Looking for feedback. Thanks in advance.

No Snacks, no sweets, no seconds. Except on Days that start with S. Too simple for you? Simple is why it works. Look here for questions, introductions, support, success stories.

Moderators: Soprano, automatedeating

Post Reply
User avatar
JillyBean
Posts: 334
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:19 pm
Location: Maine

Looking for feedback. Thanks in advance.

Post by JillyBean » Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:29 pm

I posted this over on my daily check-in and, as I was typing, I decided to copy and paste it here for a wider possibility of responses.

I have been struggling a bit. I really want to lose weight faster than is happening. And my habit is to go on a diet. As I've said (or at least thought) a thousand times, this is not a diet. Yes, I know I can do this for the rest of my life. And, no, I don't want to gain weight back again once I lose it, but I feel like at this rate I'm going to be 85 before I get to a good weight. And any time I think about tweaking, it feels like dieting. I know that's the reason for the binge on Monday, my first since joining here in April.

So, I've been contemplating doing something else, you know, to get the weight off, and then doing this to maintain. I am sure I'm not the first to try this. I wonder if anybody has had success doing that? (I have a feeling I already know what some of you are going to say, but I guess I need to "hear it out loud.")
Jill

The food I eat today is my choice! What price am I willing to pay?

"There are no failures, only feedback." ~~ Robert Allen

wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Post by wosnes » Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:42 pm

I'm a big believer in starting as you mean to continue; I'm not a fan of quick weight loss and then changing the program to maintain weight loss.

I'd say if you need or want to tweak to encourage weight loss, make it something you can sustain for life. Maybe eating more vegetables (you can eat a heck of a lot of veggies for very little calories) or increasing the amount of exercise daily. "Increasing exercise" doesn't necessarily mean more time at the gym or whatever, just move movement each day. Make life a little inconvenient and move more.

Slow and steady wins the race. My guess is that if you do something to lose the weight quickly you'll be losing and gaining the same pounds for years. That's a big reason many of us are here now.

So what if you're 85 when you finally get to your desired weight? Better than never getting there or being on a "diet" for most of the rest of your life.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

navi
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:55 am

Post by navi » Wed Jul 16, 2008 2:36 pm

Others on this board have come to noS after losing weight on another program (WW comes to mind), and use noS to maintain. There is no reason this strategy won't work, IF you can stick to a more restrictive diet for the time it takes to lose the weight. I realize this may not be the most popular reply to your question, but I think it is valid. If you have to lose 50 pounds, do you really want to wait 2 years? Maybe, maybe not. I personally can't be bothered with strict diets, I can't do them for long enough. Others can stick to a strict diet for long periods and really lose alot of weight that way.

ThomsonsPier
Posts: 321
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2006 2:18 pm
Location: Reading, UK

Post by ThomsonsPier » Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:05 pm

I don't see why it wouldn't work, nor would I particularly advise against it. I wouldn't do it, however; I've just upped my exercise levels instead.
ThomsonsPier

It's a trick. Get an axe.

navi
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:55 am

Post by navi » Wed Jul 16, 2008 3:37 pm

I like ThomsonsPier's response - exercise can make all the difference....I go long distance hiking for 3 weeks every spring, eat whatever the *&&^$ I want, and drop 15 pounds just like that. Of course 10 hours a day of exercise is difficult to maintain in everyday life! When I finish my dissertation I plan to reward myself with the Pacific Crest Trail diet - 2000+ miles in 5 months surrounded by beautiful scenery. Living in the mountains for weeks/months on end, just walking & eating & sleeping & botanizing & thinking is the cure for all that ails me.....met my future husband on the AT & the PCT will be our honeymoon......

vmelo
Posts: 160
Joined: Tue Mar 07, 2006 2:54 am

Post by vmelo » Wed Jul 16, 2008 5:23 pm

I think there's no problem with using another, traditional diet program to lose weight faster and then using No-S for maintenance. It's what I'm doing.

There's no question that I do not want to be on a traditional diet program for the rest of my life for all the reasons that I think many on this board share. But right now, I need a confidence boost and the motivation to continue, and I can only get that if I lose some of this weight quickly. In the past when I've been on traditional diets (e.g., calorie counting), my focus was solely on losing the weight. I didn't think about maintenance. I see this time as different. I am consciously thinking about maintenance, and I've already chosen the one plan that I feel will allow me to live a normal life: No-S.

So, I don't think it's wrong to want to get the weight off and then do No-S for maintenance. However, I would caution you not to use any diet program that requires you to cut food groups (e.g., low carb diets) because just the act of adding those food groups back into your diet will cause a weight jump. If you use calorie counting and/or Weight Watchers, you can gradually introducing more food without re-gaining the weight and then you can go on No-S for maintenance.

Good luck!

Amyliz
Posts: 168
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2008 4:52 pm
Location: New York

Post by Amyliz » Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:19 pm

Hey Jillybean,

after the 5lbs i lost in my first month, i've stayed the same for the past 3 months. one thing I'm realizing is that we often tell ourselves 'but I'm doing everything right, and I'm not losing weight' or 'I'm doing everything i can, but not losing weight - it must be the diet!'

i've had those moments, and then i ask myself - am i really doing everything i can? and you mentioned that tweaking feels like a diet, well so would another diet!!
I hope you to stay with the No-S philosophy/lifestyle b/c i think the rest of the diets out there really detrimental to living a balanced and sane life!

best of luck!
Amyliz
Amyliz

START: 03/30/08 - 158- 161lbs range
Current: 145-148lbs range
On 12/22/09 I saw 145 on the scale for the first time in 7 years!

rose
Posts: 332
Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:06 pm

Post by rose » Wed Jul 16, 2008 7:36 pm

erm...

Do you really want to go back to snacks, sweets and seconds? (I sure don't)

Why not just combine NoS principles with whatever eating plan you're considering?
Started NoS Jan 07 at 74.5kg (164 lbs, BMI 26.7)
Stable since Jan 08 at 64kg (141 lbs, BMI 23)
My progress chart

blueskighs
Posts: 1787
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:11 am
Location: California

Post by blueskighs » Thu Jul 17, 2008 2:14 am

I think Rose makes a really good point.

You might want to ask yourself what you are looking for in a diet.

Are you looking for restrictions or guidelines? The thing I would be most concerned about is the binging rebound, you know for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. I can diet successfully for six months and then the rebound is usually quite horrendous. That is if I can last the six months.

WHen you say you are tweaking and it feels like a diet and you think that is why you binged, I am not sure that a diet is going to be your best solution.

Whatever you decide I support you,

Blueskighs
www.nosdiet.blogspot.com Where I blog daily about my No S journey

User avatar
JillyBean
Posts: 334
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:19 pm
Location: Maine

Post by JillyBean » Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:22 pm

Thanks to all who took the time to respond. You guys are the best! Ironically, I found my answer in another post started by wosnes, "The Best Diet: No Diet." This particular part really spoke to me:
This is the key: If you are interested in long term weight reduction, you need a moderate, balanced way of eating of your own design that you can live with -- not some super-restrictive, strict plan that makes you unhappy and always vigilant.
So, that is what I have done. I thought a lot yesterday about what works for me and what I can live with. I believe I have come up with something. I'll keep you posted! :)
Jill

The food I eat today is my choice! What price am I willing to pay?

"There are no failures, only feedback." ~~ Robert Allen

User avatar
mel1974c
Posts: 113
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:12 am
Location: North Shore, Massachusetts

Post by mel1974c » Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:40 pm

Good luck JillyBean. Taking the time to think and plan is a great first step!

wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Post by wosnes » Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:57 pm

JillyBean wrote:Thanks to all who took the time to respond. You guys are the best! Ironically, I found my answer in another post started by wosnes, "The Best Diet: No Diet." This particular part really spoke to me:
This is the key: If you are interested in long term weight reduction, you need a moderate, balanced way of eating of your own design that you can live with -- not some super-restrictive, strict plan that makes you unhappy and always vigilant.
So, that is what I have done. I thought a lot yesterday about what works for me and what I can live with. I believe I have come up with something. I'll keep you posted! :)
One of my favorite "diet" books (other than No-S, of course) is The Perfect Recipe for Losing Weight & Eating Great by Pam Anderson. The reason it's a favorite -- because she designed a program that would work for her. She says that diet plans and programs are like trying to sell everyone the same size and style of shoe and expecting them to wear it. Doesn't matter that it doesn't fit or isn't comfortable or doesn't fill your needs in a shoe. I've read that sentiment in a totally different context as well. One size does not fit all.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

navi
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:55 am

Post by navi » Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:10 pm

Jilly Bean, I am rooting for you! Designing a program YOU can live long term is the key! For some, noS is the answer, for others, noS is not the perfect fit. I have been experimenting with noS for a while now, not entirely happy but still working on it. Some parts I love, others I struggle with - for me, vanilla noS, which works great for others, is too much about restriction & sets me up for out of control S days. I just can't live with a diet that makes me a failure because I eat an unplanned piece of dessert at a special restaurant on the "wrong" day of the week - it seems arbitrary somehow. I am interested in what you have come up with....

Hungry Girl
Posts: 69
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2008 9:28 pm

Maintenance only?

Post by Hungry Girl » Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:58 pm

Hi Jilly Bean:

I know what you mean. What if you did No S without the S days for as long as you could and then used the weekend S days method for maintenance after you have reached your goal? Does anyone else think this would work? The S days are really messing me up when i am on a roll.

HG

navi
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 4:55 am

Post by navi » Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:54 am

HG - I was thinking that I would allow myself x amount of "treats" (snack, second, sweet) each week (they would all turn out being sweets!), within the noS framework (but get rid of S days). The "all or nothing thing" really throws me off. This way i can keep the rhythm of the 3 meals & no snacks (which i love), & still have a treat when one comes my way (no planning involved, no binges on weekends).
G

CrazyCatLady
Posts: 301
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:58 pm
Location: Illinois

Post by CrazyCatLady » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:38 am

I have been eating to excess and spoiling myself to death (100 pounds of extra weight is NOT good for me!) for such a very long time! I really need the structure of N days and S days to regain some balance. However, following 5 successful No S weeks, dd and I baked cookies midweek, and I have been overindulging on them. :( Does this make me a "No S failure"? Not at all...it means I have two red days this week, and that I broke my successful run.

Certainly no plan can work for everyone, but this is basic common sense, and it seems more right the longer I stick (or slip up) with it! I look at a few thin co-workers, who never seem to diet, and guess how they eat? Healthy meals, with occasional snacks! I never see those people binge on things, and when treats are available, occasionally they indulge in a reasonable amount. Maybe some of the members here can get to that point, where they can have occasional indulgences throughout the week, but for me I truly need to strictness of the No S boundaries.

With that said, I would LOVE to have this weight melt off faster! But I know that I am learning to change decades of horrible habits, and I will have patience. But JillyBean, if you are good at sticking to a stricter diet, I don't see what it could hurt to go on something for a few months or more and then go back to vanilla No S to maintain? In fact, I'm guessing your time at No S would make it easier to stick to a stricter diet. (In all my diets, I never learned that it was ok to be hungry and wait to eat! Until No S! LOL!)

User avatar
JillyBean
Posts: 334
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:19 pm
Location: Maine

Post by JillyBean » Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:38 pm

Wow! Even more good feedback today! Well, I have designed a plan that I hope will work for me and here it is, for those who are interested (like gionta, who sounds amazingly like me!).

I do seem to be able to get through No-S days fairly easily (knowing I have an S day coming up has helped with that) and sometimes my weekends get crazy because I fall into that thinking of "tomorrow or the next day will be no-s so I'm going to enjoy now" which I know is counter-productive, but I still seem to fall into it.

I also firmly believe in some structure, but just not too much structure. Also, sometimes on the weekends we are doing nothing and they could easily have been no-s days, but I still think I'd better have something to keep the edge off the "long days ahead" if you know what I mean. And there are occasional times during the week when sticking to no-s is really hard. Basically, it comes down to this: I need a limit on snacks and sweets (seconds have never been a problem for me), so I like the structure, and I like that it's not forever (as I had to do in OA to claim abstinence). I also like the thought of s-events instead of s-days. This is a little more structure for me which I seem to need. Also, I feel there is some truth to intuitive eating and don't like ignoring hunger for long. I believe it messes with metabolism. Sometimes I have eaten like a bird and not lost any weight, I believe because I have been such a yo-yo dieter.

Having said all that, my plan is this: Up to 4 light meals a day. Light meals are defined as what a normal person of my size (small) would eat for a meal. I will feel "politely" full and satisfied. Up to three "discrepancies" a week. A discrepancy is defined as any of these activities: Adding too much fat, any sweets (as defined by Reinhard in No-S), getting too full, or eating more than 4 times in a day.

And I've increased my physical activities. I've set up a habitcal for all these things. My No-S habitcal will be green all the time (weekends too) as long as I don't do more than three "discrepancies" in a week. The first three discepancies (kept in a habitcal all their own) will be yellow. Basically, this just limits my times of s-events and allows them on any day at all rather than just on the weekends. They'll probably be used mostly on the weekends, but if I want something, say, on a Wednesday, I won't have to put a red on my habitcal. Normal people eat sweets sometimes during the week and then not on the weekends.

Well, this is getting rather long. Sorry about that. The plan is simple (like No-S). I guess I just wanted to explain my reasons for the changes. At any rate, I'm going to see if this works and will tweak again, if necessary, and share it here for my accountability.
Last edited by JillyBean on Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Jill

The food I eat today is my choice! What price am I willing to pay?

"There are no failures, only feedback." ~~ Robert Allen

blueskighs
Posts: 1787
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:11 am
Location: California

Post by blueskighs » Fri Jul 18, 2008 4:09 pm

Jill,

let us know how it goes.

I think its great you are using HabitCal. I am using it for two other things besides NO S and I am just fascinated with what an amazing tool it is!

It helped me identify that expecting myself to do Oxycise everyday, rain or shine, saturday and sunday was just unreasonable expecatation so I am giving myself Sundays off, in fact I am thinking about taking Saturdays off too. If I hadnt' been doing HabitCAL I would not have seen the trend that helped me come to that awareness (two reds on Sunday) and just stopped doing it altogether as I always do.

The other great success with HabitCal is keeping me working consistently and steadily on my PROJECT. Using Habitcal (and for me, following NO S) means that I will probably get the bulk of the work done by end of August.

SO what I am trying to say, using HabitCal with your plan is probably going to be really helpful!

Blueskighs
www.nosdiet.blogspot.com Where I blog daily about my No S journey

angelka71
Posts: 86
Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 6:50 am

Post by angelka71 » Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:45 am

Jillybean,

Sounds like you've got a great plan., very reasonable. If you've been doing this since April, you've already got some good No-s habits as your foundation so these further restrictions should be easier for you to maintain.

I know what you mean about wanting to lose the weight more quickly. I've only got (at most) 15lbs to lose and as you know, the less weight you have to lose the more slowly it comes off no matter which diet you chose...and since no s is supposed to cause you to lose slowly anyways...well, you get the idea.

I'm making some changes myself but mine really only mean really committing to exerciseing, increasing water intake and decreasing diet cokes (I'm such an addict) and eating more vegies. I'm also only going to have a little something sweet on each S day (no snacks, no seconds). These aren't earth shattering so I'm thinking it's going to go well.

Good luck!

User avatar
JillyBean
Posts: 334
Joined: Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:19 pm
Location: Maine

Post by JillyBean » Sat Jul 19, 2008 1:50 pm

Angelka, these sound like good "tweaks" to me. I look forward to the day when I only want to lose 15 more pounds. But, even the first 15 will help a lot! :)

I would also like to express my deep appreciation for what I have learned through No-S. Sometimes when I talk about "tweaking" it almost feels a little disloyal. I could never have gotten to the point I am at without having found No-S and following it faithfully for about 3 months. It got me off the diet roller coaster. For that I will always be grateful. I think Reinhard has broad enough shoulders to realize that, even though I'm not doing Vanilla No-S, his plan is still the best I've ever come across. The flexibility that is allowed is the most healing for those of us who have been deeply wounded by dieting our whole lives. As fkwan (where is she, BTW?) has said before: Three bows to you, Reinhard.
Jill

The food I eat today is my choice! What price am I willing to pay?

"There are no failures, only feedback." ~~ Robert Allen

Post Reply