"Obesogenic Environments"

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eschano
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"Obesogenic Environments"

Post by eschano » Thu May 29, 2014 11:31 am

I thought that was interesting: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-magazin ... r-27601593

Especially, as many people here reported being shocked by the snacking-environment we live in, in offices, during the commute if it's public transport and at home.
eschano - Vanilla rocks!

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samosaurus
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Post by samosaurus » Thu May 29, 2014 5:52 pm

It's tough not to snack when it's EVERYWHERE. We have a candy bowl at work - during the past few days, I've had a lot of red days, and it's exclusively at that candy bowl! It's too easy when all you need to do is walk by lol.
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Thu May 29, 2014 7:09 pm

Brian Wansink reports that the average person actually has 200 food cues a day. This can mean 200 decisions a day. Reinhard and others would say that is very expensive in the use of willpower. Committing to three meals no matter what will help a person avoid a lot of those decisions. Judith Beck recommends even making a notecard that says No Choice on it that you take out and read periodically to remind yourself that you just don't give yourself a choice between meals to eat. If you don't have control over the environment, you can still use your prefrontal cortex (per Kelly McGonigal).

I used to buy all kinds of cookies and candy at a 99cent store. I routinely go to that same store and even walk down those same aisles rarely buying any of that stuff anymore. I do sometimes have other fails, but not that one, and it's still almost a miracle to me.

But it still makes sense to me to have some public policies to support making the choices easier.
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automatedeating
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Post by automatedeating » Fri May 30, 2014 2:18 am

Love that saying: No Choice. I think my personal brain refrain is, Snacking is not an option.
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8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
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wosnes
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Post by wosnes » Fri May 30, 2014 8:26 am

I think all of the U.S. is obesogenic. There are very few times or places where eating isn't allowed, if not encouraged.

It's not only junk food. Over the last 40 years or so our portions have increased in size and along with that the number of calories consumed daily. If you eat out it's easy to consume a day's worth of calories at one meal. Many of those high-calorie meals appear to be healthy choices. If you add dessert to that it's possible to add another day's worth of calories.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

eschano
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Post by eschano » Fri May 30, 2014 9:09 am

So true wosnes. When I first went to the US and eventually came to the UK (which is equal in its portions) I put on 10kilos just from that. And even now when my friends visit from Austria they are often disgusted by the portions.


I completely agree oolala that a person still has a choice but I think the environment still makes for an easier or harder way. I gave up smoking when I lived in the US because you guys had made it so difficult to find a place to smoke (landlord didn't allow it, you can't even smoke outside in a restaurant and so on). I don't think it would have been that easy for me. I have not only not touched a cigarette since (about 6 years ago) but have zero cravings now (lucky me). All my Austrian friends keep quitting and getting back to it because with two exceptions EVERYONE I know in Austria smokes. (Mental right? In 2014 - we still have endemic smoking in Austria).

So I think, yes, absolutely, in the end it comes down to the individual (I mean, I haven't snacked at work for 1 1/2 years and I sit right next to my boss who eats 7+ cookies a day and keeps bringing in special treats for everyone) but also we can do a lot to make it easier for people. And especially children and (don't kill me for this) less-educated people can be so highly influenced by their environment and advertisement that I think we have a responsibility to society to make it easier to be healthy.
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Dale
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Post by Dale » Sat May 31, 2014 7:57 am

I've wondered if some of my weight gain was partly due to living near a chocolate factory. Sometimes I would just be smelling chocolate all day, whatever I was doing. I didn't actually eat much chocolate, but I was constantly being reminded of food.

wosnes
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Post by wosnes » Sat May 31, 2014 11:02 pm

Dale wrote:I've wondered if some of my weight gain was partly due to living near a chocolate factory. Sometimes I would just be smelling chocolate all day, whatever I was doing. I didn't actually eat much chocolate, but I was constantly being reminded of food.
I used to live near a Burger King, Arby's and Long John Silver's. The first thing I would smell in the morning was Burger King's coffee. That was fine. Then the French toast sticks and other breakfast items. Those nauseated me. So I was reminded of food, but not in a positive way.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sat May 31, 2014 11:32 pm

I actually agree with you, eschano, that the environment makes a huge difference. For years, because of the intuitive eating recommendations, I kept all kinds of sweets around and chose them often, too. It was really too much for me to deal with. It's so obvious to me now that overeating so frequently follows easy access to food. If you look at world stats, it becomes very obvious that there is nothing "normal" about not overeating in the presence of food. It is the exception for humans. All over the world, as countries get access to food, their populations grow heavier. Cultural opinion about what is acceptable/desirable seems to be the deciding factor when food is plentiful.

It's ridiculous how much food is portioned out in low and middlin' cost restaurants. I bought a pork chile verde plate for lunch today. I wasn't very hungry, so maybe today isn't the best example, but still: there were 5 corn tortillas included with the meal! I asked for no rice, so they gave me extra beans, which is nice, but there is still enough dense food left for 2-3 meals, supplemented with freggies, for me. I may not be typical but it is certainly NOT typical for a person to need that much food at one meal. But that's business. I'm sure they make more money on it than cutting it in half and charging less. Until customers change their buying habits, business will likely go on as usual.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
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1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:30 am

So, Dale, do you mean since you were reminded of food all day, you snacked a lot? Because I don't think you can gain weight from aromas. :)

However, research has shown that the obesity rate at schools close to fast food establishments is higher than at those that aren't close.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

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Blithe Morning
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Post by Blithe Morning » Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:05 am

We went out to dinner at a higher end restaurant. Three of us, college age male, my hubby, and me - a 49 yo woman, and we ALL brought home a doggie bag.

It was good food but still TOO much. We have tomorrow's lunch/dinner.

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automatedeating
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Post by automatedeating » Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:35 am

Dale wrote:I've wondered if some of my weight gain was partly due to living near a chocolate factory. Sometimes I would just be smelling chocolate all day, whatever I was doing.
LOL, this funny comment made my day! ;)
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

Dale
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Post by Dale » Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:02 pm

oolala53 wrote:So, Dale, do you mean since you were reminded of food all day, you snacked a lot? Because I don't think you can gain weight from aromas. :)

However, research has shown that the obesity rate at schools close to fast food establishments is higher than at those that aren't close.
I wasn't aware of snacking any more, but I think it's possible that good food smells can give you an appetite. Of course, it could maybe work the other way, and either satisfy cravings or make you so fed up of smelling food that you eat less! I lost as well as gained, living near the factory.

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MamieTamar
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Post by MamieTamar » Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:54 pm

Dale, I once read a book about losing weight by inhaling food scents. I couldn't remember what it was called but I think I have found its trace. Hope these links work. Needless to say, it did not do anything for me !

http://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-New ... id/497088/

http://www.amazon.com/Hirschs-Guide-Sce ... 1862040540
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:34 pm

This is the basis for Sensa, which does actually work for many people, but you must take it permanently. It does not actually readjust your appetite. No S CAN do the same thing for nothing, though it takes longer.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

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MamieTamar
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Post by MamieTamar » Sun Jun 01, 2014 5:29 pm

Readjust your appetite, oolala ? How could it possibly do that ? I'm permanently either hungry or cheating !
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 5:51 pm

Give it time.:)

but I also differentiate between a desire for food and real hunger. I can desire food at times when I'm not actually hungry at all. That's actually my worst problem on S days and from about 2:30 p.m. until around 5. The more involved I am in fun OR productive things I actually WANT to do, the less of an issue it is. It's shocking how few productive things I WANT to do. :twisted:
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

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Over43
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Post by Over43 » Tue Jun 03, 2014 5:16 am

My grandparents all smoked. They all worked in office buildings where everyone else smoked. Culturally we have swapped one epidemic for another.
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I made myself be hungry, then I would get hungrier. - Frank Zane Mr. Olympia '77, '78, '79

eschano
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Post by eschano » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:44 am

Over43, I completely agree! In Austria nearly all my friends and family smoke but all are stick thin. And they continuously offer cigarettes too.

To come back to the original topic: I just got back from Italy and have this funny episode to contribute here:

At the beach (a small beach hut and a shack that sold food and ice creams) there were some tourists wanting to buy ice cream for their 5 year old stick thin son. The little one chose a big magnum ice cream and then: low and behold the owner of the shack REFUSED to sell it to him and said such a little boy doesn't need such a big ice cream but instead he can have a kid sized one for free!

I mean, a) he lost a good opportunity to sell his most expensive ice cream and b) offered the smaller one for free?

You know what happened next? The little guy went into a temper tantrum until the parents, after 5 minutes of negotiating, bought him the big Magnum.

I mean, none of them had a weight issue - a very thin family - but I guess in Italy it's still true that it takes a village to raise children and in this society overeating is just not on.

I found this so interesting!
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uschi
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Post by uschi » Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:32 am

Eschano, I love that ice cream vendor story! The vendor is probably a dad. Ever notice how parents, especially moms, have an automatic eye for how large a portion they serve their kids?

Speaking of kids, it's sad how many situations American kids find themselves in come with built in snacks, almost always unhealthy. Especially volunteering opportunities-- do kids who are volunteering really need to be bribed with soda, pizza, candy, cookies? Then again, schools and other organizations often have " mandatory volunteering," another issue...

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bonnieUK
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Post by bonnieUK » Sat Jun 21, 2014 8:52 am

Very interesting ice cream story eschano!

When I was a kid my parents wouldn't let me have things like magnums, giant cornettos, king size mars bars or any other "supersized" treat. I was a greedy kid so did use to ask :D If I were allowed treats they were appropriately kid sized.

I did have a rebellious period at the age of about 12 where I spent my bus money on giant cornettos and king sized snickers bars, but soon grew out of that. The thing that put me on track was an older kid reacting with shock at me eating a giant cornetto for breakfast one day, she said "you'll have no teeth by the age of thirty of you keep doing that!". I think we need cultural influences like this to keep us in check, especially when we are young.

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