something like a stir-fry or pasta, where the vegetables are mixed in with the meat and/or starch), half the plate should be taken up by vegetables. Corn and potatoes are starches, not vegetables. Sweet potatoes are vegetables.

Only non-caloric beverages, except at meals. A non-caloric beverage is a beverage with 10 or fewer calories in a standard serving (6 oz for hot beverages, 8 oz for cold). I wish I had a catchier name for this one, though.

[Nicest of the Damned]

I'm not sure if these are really mods, or just extra food rules:

If you are at home, you must be sitting to eat (or reclining, if it's Passover Seder). This applies to snacks on S days as well. It's just not civilized to eat in any other position, and you're more likely to make a mess. I have named this one the Sitting mod.

No eating from the package unless it is a single-serving package (and no, the last serving left in the package is not the same as a single-serve package). Even then, it's better to put the food on a plate or in a bowl before eating it. This rule applies at all times, not just on N days.

The package must be closed up and put away before you can eat. This is another rule that applies at all times. I call this and the rule about not eating from packages the NEP mod, for No Eating from Packages.

The Sitting and NEP mods together make it difficult to "graze" on snack food all day. NEP makes it less likely that, when you do eat snack food, you'll end up eating a whole bag of chips.

If you must buy snack foods or sweets, always buy the smallest possible package (a single serving, or one for each person in the house, is best), with the smallest possible individual serving. Bite-size candy bars are preferable to fun-size or full-size ones, for example. There's research that shows that people eat more from larger packages.

Never buy more than one package of sweets or snack foods at a time, even if they're on a two-for-one sale. This is related to the large-packages issue.

Only buy non-food items, fresh fruits and vegetables, canned foods, and things that get cooked (or used as ingredients in recipes) at Costco. Don't even go to the parts of Costco where the other stuff is. This has to do with eating more from large packages.

Unless you're having a party, one kind of sweets or snack foods, or one favorite for each person in the house, is enough. Don't have more than one kind per person in the house at any one time. Finish or throw out what you've got before buying any other sweets or snacks (in our house, this was the Dad Rule). There's research showing that people eat more when there is a wider variety of foods to eat.

If it's not meal time or time to prepare a meal, no hanging around the kitchen. Seeing food makes you hungry, and it's easier to eat if it's convenient. Don't have a TV or chairs in the kitchen, to make it a less inviting place to hang out. There is one chair in our kitchen, and it's a cheap folding chair by the table where the cats get fed. If food is too conveniently accessible, you'll eat too much.

No food or caloric beverages can be kept anywhere other than the kitchen. You can take food to places outside the kitchen to eat it, but you can't keep any caches of food anywhere but the kitchen. No candy dishes or bowls of chips in the living room unless guests are here in the house, right now. My mom always had candy dishes around when I was growing up, and I learned some terrible habits from it. I learned that I could clear out a candy dish during a 1-hour TV show, even if it was filled with candy I didn't particularly like. Now that I'm grown up, my home is a candy-dish-free zone. If questioned, I tell people this is because the cats can't be trusted not to eat from or knock over a candy dish, but the truth is that their humans can't be trusted not to eat too much from it.

It's OK to taste food while cooking, with a teaspoon. The teaspoon goes in the sink with the dirty dishes immediately afterward, because it is now a dirty dish. Doing anything else with it is just nasty, as is sticking your fingers into the pot (ewww). If you need another taste, get another teaspoon. If you already know what something tastes like, it's snacking, not tasting.

All meals, with the exception of a few holiday meals with guests, are served buffet-style. You take your plate into the kitchen, put food on it, then bring it to the table. There are no serving platters of food on the table (we generally serve the food right out of the pots it was cooked in, except on really special occasions). You may not nibble on the food on the way to the table (it's ten feet, for God's sake), and no eating directly from the pots in the kitchen is allowed. People eat less when food is served this way, it's easier to serve yourself from a kitchen counter or island than to pass dishes around the table, and there are fewer dishes to wash. Win-win-win. I don't track these, since we've always served meals buffet style, and I never got into the habit of eating directly from pots.

It's OK to not clean your plate. Really. Eating food you don't want is more, not less, wasteful than throwing the food in the garbage. It really doesn't help the starving kids in Africa (or China, or wherever they were when you were growing up) if you eat more. They won't know how much you eat, and if they did, they wouldn't care.

"To use it up" or "It will go bad if I don't eat it now" is never a valid reason to snack or eat sweets, even on S days. It could be a valid reason to eat something as part of a single-plate meal, but it's not a good enough reason to eat between meals, or to eat a dessert.

Make an effort to cook things you really like and look forward to for meals on S days. S days aren't the time to use up leftovers, unless they are something you really enjoy and look forward to (Thanksgiving leftovers would fit in this category for many people). S days are for enjoying food, not simply for consuming more of it. You are not a garbage disposal. You are not the family pig who gets fed leftovers to get rid of them.

If you're ordering something in a restaurant that comes in more than one size, never order the largest size. The only exception is non-caloric beverages. If it's an S day and you're ordering a snack or dessert, always order a small. I know it costs more per ounce this way, but getting the most food for the least money is NOT the goal here. Eating a reasonable amount is. You enjoy the first few bites of any food the most, anyway.

You "get your money's worth" at buffets by enjoying the food and leaving without feeling unpleasantly stuffed. You do not get your money's worth by eating more than you should. Nonetheless, buffets should be a "less than once a week" thing, because it is so easy to overeat at them.

If you're eating pizza, don't eat more than one slice for breakfast or lunch, or two slices for dinner. Personal pizzas are not allowed, except for frozen french bread pizzas (and only one of those at a time). This is the Pizza rule, and applies on N days. I used to eat a whole pizza at CPK for dinner. Pizza is a food I can easily eat too much of, so I instated a special pizza rule.

[BrightAngel]

Healthy lifestyles are not just one of a kind;
they have to fit the individual.

I just posted a lengthy comment on my Daily Thread about Modifications.
Here's the link, if you are interested in reading it.
Go to Oct 21, 2010 which is...at this instant...the bottom of the page.

http://everydaysystems.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=3009&start=300
_________________
BrightAngel - http://www.diethobby.com
Height 5'0" - Sept 2004: 190 lbs - Jan 2013: 125 lbs

[Nicest of the Damned]

A new mod I'll be starting soon: the Nine Inch Mod (credit for this idea should go to Alex Bogusky, author of The Nine Inch "Diet"). I ordered some new 9" luncheon plates, and those will be my N-day plates, once they get here. At least for now, I'll keep using the old 10.5" plates for S days.

I started a salt mod in October, but just started tracking it. It means I use Mrs. Dash at the table instead of table salt, and use reduced-sodium soy sauce instead of regular (in cooking and at the table). This one applies whenever I'm eating at home.

[Frejya]

Hi there,

I'm just starting out with this system (which just makes so much sense!), but I do know of two mods I'm deciding on right from the get-go (though I don't know that I'd even count the first as a mod).

1) When cooking, tasting food as I go along is okay, so long as I'm not just mindlessly nibbling. Because honestly, tasting is an important element of cooking - otherwise, it's nearly impossible to properly adjust seasoning and spices and so on.

2) During outdoor biking season, I will allow myself snacks while bike riding - most of which will kind of be "sweets" too, by the nature of the beast - when I'm going more than an hour or so, or racing regardless of time. With the kind of riding I do (50, 60, 70, 80 miles at a time for just training sessions, and then 100 or more in a day for some events), this is pretty much essential. Convieniently, however, my longest training rides and events almost always fall on Saturdays and Sundays!

Other than that, I plan to pretty much just stick right with the basics. The fewer modifications I have, the more likely I am to really stick with it!

Thanks!

[poetgirl]

I have a question for all of you:
Would it still be No S if I decided to only eat two meals instead of three? I was considering cutting out lunch, and eating my dinner around 7pm. This would be my mod for No S. Would this hurt my metabolism, if I eat a big enough breakfast? Any replies would help!

April

[Spudd]

I don't think anyone can tell you if it would hurt your metabolism. But it might hurt your mental health. Wouldn't you get really hungry between breakfast and 7pm? I know I would. I'd spend the whole day wanting to chew off my own arm. I certainly couldn't keep that up as a regular habit.

[poetgirl]

I tried it yesterday and it didn't work that well. I might try it again just to make sure, or just stick to plain Vanilla S. You're actually right, the hunger was a big problem for me, but I'd like to work around that.

[Nicest of the Damned]

[poetgirl]

I think you're probably right. I haven't been doing No S for that long, and I wouldn't even know what to moderate. Besides, I've discovered that I really appreciate the structure of three meals a day, as opposed to the screwed up way I was dancing around meal times before. That's what caused me to yo-yo my eating to begin with!!

Anyways, thank you guys. Your comments are always very helpful.

April

[Shimmer86]

I modify the diet by having lunch split up into 2 "mini meals". And I allow myself one "dessert" a day (ie. cookies, ice cream, etc)...but i also allow myself to have sweet foods such as sugary cereal for breakfast, craisins, or hot chocolate (the lower calorie kind).

[Nicest of the Damned]

[Shimmer86]

It's not adult breakfast cereal, it's lucky charms. lol. And in the book it said that if anything tastes really sweet then it is a sweet.

[Sharpie]

Very interesting to see what people have/are doing to modify the basis to fit their individual needs. The plates I happen to use, and have been using for years are already just 9" across, so I think I'm good there! I can see the strong temptation to start making adjustments way too soon as well... but maybe I'll count my plates as just a status quo for me rather than a mod, so I'm still kosher with Vanilla No S.
_________________
"If you only do what you know you can do, you never do very much.” -Tom Krause

[Blithe Morning]

As I go into the new year, I'm adding a mod. Instead of S days, I'm doing 5 S events a week. This allows a little more flexibility in my plan. I think five may actually be a little high, but it's about what I would have on a weekend. On plain vanilla No S Wednesday nights were always tough because I was ready for a small sweet by then. And I never really did get over the Wild S Days.

The trick will be to track them properly.

[Nicest of the Damned]

[wosnes]

[Samurai Redux]

I'm curious as to how many who have added mods that allow for exceptions, e.g. sweets on No S days, unlimited portions, extra meals, have lost weight and kept it off? In other words have you had more or less success with weight loss after having added your mods for exceptions?
_________________
One should not be envious of someone who has prospered by unjust deeds. Nor should he disdain someone who has fallen while adhering to the path of righteousness. - Imagawa Sadayo (1325-1420)

[wosnes]

I allow myself one S daily, but that doesn't mean I take one daily. It's an option. It's really about the same number of S's as when I kept them to weekends and other special days -- just spread out over the course of the week. I've noticed no difference in my weight. I do watch the portions, though.
_________________
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

[Blithe Morning]

So far, changing S days to a set number of "S opportunities" throughout the week has worked pretty well. Yesterday, the director came in with sweets from the local candy store that makes knee buckingly good candy. She gave me TWO truffles! This being Tuesday I had all 5 S opportunities available to me and decided yes, it was worth it. So I ate one truffle, because two of those truffles is too much. The other one is sitting in my desk drawer.

Now I have 4 S opportunities left for this week.

I decided to eschew the donuts the same director brought in for her birthday today because they aren't THAT good.

Since I've pretty much decided to give up snacking, that just leaves me seconds and sweets. Since the habit is pretty firm in me, I feel funny eating seconds during week. I still try to reserve them for the weekend but no longer count it a fail if I don't.

[rodmitch]

I'm sort of surprised I couldn't find this idea searching the forum and especially in this thread. I've been thinking about the idea of a "one bite" exemption on No-S days.

I was scooping some ice cream for one of our kids—I usually skip dessert on No-S days—but I had a bite. One little lump of rocky road.

I was transferring some bulk nuts into a storage container—the nuts are mostly snacks for our kids (and me on S days)—but I had a few, maybe 5 or 6 nuts: one bite.

Someone brought some little muffins in to the office today. Small but super sweet. I usually just pass on these work treats but since I've been thinking about the one-bite exemption I figured I'd try it. One bite—about half a mini-muffin (the top-half, of course!). Nice little treat!

This obviously needs a limit—you can't just have one bite after another—so how about "one bite until the next meal"? Seems like a reasonable, non-abusive mod to me. Not a snack. Not a 100-calorie pack. One bite.

[hootski]

I'm only on Day 2 of the No S Diet, but I can already see I need to apply a mod as others have: Friday night is an S-evening. As I was going about my day I couldn't stop thinking about how challenging tonight was going to be considering it's usually the night we start enjoying some snacks later in the evening. Would I really be able to resist? If I lived alone, yes...but I don't!

I think not applying this mod would be a recipe for failure, then guilt, then wanting to disappear from the forum. That's not what I want.

Sundays are not a big snack/treat day for us, and since I don't really need to lose weight, I think it will work fabulously overall.
_________________
Heidi

Height: 5'7"
Weight: 120.6
I'm a veganesque type girl who tries to follow the Nutritarian lifestyle for the sake of good health and energy. One can only be so good for so long, that's why the No-S-Diet is perfect!

[hecarte]

I'm very new too to No S, but I'm thinking this week that I will start my S days on a Friday evening and carry it through to Sunday lunchtime.

I have also decided to add in an afternoon 'snack' at about 4pm only on days when I am at work or university. The snack will be either fresh fruit, nuts or peanut butter/grape syrup or tahini/grape syrup on wholegrain crisp bread.

[Nicest of the Damned]

[Nicest of the Damned]

The 30 Minute Rule: After one eating event, at least 30 minutes must pass before you can have anything else to eat. An "eating event" is a meal, or a snack on an S day. Desserts on an S day are part of a meal, not a separate eating event. Also known as the "you just ate, you don't need to be eating again" rule.

The idea is that your stomach takes 20 minutes to register being full, so let it decide if it's full before eating anything else. It's 30 instead of 20 just because half an hour is a neater increment of time.

[reinhard]

No Solitary Snacking -- even on S-days

I'm experimenting with this one right now. Not so much to get more "results" (I'm happy where I am now) but because I don't actually enjoy this kind of eating and it's all too easy to fall into if you have permission.

I also think it might be very helpful for others here, so I'm curious how onerous it proves to be. So far, pretty easy. I'm on vacation now, so plenty of S-days to test it out on.

Pros: You're not giving up something you really enjoy -- you're giving up a nervous tick. It's some extra effort, but no real deprivation. It avoids all social awkwardness. If someone invites you to snack on an S-day, you can graciously oblige. No "hey, I thought you were allowed to have snacks on S-days!" You have a mechanism to resist those solitary binges that seem to give so many (especially new) no-essers a hard time. If worse comes to worst, I'm sure there's someone you can convince to snack with you -- but I doubt you'll want to go this far most times (too embarrassing).

Cons: it is an extra rule, and a rule on "rule free" days at that. It might be very worth it, but it still is at least a bit of a con.

Reinhard

[bjalda]

I think that that's a great idea, I also thought of it when I found myself kind of miserable lying alone on the bed, having only ice cream for company.
But it might be too early for me to implement it now.. I am only 6-7 weeks or so into the Vanilla S system, and it hasn't been entirely green yet.
_________________
I always wonder why birds stay in the same place when they can fly anywhere on the earth.
Then I ask myself the same question.
- Harun Yahya

[SpiritSong]

I think it sounds like a great idea too. I don't think this would change too much for me since my snacking on Friday (my Saturday) is with my co-workers (Breakfast Day), and my snacking on Sunday is generally done with my husband.

I would have to see how I feel if DH is out on a Sunday, which means I am both home alone and not allowed to snack. It could lead to additional (distracting) walking workouts!

[Nicest of the Damned]

[reinhard]

Yes, Nicest, I just re-read your description of these mods on the last page and it's very similar. Maybe I'll do a write up describing this whole "family" of mods.

So far (a week in) I'm really surprised at how much unsatisfying crap eating this has cut out and how easy it's been to comply with.

This is the first "mod" (besides intelligent dietary defaults, which aren't really mods) I think I might take up myself.

Reinhard

[bjalda]

I decided to stick with the No Solitary Snacking mod for a little while.. and now I have got a question: Do you still have the sweets and seconds "freedom" on S days or do you actually follow the N-Day rules unless there is someone to enjoy sweets, seconds and snacks with you?
_________________
I always wonder why birds stay in the same place when they can fly anywhere on the earth.
Then I ask myself the same question.
- Harun Yahya

[reinhard]

Hi bjalda,

The only S which requires company (according to this mod) is snacking.

So if I have a solo S-day meal (a hypothetical scenario with my omnipresent attention-demanding children) I can have seconds and sweets.

I'm finding it's getting easier and is actually sort of soothing. No more decisions about whether or not to take a bite of this or that.

Reinhad

[NoelFigart]

[Sixty]

[reinhard]

Yes, that's how it would work.

Cookie with meal (as dessert) -- no audience required.

Cookie between meals (as snack) -- gotta have a partner/witness.

Note that it doesn't STOP you from having that cookie. Just from unthinkingly wolfing it and a dozen more down. It's a speed bump that cuts down on automatic eating that isn't really all that pleasurable anyway.

What defines a partner/witness? Some kind of communication/invitation that a snack is happening. For me, it usually works in reverse: my daughters want a snack and I will join them. The fact that I'm in Dad-mode as well as in public is an additional bolster to virtue.

Since this is "bonus" on top of what I'm doing for vanilla no-s, I don't worry about too great precision. But so far I haven't had to do a whole lot of head scratching. And I won't give myself a habitcal red if I screw up (though I have been noting the couple of times so far I stretched things in evernote).

Reinhard

[Sixty]

[reinhard]

[Sixty]

[bjalda]

Oh.. I am also looking forward to it! Interesting mod, I really like the "philosophy" behind it.

[reinhard]

sorry for the delay, the audio quality was dreadful, even by my low standards. I'll rerecord and post shortly.

[reinhard]

That was a long "shortly," but here it is:

http://everydaysystems.com/podcast/episode.php?id=40

[Hiram]

I follow the No S diet religiously, but with one addition (and a very pleasant one it is). There's a diet called the Chrono diet, that was developed by French medical doctor Delabos. It's ridiculously complicated, and I wouldn't even mention it but for this one terrific aspect: the 4 pm "goûter", a (shudder! run and hide!) snack that can consist of unsalted nuts, dried fruit, two glasses of unsweetened fruit juice or... 30 grams of dark chocolate. This helps to not overeat at dinner. I find I put less and less on that one plate I can have since eating the 4 pm "goûter". Also, chocolate, it appears, is really a health food, containing more anti-oxidants than oranges and kiwifruits, and lots of other good stuff besides. I choose 82 percent cocoa organic chocolate, fair trade preferably; if the sugar content is higher than a few percent, the "goûter" will of course defeat the purpose.

[totljenn]

I have definitely modified the No-S-Diet. I had to because my stomach can't handle a lot of food in the morning. I have something protein hardy in the morning, like oatmeal or a protein shake, that lasts me about an hour then I have fruit, if I'm still hungry I will have some cottage cheese or greek yogurt. Lunch is when I allow for lots of carbs or bad decisions, i.e. burger and a salad or a big burrito. Usually if I eat a rich lunch then I am good until dinner but if I'm not I reach for fruit and cottage cheese or greek yogurt. I will also a have a cup of green tea at several points in the day as a type of appetite suppressant and an energy boost that forces me to do other things than ruminate on food. Dinner I try to have meat and veggies, low to now carbs and because of my work schedule I usually eat around 8pm and that way I wont snack late at night. Late night snacking is a huge weakness for me! I do have a couple glasses of wine in the evening so that takes care of my sugar cravings too. If I have to snack late I make it fruit or cottage cheese or greek yogurt...do you see a pattern here? I found a snack that works for me and has only the neccessary ingredients to keep me moving. I modeled this modified approach from this EXTREME diet I found online where your big reward was a sweet potato once a week, how crazy is that? Anyhow I hope these qualify as modifications and No-S'ing!!!

[Rachelocity]

I was reminiscing about *stuff my mom said* and one of her (many) schtick was to offer us kids fruit or carrots if we said we wanted a snack. If we declined, hoping for something that the magical tree-dwelling elves had made, she'd say "If you were really hungry, you'd take the fruit". So I am tweaking my plan to include fruit or veggies as the only okay snacks on N-Days. This way, if I get hungry as I am making dinner, I can nosh on some red pepper strips and just put less into the stirfry.

My rationale: I was so gung ho on No Snacking that I was over-thinking the rule and it started feeling like restricting behaviour. This is antithetical to what I plan to accomplish with the No-S P&P.

And that's my other mod: I am calling this a Policy and Procedure and ditching the D-word for ever and ever, amen! Yup, diets and I are officially divorced and I am committing to Best Practice Eating (Which for me is No S)
_________________
Everything in moderation, including moderation: Julia Child

[Alonso]

Yes, its interesting topic! By the way, I found some info on this subject here: http://youcure.me/blog/3873[/url]

[humbotsconnie]

I am new to the No S diet, but it sounds great! I only started Friday but I have made two mods, I like numbers so I did some calculations and this is what I got.

Mod 1 : on the weekdays each meal I try not to eat more then 650 calorie
Mod 2 : on S days try not to eat more then 2700 calories

Why: Each pound of fat is 3,500
My body needs 2,750 calories each day so I don't gain weight or lose weight (10 times my body weight)
if I can cut my daily 3500 calories out of my week (mon-fri) that = 650 calorie per meals.

I know the point of the diet is not to count calories and I'm really not it is more of a guild lines for me. I don't really count more the just consider, example, I can fit 2 slices of pizza (800 cal) on a plate or I can fit one slice and 6 chicken wings (675 cal) I will go for the second. If I have not idea, I will go for what I want more. Like I said guild lines.

I have a lot of weight to lose so wish me luck

[HoeHanna]

Rachelocity: I Like the P&P diet word does play with my head, too many expectation, etc.... I also
Humbotsconnie: Good luck, I have a lot to lose also and try to keep the meals to a maximum of around 500 calories. You're right on the math and this is what I have to do. I don't really count calories much just so many years of dieting that I know what's what. No excuses, that's my personal new mantra.
_________________
Start Date 01/14/13
Beginning Weight 230
Height 5' 6"
Age 59
Let's hope there's hope for the hopeless.

[Jibaholic]

I read through the whole thread - pretty interesting stuff.

I like Reinhard's No Solitary Snacking mod.

It's interesting that many mods create a slippery slope towards getting off No-S. One of the things about creating habits is that they rely on "bright clear lines" between what is permitted and what is forbidden. Many mods make those lines fuzzy.

Here's my mod.

FOF - fast on Fridays. I'll start with an 18 hour fast, skipping breakfast. I'd love to eventually get up to a 24 hour fast, going from dinner on Thursday to dinner on Friday. I've read the intermittent fasting websites and I think that fasting on a regular basis has good health and spiritual benefits. But for now, I'm sticking to vanilla No-S.

[Shortformyweight]

Today is the start of week 2 on No S. I have one modification and one modification only, and that is when I get a craving for something sweet, I have been chewing a piece of sugar free gum instead. I hate chewing gum, but it prevents me from going to the receptionists desk where there is always a bowl of mini-candy bars. So far, so good.