1st S Day Apprehension

[sidney202]

I am very new to No S with just three days (all successful!) under my belt. I have felt great every day with no overt hunger or cravings except today when a marathan workday caused me to wait 9 hours between lunch and dinner to eat. Other than that it's been miraculously easy so far.

However, I am approaching my first S Day on Saturday and I am feeling a bit nervous. Seconds and snacks don't phase me, but sweets are my kryptonite. Sometimes even one bite of a sweet starts a no-turning-back slide into Eggo waffle/Ben & Jerry ice cream sandwiches (1 box of Eggos and 2 pints of Ben and Jerry's Mint Chocolate Cookie. Yes, it is not unheard of for me to eat them all in one day.)

I know I am supposed to-- I mean--NEED to "make S Days S Days so N Days aren't", but I just am hoping that indulging in sweets won't set me up to binge on Saturday and then crave come Monday.

If anyone has any lessons learned about this situation, I would really appreciate hearing them.

[Too solid flesh]

Welcome, Callie! You are off to a great start.

You might like to check Reinhard's podcast Episode 34: S-days Gone Wild

http://everydaysystems.com/podcast/episode.php?id=34

and KCCC's "Phases of No S" post:

http://everydaysystems.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=6437

A lot of people on the bulletin board find that good habits from an established N day routine start to carry over to S days. We all have occasional aberations, but my experience has been that S days just gradually got better over time.

[sidney202]

Thanks Too Solid Flesh,

I had previously read KCCC's post on the stages of No S. Her description of the process of getting to what I call "food freedom" is one of the reasons I feel No S is going to be exactly what I have been looking for for a long time.

And thanks for the tip about "S Days Gone Wild". I think I remember seeing another post recommending it (might have been in KCCC's "Stages of No S post?), so definitely I will check it out.

In your personal experience, how long was it before your S Days began to moderate?

[Too solid flesh]

Sorry, Callie, it was several years ago now and I can't remember exactly how long it took. A matter of months, I think, and some deeper rooted changes (like being able to eat part of an individual serving of ice cream, realise that I had had enough, and throw the rest away) took years. Others will be able to answer this question better than I can.

[sidney202]

Too solid flesh,

I appreciate you sharing your estimated timeframes. They provide me a realistic view of how long that part of the "healing" can take.

I'd love to hear others' stories of how their S days moderated over time.

[oliviamanda]

In the beginning, I was able to control myself on S days because I found that after not having the "kryptonite" all week, that it actually tasted a little too sweet for me and I could stop after a bite or two or a few. I also was losing weight rapidly and I felt that I didn't want to hinder it by loading up on the S's just because I could.

[Sienna]

I was pretty fortunate in that I settled in to sane S days pretty fast and without a lot of stress - but I know where you are coming from, because I was also terrified of binging and ruining all of my N days.

My recommendation? Focus on quality over quantity.

When I was starting out I tried to only buy more expensive sweets (so no $1 bag of Hershey kissess...) in smaller quantity. I found it easier to do because I had the financial barrier on top of just trying not to go bonkers. Plus, I only bought better tasting stuff, so I wasn't wasting calories (whether you actually count them or not, they still exist) on crap, but getting a really savorable treat.

And pretty soon, I didn't even *want* the junk anymore. So now if I'm going to have a sweet (and I love my sweets), it's going to be an awesome sweet that is so worth it that it satisfies my cravings rather than sparking a binge.

[Starla]

Welcome, Callie; is sounds like you're doing great!

I've had some very bad S days, but they're usually pretty moderate. As oliviamanda said, when you're not eating sweets all week, they just don't taste the same on weekends. What I found happening was that I wanted BETTER sweets, not more sweets. It probably took me a month or two to work that out. My S days work best when I indulge in a treat each day, and it's something I really like.

Good luck! And don't worry if you go overboard this weekend. This is a process that should last the rest of your life; it really doesn't matter if you eat too much tomorrow. What matters is that you're learning new habits. If there are a few bumps in the road, so what? Have you ever learned anything without making an occasional mistake?

[BrightAngel]

I know I am supposed to-- I mean--NEED to "make S Days S Days so N Days aren't", but I just am hoping that indulging in sweets won't set me up to binge on Saturday and then crave come Monday.

If anyone has any lessons learned about this situation, I would really appreciate hearing them.

Just because it is an "S" day,
doesn't mean sweets or snacks or seconds are REQUIRED.
It just means there's no RULE against them.
It isn't permission to binge.
Following N day principles on S days is a good thing.

Remember, Reinhard's No S is actually:
....except SOMETIMES on S days.
Also, don't forget his basic warning:
"Don't be an IDOT.

[sidney202]

@oliviamanda: Sweets that taste too sweet? Wow, I should be so lucky. From your mouth to God's ears!

@BrightAngel, I was drawn to the idea in the book that says (paraphrased loosely) if we don't indulge at least a little on S days, we may eventually binge out of resentment from being too pious. This resonated with me, because this is exactly what I have done in the past: I try to overachieve at self-deprivation ("if 1200 calories is good, 1000 must be better!"), fail miserably, binge out of regret and shame, wash, rinse, repeat. So for me, I think I need to indulge (even if only a little bit) whether I want to or not. At least at the beginning. As I grow and feel more comfortable, I will probably experiement with having fewer S's. How ironic and wonderful it is that on this eating plan, I must talk myself into eating sweets!

@Sienna and @Starla: It sounds like you both are keen on quality over quantity, and it's funny you should mention this. Earlier today, I was flirting with the idea of getting Hotcakes and Sausage from McDonalds. (I know, I know, gross, right?) But now, maybe I will go someplace and get a great Belgian waffle, which I love. I am really encouraged by both of your stories of how your S days moderated over time. This gives me confidence to trust the process a bit more.

Thanks to everyone for your ideas and insights. Tomorrow is the big day. Wish me luck!

[BrightAngel]

I think I need to indulge (even if only a little bit)
whether I want to or not.
At least at the beginning.
How ironic and wonderful it is that on this eating plan,
I must talk myself into eating sweets!

It sounds like you may not understand the Concept,
which is....that on S days...
there is NO WAY that you MUST eat.
It's a personal choice "free" day.

Eating extra on No S days....
....is Allowed, but not an Essential Element.
These free choice periods are merely intended as a "release valve"
to let off pressure.
IF THERE IS NO INNER PRESSURE
THERE"S NO NEED TO RELEASE THE VALVE.

Based on your statements:
....."whether I want to or not"....
and ......"I must talk myself into eating sweets"....
it sounds like you may be mentally setting yourself up for Habits of Failure.

However, each of works No S as he/she thinks best,
and there's really no wrong way.

[oolala53]

I second the idea that there is no requirement to eat snacks, sweets, or seconds. I personally have been struggling terribly with this, and I think it was partly because I set myself up to think I HAD to have all these things whenever the whim struck on S days, even after many weeks of N day compliance in my first few months of No S. I still don't quite know how to curtail myself. No matter what mod I try to set, I've found I haven't been able to keep myself to it even after 11 months. I've tried to make rules about all my worst offenders, but when the moment comes, I can talk myself into indulging in anything because S days are supposed to be free.

I actually wish now I had started with some mods, though that is recommended against. It was pretty easy to get used to N days, and I think it would have been better for me to get used to more sanity on my S days to start. (I was a person who was used to eating a whole bag of Hershey's kisses at a sitting, and then a pint of Hagendaz later, even though I was feeling rotten.) However, it could have backfired, but I don't know if it would have been much worse than what I do now.

Don't get me wrong. I still think No S is better than anything else for the long run, and I plan to keep plugging away. My newest mod is to not eat any sweets unless I am with other people. Bingeing when I'm alone is my worst problem, and I tend to have a lot of alone-time on weekends for a variety of reasons, some of which I can't avoid. I also think I won't allow myself snacks unless I'm at Costco or someplace where the size and time of exposure is limited. I don't usually have a problem with seconds. Since we are down to the last month of 2010, I'm thinking the pressure is on, so I may be able to tough it out. I really believe if I can do it for just a few weekends, the trend will be set.

I started the thread called "Ongoing support for S days, which I'm going to go post on soon to bring it up in the queue. I admit it doesn't have a lot of posting going on, as I think a lot of people here try to align with Reinhard's avoidance of computer use with his Weekend Luddite rule. However, just having a place to go write when you're struggling can be a help. In fact, that's why I'm even here today, and it has pretty much worked, as it has helped delayed my eating too early a dinner, though I will be eating earlier than usual because I have an event to attend tonight.

[sidney202]

@BrightAngel,
Thanks for illuminating that quote. When re-reading that portion of my post, I can see how I was unclear. I understand that I am not strictly required to eat sweets. What I was trying to do is learn to strike the balance between all out piggydom and Quaker-like austerity. Based upon my past dieting experiences, its clear one bite of a sweet can lead to a binge, and its also clear that being too strict can also eventually lead to a binge. Based upon my understanding of this trait in myself, and based upon the passage in the book that reads "If you want to be proactive, ward off binges by actively rewarding yourself with the treat you want most....Remember, binging is mostly about revenge--don't give yourself the pretext for it." , I had decided that to employ the "proactive" step of having a sweet this weekend. Twisted logic? Maybe. Scary? Definitely. Despite being a completely counterintuitive solution, I am prepared to take the book's suggestion at face value and give this tactic a shot. I hope doing so won't set me up for habits of failure.

And @oohlala53, after reading your post, I can see why BrightAngel warns against feeling obligated to eat a sweet. It is such a slippery slope! I like your idea of limiting your exposure. It is kind of like the No S principle of limiting our meals to plate size, only you are limiting your access to food by your location. Good luck with sticking with this in December! You say you wish you had started with some mods. That piqued my curiosity. What would you have started with?

[DaveMc]

The slope may be slippery, but maybe you should try it out a bit before you put on your cleats ... maybe you won't need them after all, or maybe you won't need them after a while. Before your first S day is arguably too soon to panic.

But I understand where you're coming from, in terms of not wanting to go nuts, especially if you have a history of doing that. For me, S days are what make NoS sustainable in the long term: I can't follow the "never eat ice cream again" diet forever, but I can stick with "don't eat ice cream until the weekend" indefinitely. So you're right that you're not doing yourself any favours, in the long term, by being "extra virtuous" and abstaining from all sweets on S days: it's likely to cause you to give up completely in the long run.

A lot of people find that their initial fears of crazy binging are unfounded, or that they fade over a few months. (I was never a binge eater, so I'm a bad example, but I'd say that my S days got more moderate over the first three or four months, if you're looking for a rough timeline.) If you're concerned about binging because of things you know about yourself, there's good advice offered above: you can accomplish the goal of giving yourself a treat in a more moderate way by having some extra rules. But keep an eye on yourself for a while, and see how it goes: you may find that your tendency to binge isn't as bad as you thought, or that the absence of sweets all week makes you satisfied with less. (That was the big change, for me.)

I guess it's already the big day, as I post this ... Good luck, and don't fret too much! You've got a long time to get this right, so even if things don't go exactly as you'd like, today, you've got months and years ahead, and it will go right eventually!

[sidney202]

@DaveMc,

Thank you very much for your encouraging post. I have only been at this No S thing for 5 days now, and yes, I will admit to some preemptive panic at the idea of anything that could threaten the fledgling success I have experienced so far. I just really want this No S thing to work for me. So like a little kid learning to swim, I opt to use some dietary water wings while I learn to trust the process and gather my courage to swim in the deep end. My goal is to move toward full-freedom S days eventually, and the more I hear successful stories of how S days moderate over time, I get a little closer to being ready to dive in...but I am not there just yet!

That said, I executed my plan to eat a mandatory S today as part of one of my 3 one-plate meals. (I thought I came up with the idea of having a "mandatory S". Turns out, this technique is touched upon in the book!) And, so far, so good. I didn't feel any sense of deprivation, and I completely deflated my perfectionistic tendency to challenge myself to some unrealistic goal ("let's see if I can have no S's today!") by starting my day with an S: pancakes and real maple syrup. Result: no urge to binge. What a relief. I feel confident tomorrow will go really well, too.

To all who posted on this thread: You encouraging comments and insights helped me get through my first S day mentally and physically intact. I thank you very, very much.