http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/02/16/op ... index.html
A month to start
Moderators: Soprano, automatedeating
A month to start
This article, although it's sort of anti-No S iits micromanaging, has several aspects that made me laugh and think of No S, not in the least was the paragraph that starts with "After the third week, the hunger pangs went away" or something to that effect.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/02/16/op ... index.html
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/02/16/op ... index.html
Last edited by Blondie on Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What Navin said.
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maslowjenkins
- Posts: 56
- Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:33 pm
- Location: Tulsa, Ok
Thanks for the link, Blondie!
Nice testament to the power of making monthly resolutions.
And also to the impossibility of "perfection."
What she needs is a little more (systematic!) moderation.
Reinhard
Nice testament to the power of making monthly resolutions.
And also to the impossibility of "perfection."
What she needs is a little more (systematic!) moderation.
Proto S-days? Maybe she'll get there, after all!I'm giving myself a little leeway, like special occasion permission to indulge.
Reinhard
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gratefuldeb67
- Posts: 6256
- Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 9:26 pm
- Location: Great Neck, NY
Hi Blondie! Hope you are well! Nice to hear from you 
Well, for me, anything that has "being perfect" as it's main objective, to me personally, seems unhelpful and unmaintainable.
You know what???
I've spent the last two weeks failing on NoS and every other HabitCal I've made for myself.. Yesterday was my first fully green day for NoS and today was my first day for exercise.
Somehow, I know those failures were part of me getting here.
My acceptance of them and perseverance finally resulted in getting back on track.
That's my view at least.
I feel if I had set my priority goal to be "Be perfect" then I suppose that those failures would deter me from continuing to try and I'd just give up.
Perfection??
Who needs it!
Debs x
Well, for me, anything that has "being perfect" as it's main objective, to me personally, seems unhelpful and unmaintainable.
You know what???
I've spent the last two weeks failing on NoS and every other HabitCal I've made for myself.. Yesterday was my first fully green day for NoS and today was my first day for exercise.
Somehow, I know those failures were part of me getting here.
My acceptance of them and perseverance finally resulted in getting back on track.
That's my view at least.
I feel if I had set my priority goal to be "Be perfect" then I suppose that those failures would deter me from continuing to try and I'd just give up.
Perfection??
Who needs it!
Debs xThere is no Wisdom greater than Kindness
I think perfection is sustainable. There are some things that are appropriate to be perfect. For example, infidelity in marriage is a big deal. A failure on that score can wreak havoc on a marriage.
I read about The No S Diet after having read a book, which I no longer have and cannot identify, in which the author said it was important to have "perfect compliance."
The benefit of following something perfectly is that you start not to think about it. For example, we made sure our kids wash their hands every time they use the bathroom. This is an automatic habit for most adults but they learn by growing up being told to wash their hands.
Just last night, I read that someone had a failure because she visited a relative and was served cake. In my mind, that is not a failure. There are times when it is appropriate to have sweets on a weekday. That's why I've modified The No S Diet from where you have pre-determined Special Days to where you have exception days when can be used on a spur of the moment. These exception days accumulate at a rate of two per month, so you have a budget for them. I used Reinhard's idea of a maximum of two Special Days per month to set the number of exception days. While having exception days, I still retain the automatic character of following N Day rules. It's just that part of following this diet perfectly is being able to use E (or Exception) days. Today is an E Day for me. It is the birthday party for our 8 year old. It's not her birthday, which was on Valentine's Day.
Kathleen
I read about The No S Diet after having read a book, which I no longer have and cannot identify, in which the author said it was important to have "perfect compliance."
The benefit of following something perfectly is that you start not to think about it. For example, we made sure our kids wash their hands every time they use the bathroom. This is an automatic habit for most adults but they learn by growing up being told to wash their hands.
Just last night, I read that someone had a failure because she visited a relative and was served cake. In my mind, that is not a failure. There are times when it is appropriate to have sweets on a weekday. That's why I've modified The No S Diet from where you have pre-determined Special Days to where you have exception days when can be used on a spur of the moment. These exception days accumulate at a rate of two per month, so you have a budget for them. I used Reinhard's idea of a maximum of two Special Days per month to set the number of exception days. While having exception days, I still retain the automatic character of following N Day rules. It's just that part of following this diet perfectly is being able to use E (or Exception) days. Today is an E Day for me. It is the birthday party for our 8 year old. It's not her birthday, which was on Valentine's Day.
Kathleen
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brotherjohn
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:42 am
- Location: Mississippi
Kathleen,
I've come to a similar conclusion as what you are talking about. You are exactly right. And, I think that it falls under the category of "Don't be an idiot."
If you are visiting your grandmother, and you only see her once a year, and she is 90 years old, and she offers you a piece of cake, and you hurt her feelings by not eating the cake, well, you are being an idiot.
(Last Friday, a co-worker who is the sweetest lady on the planet offered me a single chocolate covered strawberry in honor of Valentine's Day. I took it and enjoyed it.)
On the other hand, if I start declaring every situation an exception, I am going to wind up as large as a barge. Again, that would fall under the rule, "Don't be an idiot." It think my present tack is working, because I am losing a bit of weight.
I was reading a review of No-s on another website, and it said that this plan seemed to be for people who don't put up with a lot of BS. I'm kind of coming to that conclusion. We are a tough-minded crew. "Cut the BS. Don't be an idiot."
I've come to a similar conclusion as what you are talking about. You are exactly right. And, I think that it falls under the category of "Don't be an idiot."
If you are visiting your grandmother, and you only see her once a year, and she is 90 years old, and she offers you a piece of cake, and you hurt her feelings by not eating the cake, well, you are being an idiot.
(Last Friday, a co-worker who is the sweetest lady on the planet offered me a single chocolate covered strawberry in honor of Valentine's Day. I took it and enjoyed it.)
On the other hand, if I start declaring every situation an exception, I am going to wind up as large as a barge. Again, that would fall under the rule, "Don't be an idiot." It think my present tack is working, because I am losing a bit of weight.
I was reading a review of No-s on another website, and it said that this plan seemed to be for people who don't put up with a lot of BS. I'm kind of coming to that conclusion. We are a tough-minded crew. "Cut the BS. Don't be an idiot."
"Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand." --St. Paul
Read my free weekly devotional rural adventures at:
www.countrypreacherdad.com
Read my free weekly devotional rural adventures at:
www.countrypreacherdad.com
I agree with this sentiment exactly.brotherjohn wrote:On the other hand, if I start declaring every situation an exception, I am going to wind up as large as a barge. Again, that would fall under the rule, "Don't be an idiot." It think my present tack is working, because I am losing a bit of weight.
"Anyone can cook." ~ Chef Gusteau, Ratatouille
brotherjohn,
Well, I think it's human nature to push the limit. I have a nine year old who tries again and again to push the limit. My conclusion is to accept my human nature of wanting to push the limit and just set a firm limit of two exception days per month to be used however I want. It works for me. The beauty of this is that I don't have to worry about a failure until I've used all my saved exception days. I now have four after using one for today.
As for being an idiot, I'd say I don't mind following the letter of this diet and totally violating the spirit. I once ate two Haagen Dazs bars in the van on the 10 minute drive home from the grocery store. I also was in the kitchen one Friday night with a Haagen Dazs bar unwrapped waiting for the digital clock to register midnight. So what... I follow the letter of the law and don't worry about being an idiot.
I'm hoping to be below 200 pounds by early April because we're spending a night at a water park to celebrate! I bought a very nice black swimsuit for myself to have by then. I started in September at 215 pounds and got as low as 201.4 last Saturday morning. It will be a long time before I'm comfortable in a swimsuit, but I'll be a lot more comfortable this summer in an expensive black swimsuit with swim shorts than I was in the ghastly old lady swimsuit I've worn the last two years. With the amount of weight I have to lose, I don't want this diet to be the focus of my life all the time I'm losing weight but instead want it to be a habit every bit as entrenched as washing my hands after using the bathroom. Perfect compliance gives me that because I don't care if I'm being an idiot or not. I'm following the letter of the diet and not worrying about the spirit of it.
Kathleen
Well, I think it's human nature to push the limit. I have a nine year old who tries again and again to push the limit. My conclusion is to accept my human nature of wanting to push the limit and just set a firm limit of two exception days per month to be used however I want. It works for me. The beauty of this is that I don't have to worry about a failure until I've used all my saved exception days. I now have four after using one for today.
As for being an idiot, I'd say I don't mind following the letter of this diet and totally violating the spirit. I once ate two Haagen Dazs bars in the van on the 10 minute drive home from the grocery store. I also was in the kitchen one Friday night with a Haagen Dazs bar unwrapped waiting for the digital clock to register midnight. So what... I follow the letter of the law and don't worry about being an idiot.
I'm hoping to be below 200 pounds by early April because we're spending a night at a water park to celebrate! I bought a very nice black swimsuit for myself to have by then. I started in September at 215 pounds and got as low as 201.4 last Saturday morning. It will be a long time before I'm comfortable in a swimsuit, but I'll be a lot more comfortable this summer in an expensive black swimsuit with swim shorts than I was in the ghastly old lady swimsuit I've worn the last two years. With the amount of weight I have to lose, I don't want this diet to be the focus of my life all the time I'm losing weight but instead want it to be a habit every bit as entrenched as washing my hands after using the bathroom. Perfect compliance gives me that because I don't care if I'm being an idiot or not. I'm following the letter of the diet and not worrying about the spirit of it.
Kathleen
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gratefuldeb67
- Posts: 6256
- Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2005 9:26 pm
- Location: Great Neck, NY
Hi guys, I just wanted to chime in on the "idiot" thing here..
I just read the different interpretations of idiocy and I think when Reinhard wrote "don't be an idiot" on S days, he simply meant, don't have a half gallon of ice cream and declare you hamsters birthday as an S day, and stuff as such..
I wouldn't say having two haagen daaz bars at *any* time on the weekend would make one an idiot, and I certainly think it would be quite rude to decline your 90 year old Grandmothers cake, and accepting on that occation would be okay cos that is certainly S worthy.
We also have to be honest about what would or wouldn't serve us when we are trying to lose weight. I know that if I go insane on an S day, I don't feel guilty at all, but I also don't at all expect that to be a week I'll see the scale budge.
Have a great weekend!
Debs x
I just read the different interpretations of idiocy and I think when Reinhard wrote "don't be an idiot" on S days, he simply meant, don't have a half gallon of ice cream and declare you hamsters birthday as an S day, and stuff as such..
I wouldn't say having two haagen daaz bars at *any* time on the weekend would make one an idiot, and I certainly think it would be quite rude to decline your 90 year old Grandmothers cake, and accepting on that occation would be okay cos that is certainly S worthy.
We also have to be honest about what would or wouldn't serve us when we are trying to lose weight. I know that if I go insane on an S day, I don't feel guilty at all, but I also don't at all expect that to be a week I'll see the scale budge.
Have a great weekend!
Debs xThere is no Wisdom greater than Kindness
Debs,
Two Haagen Dazs bars in the 10 minute drive home from the grocery store... That wasn't the limit of what I've been eating on S Days. Last weekend, we bought a jar of caramel macademian clusters. I looked at the empty jar the next day. There were 23 servings of 2 pieces each at a caloric level of about 230 calories per serving. Calculate that out, and the jar contained about 5,000 calories. I had at least 3,000 calories last weekend of caramel macademian clusters. My weight didn't go below last Saturday's low of 201.4, but that's OK by me. I am sensing that this is my body's way to adjust to a lower set point. To really overeat and be OK with it is reassurance after my years of always about to go on a diet, being on a diet, or out of control eating after a diet. As for declaring your hamster's birthday an S Day, I've opted to limit weekday non N Days to two per month, and I can use them whenever I want and for whatever reason I want.
I've been on this diet now almost six months and, as of last Saturday, was down just over 13 pounds. If I manage to be down 25 pounds by the 1 year mark in September (down to 190), I would be very happy with those results. The tempation is always to try to cut back on S Days, but I think that the result is that you have failures on N Days. I had a failure on Day 1, a failure on Day 2, a failure on Day 3, a failure on Day 4, and no failures since then, and I think that my 100% success comes from two things -- "unconditional permission to eat" on non N Days, and allowing myself to accumulate two non N weekdays per month to be used however I want.
The diet is getting a lot easier. The question is whether I can continue to lose weight. Obviously, I can't be having 3,000 calories of caramel macademian clusters every weekend if I want to lose weight. I am allowing myself to repeat last week's performance. The reason why I think I will lose weight is that I don't want to have one caramel macademian cluster this weekend. Not one. My stomach just did a flip flop because I was thinking about putting one caramel macademian cluster into my mouth.
Kathleen
Two Haagen Dazs bars in the 10 minute drive home from the grocery store... That wasn't the limit of what I've been eating on S Days. Last weekend, we bought a jar of caramel macademian clusters. I looked at the empty jar the next day. There were 23 servings of 2 pieces each at a caloric level of about 230 calories per serving. Calculate that out, and the jar contained about 5,000 calories. I had at least 3,000 calories last weekend of caramel macademian clusters. My weight didn't go below last Saturday's low of 201.4, but that's OK by me. I am sensing that this is my body's way to adjust to a lower set point. To really overeat and be OK with it is reassurance after my years of always about to go on a diet, being on a diet, or out of control eating after a diet. As for declaring your hamster's birthday an S Day, I've opted to limit weekday non N Days to two per month, and I can use them whenever I want and for whatever reason I want.
I've been on this diet now almost six months and, as of last Saturday, was down just over 13 pounds. If I manage to be down 25 pounds by the 1 year mark in September (down to 190), I would be very happy with those results. The tempation is always to try to cut back on S Days, but I think that the result is that you have failures on N Days. I had a failure on Day 1, a failure on Day 2, a failure on Day 3, a failure on Day 4, and no failures since then, and I think that my 100% success comes from two things -- "unconditional permission to eat" on non N Days, and allowing myself to accumulate two non N weekdays per month to be used however I want.
The diet is getting a lot easier. The question is whether I can continue to lose weight. Obviously, I can't be having 3,000 calories of caramel macademian clusters every weekend if I want to lose weight. I am allowing myself to repeat last week's performance. The reason why I think I will lose weight is that I don't want to have one caramel macademian cluster this weekend. Not one. My stomach just did a flip flop because I was thinking about putting one caramel macademian cluster into my mouth.
Kathleen
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brotherjohn
- Posts: 89
- Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:42 am
- Location: Mississippi
Kathleen,
I apologize if I came across as critical of you and your plan. I didn't mean it to be that way it all. I think you are doing splendidly!
I've come to realize that as long as the scale is moving in the right direction (albeit slowly) I am on the right track. If it isn't...well, then I've got to take a hard look at what I am doing, and then regroup.
I look forward to your continued insightful input as we work on this together.
Have a great weekend!
John
I apologize if I came across as critical of you and your plan. I didn't mean it to be that way it all. I think you are doing splendidly!
I've come to realize that as long as the scale is moving in the right direction (albeit slowly) I am on the right track. If it isn't...well, then I've got to take a hard look at what I am doing, and then regroup.
I look forward to your continued insightful input as we work on this together.
Have a great weekend!
John
"Let your moderation be known unto all men. The Lord is at hand." --St. Paul
Read my free weekly devotional rural adventures at:
www.countrypreacherdad.com
Read my free weekly devotional rural adventures at:
www.countrypreacherdad.com
Brotherjohn,
The following is a list of one weight from one Monday of each month of this diet:
1. Day 1 – Monday, September 8, 2008: 215.0
2. Day 36 – Monday, October 13, 2008: 210.2
3. Day 57 – Monday, November 3, 2008: 209.4
4. Day 99 – Monday, December 15, 2008: 208.8
5. Day 120 – Monday, January 5, 2008: 209.2
6. Day 148 – Monday, February 8, 2008: 205.0
This is a summary of Mondays from six months. I was discouraged in January when my weight was down all of .2 pounds from a Monday in November. It can be hard to take a long term perspective on this diet!
If you have N Days that are successes, give yourself several months of the scale not moving before you regroup.
Kathleen
The following is a list of one weight from one Monday of each month of this diet:
1. Day 1 – Monday, September 8, 2008: 215.0
2. Day 36 – Monday, October 13, 2008: 210.2
3. Day 57 – Monday, November 3, 2008: 209.4
4. Day 99 – Monday, December 15, 2008: 208.8
5. Day 120 – Monday, January 5, 2008: 209.2
6. Day 148 – Monday, February 8, 2008: 205.0
This is a summary of Mondays from six months. I was discouraged in January when my weight was down all of .2 pounds from a Monday in November. It can be hard to take a long term perspective on this diet!
If you have N Days that are successes, give yourself several months of the scale not moving before you regroup.
Kathleen
Ah, but notice I wrote '"perfection"' (in quotation marks).I think perfection is sustainable. There are some things that are appropriate to be perfect. For example, infidelity in marriage is a big deal. A failure on that score can wreak havoc on a marriage.
I read about The No S Diet after having read a book, which I no longer have and cannot identify, in which the author said it was important to have "perfect compliance."
It's not perfect compliance that I have an issue with (though I do think, with most endeavors, you want to build in a little fault tolerance lest a sip become a disaster), but what seemed to me to be an overambitious and "puritanical" (note the quotes) goal.
I agree with you that setting up your goals in a way so that perfect compliance is as easy to attain as possible (while still being at least a little meaningful) is VERY important. But I also think that for most people, for most endeavors, some failure is inevitable, and it's important to brace oneself for that. What I like about the habitcal, for instance, is that it gives you strong incentive to be perfect (or at least very good) while letting you roll with the punches a bit should you run into trouble.
Reinhard