Everyday Systems

oolala53

One thing I want to start is a little box of "wins" written on index cards, something Judith Beck recommends. It's akin to habitcal, but less simple. She says to periodically take the box out an reread of little successes. I think your month of green might qualify. I guess if you had it on habitcal,...

oolala53

It's amazing how easy it can be to convince ourselves that we need food to kill time. You showed a lot of insight!

oolala53

When you get really really sick of how it feels to overdo it on S days, it will get easier. Not easy, just easier. At least, that's how it was for me. I would sit there pretty much gritting my teeth while the hours passed on S days without eating until meals. I wasn't hungry, but still wanted to eat...

oolala53

I want to congratulate you not only on the upcoming wedding but also on not sounding like you are trying to get into some teeny wedding dress! Nearly always backfires. Weight gain afterwards and long term mourning over not looking like that anymore. Bah!

oolala53

I started with 4 minute tabatas last fall. I'm up to 14 minutes of something darn vigorous most N days, sometimes 10 minutes.

Keep swinging away.

oolala53

After all this time, I STILL often get an urge to eat in the afternoon, even now that my time with students at school ends just before lunch. But I realized the other day that I have broken the habit of driving from our school parking lot into the lot of the Ralphs supermarket across the street to s...

oolala53

Happy Birthday! You've lived longer than Prince! And he was damn skinny his whole life.

Congrats on your amazing strength results.

"I'm committed to keeping to No S until then. No crazy diets, just the 3 rules." I (that's with a double capital) will hold you to that.

oolala53

Fasting can go either way. It can lead to gluttony or moderation, depending on the faster. If a person believes that s/he is entitled to gluttony because of deprivation or an unwillingness to face down the almost inevitable urges to overeat, fasting will likely backfire. If the faster is honest that...

oolala53

OH, I remember Costco pizza! And Caesar's, too. Gawd, I love pizza dough, even cheap dough. Just less often now.

oolala53

I wish sitting and being online was as healthy as moderate exercise.

oolala53

Don't know what your experience was, besides that you did lose weight, the first time around, but you sound about on track, slips and all.

oolala53

The only advice is to do it to the letter as strongly as you can. If it's relatively easy, just go with that, and plunge yourself into other areas of your life. Let it become just part of the flow of your life. If it isn't, read threads here, especially the sticky on why people left and came back, a...

oolala53

I know there is a correlation between not eating breakfast and night eating, but I've found that, too, is just a habit, meaning the link is very breakable, especially when I am sure to eat enjoyable lunches and dinners and really savor them. AND now that I"m convinced that the overnight fast has suc...

oolala53

While I actually don't believe in making myself feel bad for ANY of my eating, I do find that no matter what I weigh, if I keep to my meals, when my head hits the pillow at night, I know I've been reasonable. I can't really ask for much more than that.

oolala53

Okay for future reference, this is going to sound like it's splitting hairs, but a few extra hours can do a lot of damage. Theoretically, S days go from Saturday morning to Sunday night, which is about 36 hours, not 48, as many seem to assume. If you start your S days on Friday night, consider break...

oolala53

I am so glad you're here! You can avoid so much misery if you commit to this lifestyle. Try very hard not to be swayed by the crazy things other teens (and later college students) will do not only overdoing food but dieting. Believe me, there are so many women twenty, thirty or more years later sorr...

oolala53

Hear, hear. Plus, can you see now that you were magnifying how much you sere going to miss all those things, and imagining YEARS of deprivation but all iw just a few moments? Of course it would make just a few hours of not eating seem torturous. Research shows that overeaters at tough moments often ...

oolala53

Hear, hear. Plus, can you see now that you were magnifying how much you sere going to miss all those things, and imagining YEARS of deprivation but all iw just a few moments? Of course it would make just a few hours of not eating seem torturous. Research shows that overeaters at tough moments often ...

oolala53

A little confused here. Hard won S days?

oolala53

mistake

oolala53

We can keep SpiritSong's thread "Why did you leave? Why are you back?relatively high up with bumps. De facto sticky. The advice for specific S problems is another issue. Bstated minds than mine can deal with that.

oolala53

Excellent! I admit I am still dependent on being able to think about and share about this topic. I admire anyone who can just eat and go on with the rest of her/his life.

oolala53

I don't have the experience of having wandered afar (just a lot of failures at times, but I was always trying) but what I will say that after all these years I have finally gotten it that the feeling I get from eating lightly/moderately is one I cannot get any other way! Even now, little thoughts wi...

oolala53

I so rarely remember to come here. I know i've had relatively good compliance.

But today for sure, I did my 14 minutes.

oolala53

I know! We can bump it up periodically for a de facto sticky effect.

oolala53

You did cross the line and found out pretty quick you don't like it! I really think it's now or later! I guess I believe regret is actually pretty useful. Nearly everyone here long term goes through the experience of pushing the envelope, and making new, committed refinements. From a reformed S day ...

oolala53

What's interesting is that Atkins isn't complicated. But I guess what makes it become complicated is how much people have to do to exploit the limited food choices and the mental energy to keep justifying it. I hope newbies reading this might think, "Oh, I can see why only one person stuck totally t...

oolala53

From an email by Brad Pilon (aack! the competition) without his sales pitch. " In a study published in the International Journal of Obesity titled "Dietary adherence and weight loss success among overweight women: results from the A to Z weight loss study" researchers re-examined the A to Z weight l...

oolala53

Well, that should make no snacking easy...

oolala53

Yes! I call it practicing meal gaps. Get from one gap to the next. Repeat 1,000 times. Then keep going.

oolala53

This is exactly the process of changing appetite as opposed to consistently enforcing specific limits. In a way, overeating in the beginning is not throwing us off because it allows a kind of learning that is very hard to get any other way. Making a decision to rein yourself in because you just real...

oolala53

Though the researchers keep saying that the data show that intermittent fasters don't overcompensate, they also caution that those with an eating disorder not use the tactic. It certainly seems that there could be similarities to the restrict/binge cycle. I waited until I felt I had exhausted more m...

oolala53

Good job narrowing down the hazards.

Just imagine some svelte relaxed cheerful French woman eating her children's leftovers... no, no, it's just not done!

We're on your side!

oolala53

Try not to panic. Panic isn't conducive to as rational approach as No S or any successful program. What do you fail with most? How about taking a few days to concentrate on that one only? Or possibly the whole week? Small compliance can build momentum in a way that continual failure at something big...

oolala53

I was just going to give a few details even before I saw your post! Ok, what I've generally been aiming at as a minimum is to do two 16-hour fasts, from dinner to the next day, about every third day. I thought I would work my way up to 24-hour fasts, dinner to dinner. I actually did one one day just...

oolala53

Glad you have some good feelings about where your mom is going to live. Who determines the servings on the plate at the facility? If they serve you, would they let you use a container to put some of the food in before you start eating so you feel it's the amount YOU want? As Wansink says, if you see...

oolala53

How'd you do?

oolala53

Sounds good. Since we don't live in a culture that supports moderation, it helps to have our tribe.

oolala53

How will you know if you are physically hungry? What if you are physically hungry only once a day? Dr. James B. Johnson estimates that only about 10% of people can just eat when they are hungry, stop when full, and maintain a slim weight. This matches the data on world stats. Even in countries where...

oolala53

Merry, how are you feeling about this after a few months of No S? Is it not so much of an issue? There's no obligation to eat just because we can on S days. The motivation NOT to feel nagged by desire on N days is a perfectly valid one, IMHO, to take SOMETIMES very seriously.

oolala53

I read it close to the time it came out, but it had to cook in there with the stew of all the other stuff. Sweets were my big issue, and for all the warnings, only No S helped me put a dent in them.

I had some last night at a gathering. They were dope!

oolala53

OMGosh, it's been so long since I had a sweetened cereal, I forgot about them!

oolala53

I like extinction burst much better than sabotage. Sabotage sounds so sinister.

oolala53

Forgot to tell my story. Found No S (wish I could remember how) in fall of 2008. Had a perfect week before Thanksgiving week. Shot to hell until the next AUGUST during which I was away at a seminar where they fed us three times a day. Fell apart again until Dec. 26, 2009. Had dalliances,mostly imagi...

oolala53

And thanks for ascribing me the maxim about No S just being easier than everything else. Hard won insight.

But ultimately galvanizing.

oolala53

LOVE. THIS. THREAD. I haven't read all the posts, but I think I suggested awhile back that there be a thread like this, and that it should be considered for a sticky, even though we already have a lot of them. I know I've seen this happen SO many times in my six years here. Having them all together ...

oolala53

“Conditioning can happen quickly. In one study, people were given a high-sugar, high-fat snack for five consecutive mornings. For days afterward, they wanted something sweet at about the same time each morning that they had been fed the snack, even though they had not previously snacked at that time...

oolala53

Wow, I'd heard that our US export (maybe Britain's, too) of permasnacking and big meals had made an inroad in France, but I didn't realize it was that fast. Although, the obesity rate has risen only 4% since I read about it. Still, at that rate... I hate to sound mean, because I support the theory o...

oolala53

Good luck for a nice, green Friday!

oolala53

A meal is whatever you put on your plate. I've fallen victim at times to letting myself graze a bit at dinner rather than putting all the grazey things on a plate at once. I've also actually followed through and plated them, and dang if it isn't more satisfying, even if it isn't a normal meal! But i...

oolala53

S*&t, howdy, that's impressive. It sounds as likely for me as my becoming an astronaut. It's a good thing I don't want to be an astronaut! but I have thought of hanging a bar I could hang from on my deck. Hmmm.

oolala53

That is an EXCELLENT lesson a week into it. It can take a LOT longer to get that we don't HAVE to finish all the food on the plate. Try six years in my case! (But I'm actually rarely still sorry four hours later.) If your work plates are anything like ours, they're pretty small. I would have stacked...

oolala53

Hope it's okay to say this. I know I can't change my past, but a part of me wishes I had been able to get on board more in my 40's at least in terms of eating better quality food, if not a lot less. Turns out that many of the conditions in the brain that lead to the development of dementia in later ...

oolala53

Have to admit that though I know there is no use in regretting the past, sometimes a thought floats up that I wish I had been less relaxed with my S day sugar-eating earlier on. But, I wasn't the same person then.

oolala53

If you can't do all 14 minutes at once, maybe 5*5*4 minutes done between every two papers read?

'd be nice if I followed my own suggestions. ..

oolala53

Congrats! I, too, was at least a semi-binger, but it was more like nearly every day, from after work until I went to bed. I had wild S days a LONG time, but couldn't blame it on No S. I'm still working on how to fill my time. NO eating plan takes care of that, I don't think. Enjoy the new "relations...

oolala53

It's a mod for sure; I'm doing a little, too.

oolala53

I think weight loss in and of itself is a notoriously UNsuccessful goal. There's almost always something else we have to want more to put up with all the little annoyances along the way. The body doesn't care when it wants what it wants. Feeling we can eat more joyfully at the next meal IS one of th...

oolala53

Probably not.

oolala53

Hey, I have an old friend, a guy, who lives alone and I swear, he slurps his coffee soooo loudly, I think he's trying to make sound effects for a cartoon! But he doesn't seem to realize it. He's an adult! But he does chew with his mouth closed. I had a female roommate once who made this kind of suck...

oolala53

I feel almost like a traitor talking here about IF but it is my new mod and I am obsessed with it. I am vacillating about what system to use, but I don't feel I have to be too strict yet because I don't feel I am just bombing out on it for convenience. I fear committing to anything with calorie limi...

oolala53

Clower's book i read before No S. Published in 2003, but I'm not sure when I saw it. Stumbled on it at the library. I'm surprised it has as many reviews as it does on Amazon, but I appreciated the influence, though I'm more cautious about some of it now. The French don't have particularly low incide...

oolala53

Cedar, you are too kind.

oolala53

As soon as someone follows my advice, I get nervous! But it may help you avoid "premature optimization."

oolala53

Statistically, it takes two years or more for most serious weight losers to truly work out the kinks in eating regimes. This doesn't mean it's a grind every day. They often go through long periods of ease. I chalk it up to the fact that we just live in a situation that few humans have had to deal wi...

oolala53

Not surprised at all, Imogen. It's a complete myth that ad libitum eating (hope I'm using that correctly) works out well for the majority of humans. I challenge the IE community to find a whole culture that does it without health fallout. It's good only for the exceptions and those with little acces...

oolala53

Great to read your updates. Please remind me where you and clarinetgal hail from. SoCal is enjoying some welcome wetness. At least I welcome it.

oolala53

Humans are primed to be able to eat when there is opportunity. There are individual exceptions, but they are just that: exceptions. Reinhard pointed out that only scarcity or culture has ever successfully kept the majority from NOT overdoing it. Not sure what you meant by the vice. You are just payi...

oolala53

Though splitting meals and other mods may work in the long run, there are advantages to having longer gaps between eating events, shall we call them. I'd advocate for calling something a split meal rather than a snack and a meal. A subtle difference, but encourages the concept of thinking of all the...

oolala53

Hope it's not discouraging to know that food can call at unhelpful times even years in. I'm positive it has to do with stuff not related to No S, meaning for me, at least, this would be an issue almost no matter what I ate, though some of the LCHF people claim otherwise. Yet, stats show most low car...

oolala53

My mentors for French ideas were William Clower and Anne Barone (who unfortunately to me was a real fat shamer, but her other ideas were very helpful). But I have had other influences since then.

oolala53

Here's to many more streaks.

oolala53

Since I doubt you ate 45,500 calories less than you burned this week (13 pounds), I think it's safe to say a lot of the loss was water, but it still feels good not to be carrying it! And knowing that you ate so that your body didn't need to keep all that water and some fat, too. SOMETIMES has always...

oolala53

Glad to know you feel the night eating is getting conquered. I can imagine being frustrated with feeling like the modest eating you're doing, probably so much better than previous habits, isn't making a dent in your weight. It can be shocking just how few calories, whether you count them or not, a p...

oolala53

Are you finding you aren't doing your 14 minutes or are you actually managing it even if not at the same time?

oolala53

TX for reminding me about SET rules. Glad you are happy with recent changes at home.

oolala53

If people eat fewer calories than they need, they burn fat, right? Does that constitute being in ketosis? Doesn't it mean people go in and out of ketosis when they eat less than their body needs? I'm just asking out of curiosity, if anybody knows. Nothing to do with the sleep issue. I've had sleep p...

oolala53

Welcome home. I think people who've had some failure or relapse may be even more likely to make it stick. I know for myself I could not imagine complying with anything else. Not feeling you have options can focus the effort pretty successfully! Though as years have gone by, I've been able to make ad...

oolala53

A wise decision, IMHO. I think often of a little story I read about a French woman visiting in America listening to women at a party talking about baking. The French woman said, "Why so much talking about making cakes? That's what the patisserie is for." The author also said at that time that cake w...

oolala53

I think if you can't divorce yourself from feeling bad about the scale dropping WITHOUT its actually making you get back in line, don't weigh. I personally have rarely been motivated to eat less just because my weight was up. It was more how uncomfortable I felt from eating too much and feeling impr...

oolala53

You fit your name, Merry! I've noticed that the secretary in our department office has a nice way of giggling over some of the problems that come up whereas my first reaction is to sneer. I'm going to try it out- when I remember. I keep saying there are things MUCH harder than managing eating! This ...

oolala53

Hump day over!

oolala53

Feel the pat on your back? Two more days until S days.

oolala53

Sigh of relief for you!

oolala53

Yahoo!

oolala53

I must have dead tastebuds. I really can't taste that much difference between types of beans. Maybe I notice texture a little. Of course, garbanzos are different. Maybe I'm lucky, though, as I like them all.

oolala53

Yeah, I know that one. Dealing with less-than-pleasing meals is also part of the learning curve. Thankfully, there's always a possibly nice one a few hours away.

oolala53

MAYBE you have a compulsive personality, but honestly, I'd say it's useful to think so ONLY if it actually makes you more determined to overcome it. Thinking it COULD just be the strong habit trying to protect access to the "drugs!" Strong habits are neural patterns that can actually affect what we ...

oolala53

A week or even several weeks is not actually enough time to work the program and know if it will really pay off. Please try to pretend at least that you can't try anything else for a year! Free for alls on weekends aren't proof that N days aren't working. Have faith!

oolala53

Do they know if the medication actually makes it harder to lose fat or easier to retain water? Fewer carbs lets water go more easily.

Do you get hungry between meals?

oolala53

Fence around the law.

oolala53

It will be acknowledging those delightful benefits (waking up feeling good) that will help seal the habit. And from eating delicious meals!

oolala53

Time to get the list out of the drawer? We have so little experience of being able to face down the urges to habits that have left us uncomfortable over and over. The brain pattern still provides the desire despite all the following misery. It really thinks it's protecting you from future starvation...

oolala53

Great update. I'm backwards to you on exercise. I have a roll around cart for work or I might park farther from school and walk. Still can't seem to get it in though I have time and mostly fab weather. Human. I had a health concern come up in Jan. and elected to make some changes to my plates and me...

oolala53

I was hoping this June, but it looks like June 2017 will be it. I can't wrap my mind around longer than that, even though I'll be getting only about 40-sumpin'% of my pay. I think I'll just have to take my chances. The stats aren't very promising, and I actually do often go for that, as I did with N...

oolala53

I have to accept that you are really hungry at night before bed. I haven't been truly hungry after dinner for years, but some people are! But saying that you sound sad over it sure sounds a little like... addiction or just plain ol' strong habit. That's the brain pattern doing its thing to try to ge...

oolala53

Thanks for coming on and telling us. You are part of the tribe now, whether you post again or not.

oolala53

Glad your surgery and days out and about went well. Enjoy the farm.

oolala53

My family always used white beans with ham. I wouldn't think it would make a difference which bean got paired. Yum!

Guess you have to add the cheese at the end to the adults' bowls.

oolala53

So close! And so fun getting here.

Everyday Systems

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KISS

another rationale for sweets on fewer occasions

another rational for sweets on fewer occasions