Unfounded Terrors

No Snacks, no sweets, no seconds. Except on Days that start with S. Too simple for you? Simple is why it works. Look here for questions, introductions, support, success stories.

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stevecooper
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Unfounded Terrors

Post by stevecooper » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:21 pm

Hi, All.

I just wanted to riff on something in the back of my brain that I think may be a bit of a common theme.

One of the reasons I have eaten too much in the past is a kind of unjustified fear of hunger. It goes something like this;

It's 3pm. Lunch is starting to subside in my belly. I have a hole that *could* be filled by a snack from the tuck box at the office. And this little process at the back of my skull whispers something to me in a scary little voice that I can only really articulate as "if you don't fill that hole, *you might be hungry later.*"

Now, on a rational level I know I can probably always find something to eat in less than five minutes. But the voice at the back of my brain causes an amount of worry out of all proportion to the 'danger.' So I almost-unconsciously go over to the box to quiet down that voice.

I think No-s does two things to help;

1) It gives you a clear counter-message; "No eating until the next mealtime. No discussion."

2) It habituates you to not snacking, which gives the little voice a little less reason to act up, and it starts to atrophy away.

So, that's the fear-inducing voice in the back of my head, and I think maybe other people have similar voices. If anyone else feels this way, share!

Steve.

2poodles
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Post by 2poodles » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:29 pm

For me, mid-afternoon snacking had become a habit. I used to brew a pot of tea around 2 p.m. and then have something sweet with it. In days past I would have cookies, etc., usually more than planned - hey, it's a big pot of tea! When I was trying to "diet" I would try to be satisfied with a piece of fruit with my tea. (yea...that never worked!)

Now I tell myself that a snack is not an option. I still enjoy my tea, but I try to have it shortly after lunch so that I'm not at all hungry. I seem to do better with clear cut boundaries and no wiggle room. And knowing that I can have a sweets on S days keeps me from feeling deprived. I am careful, though, to not make a habit of having sweets with my tea on S days, because then I might feel deprived on N days - I tend to save them for dessert after dinner.
2poodles

Jesseco
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Post by Jesseco » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:49 pm

My experience is similar to yours, stevecooper. Also, I had been greatly influenced by all the diet gurus out there who insist that we do need to eat 5 million times a day for our bodies to work correctly.

So I had settled (several years ago) on a 3:00 and an 8:00 daily snack. Boy, did I get used to them (and they were coming earlier and earlier, because I couldn't wait!) My rule was that it had to be a healthful snack, and that they were. But I had a hard time reigning in the calories.

Then I started an online Bible study that suggested no snacking. I decided to give up my snacks unless I was super-hungry and then only have a fruit. That worked o.k., although I really wanted my Ezekiel 4:9 bread with lots of almond butter and (no-sugar added!) apple butter!

Maybe someday I will allow my fruit snacks again, but I don't know. Once I work out my S days, I think this diet will be ideal for me.

I do love the clear boundaries AND being able to have some exceptions.

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bonnieUK
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Post by bonnieUK » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:53 pm

One of the reasons I have eaten too much in the past is a kind of unjustified fear of hunger.
Same here!

I've also always had a kind of anxiety that if there was somekind of treat nearby that I'd have to have some before it went, or that it would be my only chance to have a treat. I think this may stem from the fact that I grew up in a household where treats and food abundance were not daily occurences (parents were poor/frugal *plays violin* :D). When we did have treats (cookies, chocolate, ice cream etc.) it was a kind of family free for all where we'd devour the whole lot as quickly as possible, then go back to our normal simple eating patterns :D (I guess we kind of had S days in a sense!).

Also, I remember being completely in awe if I went to another kid's and they had things like biscuits, cookies etc. (like those little penguin bars!) on constant supply in the kitchen cupboard :D I found it difficult to understand people who could have snack/treat food available and not just pig out on it until it was all gone!

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FarmerHal
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Post by FarmerHal » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:38 pm

I totally get what you're saying.
Now I think "what's the big deal with being a little hungry sometimes?"
Why don't diet guru's and doctors tell us this instead of "have a healthy snack to 'ward off' hunger" ??

The longer I noS, the easier it is for me to ignore any hunger pangs or other such tummy toddler grumblings.
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fkwan
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Post by fkwan » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:00 pm

Since this place is all about habits, it's just replacing one with another.

I always have a cup of coffee after dinner. It used to be with dessert, especially chocolate.

Now it's with an apple.

The addictive brain knows it's getting its thrill at the expected time, but it's a healthy one.

f

3aday
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Post by 3aday » Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:01 am

Habit is amazing!

This isn't for you guys...but I feel like I need to post this...

You can train your hunger.
If you only eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner with no eating in between, you eventually train your stomach to only want breakfast, lunch and dinner with nothing in between.
If you eliminate the option to snack or to have a dessert, after a while it becomes a habit to not snack and to not eat dessert.
I have mentioned in previous posts that it took me a long time to do No S. I complicated everything and I did not develop the habit of NOT eating between meals. I ended up prolonging developing a normal habit of eating practiced around the world and prolonging weight loss.
When I finally eliminated the option, I eliminated all of the self talk which convinced me to snack or to have something to eat after dinner, even if it was healthy. It simply was not an option.
What did I get in return? Peace with food, confidence in my ability to have self control over when I ate (not what I ate except for sweets) and the ability to no longer buy my jeans in the plus size section. Which for me was as big as my wedding day!

I did every diet known to man. I even did many faith based diets. My faith is really strong but I could not truly abide by only eating between hunger and fullness. I was always hungry! But, when I committed to eating 3 meals a day with nothing in between...I finally began to develop good, solid eating habits that I do not have to explain if I go out to dinner or eat with my friends or coworkers. Also, by forcing my body to eat 3 times a day...I forced my hunger to abide by my rules and now hunger only comes 3 times a day.

With trying every diet known to man, I ended up having every diet book known to man. I ended up getting rid of all of them except for two. The No S Diet book and Dieting: A Dry Drunk.

Those two books changed my way of eating for ever. Like Reinhard, the author of Dieting: A Dry Drunk advocates a No S way of eating. She arrested her eating disorder and achieved her normal weight be eating 3 moderate meals with nothing in between. She writes: The slogan "three meals a day, nothing in between, no matter what" grants a great deal of freedom. Since 1974 I haven't found any situation, social or emotional, that required I eat between meals.

How inspiring!

She also writes: Because options can invite obsessions, giving up the option to eat randomly can bring freedom for the obsession to eat. Think about something you reserve the option to do but don't normally do, for example, keeping something that you find. What happens when you come across an article or money someone lost? If the article is something you want or need, then do you keep it? When the amount is several hundred dollars, then what? The struggle of deciding what to do and thinking "should I or shouldn't I" invites worry, upset or temporary obsession. If you don't have the option of keeping anything that isn't yours then the decision is simple and....no obsession! If you give up the option to eat between meals, decisions are simpler and....no eating obsession!

I hope I don't come across as harsh or not sympathetic. I am sympathetic and hold all NoSer's in my heart! I know what it is like to be obsessed with food and overweight. I know what it is like to binge for months on end....I just want to spare the newbies from making it more difficult than it is. Please, don't prolong the suffering and the eventual weight loss that will come.

I also want to add, I suffered from blood sugar problems and was diagnosed as a Type 2 Diabetic a few years ago. Eating 3 meals a day with protein in every meal (that is my tweak) has helped keep my blood sugar levels stable and in a normal range daily. I used to eat 4, 5, 6 meals a day "to control my sugar" but your body has the amazing power to adjust.

Lots of love and support to all of you....Have a wonderful evening!

:)

swimfit
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Post by swimfit » Wed Apr 02, 2008 12:17 am

well said 3aday. Do you "observe" S days? If so how do you treat them, what do you do?

3aday
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Post by 3aday » Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:11 am

I do observe S days.
My S days have changed drastically during my No S journey.

I ate sweets, seconds, and snacks like crazy in the beginning.
I used to have sweet beverages too like sweet tea and soda. But, because I have eliminated those sweet beverages on my N days, I don't really crave them anymore and don't really drink them on the weekend. (Power of habit).

Now, I pretty much stick to 3 meals on Saturday and Sunday with an occasional amazing dessert or pastry or a frappuccino or milkshake in the afternoon...but here is the key, it's only sometimes if we are out and about. I don't make special trips. The more I did No S during the week, the more ingrained my habit has become in not eating between meals so I find that I haven't really been eating my former famous Panera chocolate pastry on Saturday afternoons like I used to.

Lately, I really haven't been eating dessert or having a milkshake type drink at all on the weekends. Not because I am this great person but because I have been doing this for a while and I think my tolerance for sweets has reduced. Normally, now, my meals will be something different than what I would normally eat during the week.

For example, my husband hates pancakes. He works every Saturday morning and I am off on Saturday mornings so I will buy frozen pancakes and eat one plate of pancakes for breakfast with butter and maple syrup with a cup of coffee and cream. For me that's a real treat because my breakfast during the week has (lately) been a grilled cheese sandwich.

Lunch is normal. Maybe a sandwich and a banana with milk or water.

Then, sometimes, if we go out to eat for dinner...I will order nachos. Everyone knows that the nachos they serve at restaurants are huge and I usually eat the whole serving (but lately, I have been getting full when I eat them and I find that my fullness starts at the point if the nachos were on a normal size plate). I then am stuffed I don't even want to eat dessert or a sweet.

Sundays I wake up early for church so I will have coffee and toast but for lunch my husband and I might pick up fast food. But, we never eat there anymore. I put my cheeseburger on a plate and fries on a plate when I get home and have that as a late lunch. I don't even have a soda with it, just water.

Obviously, I am not being virtuous with what I eat! But, anything more than a plate full of food fills me up now, so seconds are not really an option so I don't sweat having a cheeseburger and fries or nachos....

I truly believe that my habits from my N days have started to carry over on my S days over time.

These habits are really a miracle for me. I was the type of person that if they had birthday cake at work, I would eat 3 pieces and then sneak and grab more when no one was looking. Also, a coworker would bring brownies to work and I would get up from desk six times and grab a brownie (I justified they were small). Also, with much humiliation, I used to have to fill another coworkers huge Hershey's Kiss bucket because I would literally grab ten at a time and make 4 trips to grab more (of course when no one was looking!). My blood sugar was always elevated and I am in my mid 30's and had to get a bunch of cavities filled (not proud!)

When I eliminated the option for snacks and sweets during the week and finally did it for about two months, things started getting more normal on my S days.

Thanksgiving last year was great. 3 meals and pumpkin pie with whip cream for dessert. Two years ago, I was practically comatose from eating from morning until night (and eating a half a pecan pie when my husband went to bed).

I'm sorry I keep writing but I want to add, even though my S days are much tighter than when I started, my weight loss has remained the same. Tightening up my S days did not accelerate the loss. So, if you want to tighten up your S days, do it for health and emotional reasons, not to try to lose weight any faster. (At least that's the way it was for me).

Sorry I have been writing so much!

2poodles
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Post by 2poodles » Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:21 am

3aday -- Thank you, you are inspiring, motivating and encouraging!! It's so nice to hear success and perseverance stories from folks who have been no s-ing for awhile.
2poodles

3aday
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Post by 3aday » Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:29 am

No prob!

I have to add this disclaimer: When I first started in 2006, I was THE WORST NO S'ER SINCE THE BEGINNING OF TIME!

Most of 2007 I spiraled into "other diets" insanity...and then I made a conscious decision to just buckle down and do it.

It wasn't easy at first (I wish I could lie) but it can be done.

Reinhard was right when he wrote it can take like 12 attempts.
I think it took me like a 112 attempts.
Well, maybe 1112 attempts.
But, when you can get your mind on board, it becomes easy as cake!
(Which you can't have Monday through Friday!) :P

stevecooper
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Post by stevecooper » Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:50 am

very, very good posts, 3aday. That level of detail gives a really clear picture of where it all leads. Thanks

Dawn
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Post by Dawn » Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:00 pm

3aday, your story is very inspiring. I have been doing this for 2 months and I have to say that the N day habits aren't so much following me to S days. I am working on tightening up my S days not in order to speed up weight loss but to actually see some weight loss. I have not lost anything since starting this. I know since I only have around 15-20 pounds to lose it will go slow, but nothing at all? Time to tighten up some don't you think? And I am talking about baby step, doable things, not going crazy. So funny how going crazy and starving myself and running 5 miles a day would have been the first thing I would have wanted to try with past diets. But I know I am on the right track now and it's just a matter for adjusting things so that I can see a few pounds slip away each month.

I don't doubt that I can get my N day habits to come on board on S days but I think it will take a little more planning ahead of time for me. When I just wake up on Saturday AM and hope for the best it usually ends up getting a bit out of hand. And I am not talking about going crazy, but it's too much if I want to lose anything.

I really like your attitude about food and about you treat yourself on S days. You are not depriving yourself, you are not over thinking things, that's where I must be in order for long term success.

Thanks for sharing!
Dawn

kccc
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Post by kccc » Wed Apr 02, 2008 3:01 pm

3aday, that is a VERY helpful post. Thank you for sharing your experience.

cheeks4weeks
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Post by cheeks4weeks » Wed Apr 02, 2008 4:11 pm

[quote="3aday"]These habits are really a miracle for me. I was the type of person that if they had birthday cake at work, I would eat 3 pieces and then sneak and grab more when no one was looking. Also, a coworker would bring brownies to work and I would get up from desk six times and grab a brownie (I justified they were small). Also, with much humiliation, I used to have to fill another coworkers huge Hershey's Kiss bucket because I would literally grab ten at a time and make 4 trips to grab more (of course when no one was looking!). My blood sugar was always elevated and I am in my mid 30's and had to get a bunch of cavities filled (not proud!)[/quote]

I am this person. Only more shameless. Last year there was a vacation calendar up at work and during my birthday week I wrote "CAKE WEEK" and made sure that everyone knew that not only was it my birthday but that I fully expected cake on every single day. Now, if someone brings in treats - they call me to let me know so I can have some. I feel like that pesky and persistent pigeon or squirel that won't leave you alone in the park. Before this moment I thought it was funny and cute. Now I feel like....well...ashamed would be the best word.

I really hope to discover why I'm doing this to myself. There are a few outside reasons - "you should eat five times a day. Three meals and two snacks. Your body just can't function without it." blah, blah, blah. I can just not listen to those people anymore. My main concern is finding the internal source of the overeating. If my only problem was eating five times a day, I don't think I would even think about it. It's the five daily meals, the sugar and all the other food that somehow makes it into my mouth without me even being conscience of it.

Bumpkyns
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Post by Bumpkyns » Wed Apr 02, 2008 11:14 pm

2poodles wrote:3aday -- Thank you, you are inspiring, motivating and encouraging!! It's so nice to hear success and perseverance stories from folks who have been no s-ing for awhile.
DITTO!!!!!!!!!!

Hugs to all...
Bump
Blessed are the cracked, for they are the ones who let in the light!

lindalou
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Post by lindalou » Thu Apr 03, 2008 12:12 am

My first week was bad at 1st break and the afternoon break I was so used to eating something So I wanted to eat not because I was hungry just out of habit and also people I break with all eat I think they think I am nuts But I will get the last laugh Went they are still talking about there diets I will be doing my diet which is hard to think of it as a diet.Now that I am in my second week it is not so hard and since spring is around the corner I can just go outside :D :D :D

Everyone I hope you all have a good week and more :D :D :D :D

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FarmerHal
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Post by FarmerHal » Thu Apr 03, 2008 1:40 am

Great post 3aday! That was very inspiring!
{FarmerHal} ...previously Shamrockmommy...
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Jamiebf
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Thanks

Post by Jamiebf » Wed Apr 09, 2008 5:27 am

Your story was very helpful, thanks for sharing.

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