Why is this getting harder?

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:30 am

I was going strong on no-s for a few weeks and then BAM I hit a brick wall, got extremely hungry and binged. This one binge has led to several days of binge eating. I get back on track and then I get very hungry around 4pm and I get the shakes and then I find I am just too hungry to just have the 1 plate and before I know it I am having a binge which leads to more and more of this horrible behaviour.

I am totally humilated sharing this because all of you must think I'm absolutely pathetic.

This binge eating has taken over my life again and I've been doing it all week and feel terrible about it.

I am starting over again tomorrow on no-s and am determined to do this because I know for a fact that 1 bite outside of a plate leads to more snacking, and more snacking and then a full on binge.

Why is this getting harder? I know a lot of this has to do with PMS (sorry to any men if you are reading this). My hunger is quite out of control this time of the month which is making this difficult but I need to deal with this because I can't let this dereail me every month.

When I first started 3 weeks ago I was going strong even after 1 fail day but now I just can't seem to find my way. I guess I have no choice but to just do it day by day until it becomes a habit.

I was just about to erase this post but I need the encouragement no matter how humiliated I am because I want to succeed at this more than anything. I honestly, truly do. I have to get this weight off once and for all and now I weigh even more than when I started this 3 weeks ago.

Eileen7316 · Post by **Eileen7316** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:53 am

http://everydaysystems.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=7155

You just posted this 3 days ago. Take a deep breath and relax.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:06 am

I know... that's why I feel so pathetic. Think I'm going to get off this board and figure this problem out some way or for myself.

Sienna · Post by **Sienna** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:10 am

I know that I'm pretty big on not worrying about mods until you have the habits down, but I do kind of make an exception when a mod might make it easier.

If you *know* your binges are triggered by getting too hungry between lunch and dinner, maybe you need to add in a mini-meal between lunch and dinner. So now you get 3 meals and a mini-meal, in order to better get handle on the Habits.

I also think you need to calm down and stop being so hard on yourself. And a question, are you taking S days as S days? 2 a week? Or have you changed that? For me (and YMMV), being consistent about allowing and enjoying S days was (and is) really important to staying on track on N days.

Sienna · Post by **Sienna** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:17 am

You don't need to get off the board (unless you think that that will be helpful for you).

I think Eileen was just trying to remind you of your own very positive attitude from a few days ago.

EVERYONE goes through ups and downs - in all of life, but especially during the weight loss process. You are just having a down day. There WILL be up days too.

So stay away if you need to for your own mental health, but support is what this board is for - and there is plenty to go around.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:28 am

I know. I'm pre-menstrual and not myself from all the sugar I had today. I am committed to no-s because I know this is the only thing that will help me and I know how good I felt when I was on track.

I just got unravelled and am finding it hard to get back on track for some strange reason.

I am so tired of saying "this is my last binge" because I love being on track. I am just going to have to perservere and along with relaxing about everything I just need to go on autopilot with this and just do it... it's not that difficult and it's not going to kill me to go 5 hours without eating.

Over43 · Post by **Over43** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:44 am

Make a try at eating a day of low glycemic/low carb, that should reduce your hunger and get you back on track. This is a no sugar/no carb appraoch per se, but during the week, if you make the effort to skip the starches (as (as I call them) it sets the tone.

NoSRocks · Post by **NoSRocks** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:08 am

Hi Nicole and so sorry to hear you're struggling this week. However, if you can PLEASE do not leave the board since I really enjoy reading your posts and I can identify so much with what you have written and how you are feeling. ((((HUGS)))))))))

I also wanted to say that I have not been finding it so easy myself, this being my second attempt at No S. I somehow think the weather and the general 'slump' after the holidays has a lot to answer for.

No pressure hun

but whenever I think of giving into temptation, I think of the great advice you have been giving me through your responses etc. and it helps somewhat. I've not been perfect this week, had a few nibbles here and there - I work around food and whenever I hit the supermarket I get tempted by all the goodies. I'm one for impulse buying too - I seem to get a 'kick' out of buying desserts etc., saving them for S Days.

I have been telling myself that I'm going to be strict on S Days compared to the last time I was on the plan because I got impatient and hit a plateau. However (as an S Day AT LAST approaches!.. hasn't this been a looong week???) I don't think that is such a good idea since I'm only starting back on No S and by being too strict, I could blow it.

It's easy to say but if it is of any help hon, I would say just keep trying with the No S plan but ONLY when you're ready and if you have a bad day on No S, then just write it off and keep going (sorry that sounded so flippant as I know how I've been feeling this past few weeks but you know what I mean).
I think you're well ahead of the game since you have NOT totally given up on the No S plan and you have continued to post. WELL DONE!!

NoSRocks · Post by **NoSRocks** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:25 am

PS: Nicole, just a suggestion - I don't know if you like mushrooms or not, but I find them pretty delicious and I think they're pretty low in calories.

This past day or so, when I hit the 4 pm slump ....yes, there IS something about that time of day, isn't there?

I put some mushrooms into a bowl and microwaved them for 2 minutes on high. You don't even need to add anything! They are so juicy and delicious and taste almost like the fried version - which I LOVE! Now, I guess you could say that was an N day fail however, they are so low in calories, I'm sure one could give it a try. I don't think they would do much 'harm' other than if following the No S plan to the letter, it does mean you'd be breaking the rules. (Actually, if anyone has any information/opinions on this, I would be interested to hear!) I guess if you didn't like mushrooms, you could try some other low calorie veg or even something like pickled onions that are far more interesting than chomping on dry lettuce! But there is something so delicious and satisfying about the mushrooms that I haven't tried anything else.

Now guys, as mentioned I know it is considered cheating on the No S plan since you are eating between meals! What I have done this past day or so, is just have my dinner which is usually around 5 - 5.30 pm and omit the vegetables from my plate to make up for the mushrooms I ate at 4 pm.

I would like to emphasize that this is basically an experiment/something I discovered a few days ago, and I am not going to make sweeping statements about losing lots of pounds etc, etc, now that I am eating barrel loads of mushrooms (LOL) however if it stops me from bingeing not to mention, boosting my vegetable intake at the same time, then I think it might be a good idea. Does anyone have any advice or opinions on this?

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:00 am

My question is, why do you think what you're going through is abnormal? More people probably have gone through something like this than have not. No-S often gets more difficult after a few weeks, and after a while, things get "back to normal."

It could also be related to what you eat. Take a look at this. I think a lot of problems are caused by the processed, something-reduced (calories, carbs, fat), chemical-laden foods we eat.

You're going to have good days, bad days and downright awful days. That's normal, especially in the beginning. But I think those of us who have been around for a few years still have the (very) occasional bad or awful day.

Also, make sure you're eating enough. Don't skimp at meals -- make sure it's 3 plates full. If you are satisfied before you finish a full plate, that's fine. In fact, it's probably better than finishing a less-than-full plate and then being hungry a few hours later.

gk · Post by gk » Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:21 pm

gettheweightoff-

Don't feel bad about your last post - you are not alone! I, too, have a problem once I hit the 4 pm time. This is my second time around on this diet and I am struggling 10 times more than I did before the holidays. Sometimes I even consider chucking the whole thing and just trying to eat in moderation wtihout all the rules. But then I remember why I started this in the first place......because I have NO control when I try that and end up bingeing all the time. Right now it's a constant struggle for me, so I'm experiementing with mods, hoping I'll eventually find something that will click with me. I barely hang on during the week and then totally binge on the weekend. Soooo....starting next week, I'm going to have two "floating S Days". If I remember right, he advised against that in his book, but I'm willing to give it a shot anyway. I'm going to try to keep them evenly spaced (i.e. Wednesday and Saturday or Sunday), but if I know I have a "trigger moment" coming up that week, I'll plan it for that day. We'll see.

You're welcome to drop by my daily check-in thread anytime for support if you'd like. I've found this bulletin to be extremely helpful,and know without a doubt that I would've stopped trying a LONG time ago without it! Hang in there! You'll get through this....and when you do, you'll be so glad you stuck with it!

Oh, I also read one testamonial every morning at the start of my day, as sort of a jumpstart for my willpower. It actually helps!!

Good luck!!

Blithe Morning · Post by **Blithe Morning** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:43 pm

NoSRocks wrote: Does anyone have any advice or opinions on this?

(shrug). It's not vanilla No S. But if that's your mod, that's your mod. Sometimes, you need to modify to get to vanilla No S. Sometimes, you need to modify to make vanilla No S sustainable.

One of the outcomes of the diet industry and the resulting collective case of diet head is that we now rely on "experts" to tell us if we are doing it right. While consulting experts is good and even recommended, we have lost the ability to be grown ups about diet and exercise and make reasonable adult decisions for ourselves.

The way I see it is that the underlying principle of No S is "you don't eat what you want, when you want." No S gives a specific, measureable, attainable, realistic, trackable (in others words SMART) way of implementing that principle that is culturally and socially appropriate.

No S requires its adherents to be adults because no one is going to give you a list. You have to make up your own list. You have to actually figure out for yourself that eating fast food for every meal is not a good (or particularly inexpensive) idea. You have to learn for yourself if having a veggie snack at 4PM will eventually turn into veggies, and cheese, and crackers, and peanut butter, and jelly, and cookies at 3:30PM, 3:00PM, all afternoon after lunch ....

The reason I will do No S for the rest of my life is that No S expects me, no - REQUIRES me - to be the adult. I think it's part of "personal responsbility".

But don't get me started on that.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 6:02 pm

NoSRocks wrote: Now guys, as mentioned I know it is considered cheating on the No S plan since you are eating between meals! What I have done this past day or so, is just have my dinner which is usually around 5 - 5.30 pm and omit the vegetables from my plate to make up for the mushrooms I ate at 4 pm.

I would like to emphasize that this is basically an experiment/something I discovered a few days ago, and I am not going to make sweeping statements about losing lots of pounds etc, etc, now that I am eating barrel loads of mushrooms (LOL) however if it stops me from bingeing not to mention, boosting my vegetable intake at the same time, then I think it might be a good idea. Does anyone have any advice or opinions on this?

My only "problem" with this is that I don't think you're increasing your vegetable intake and are, in fact, limiting it to just one vegetable -- at least at dinner.

I think you could/should eat the vegetables at dinner, too.

Eileen7316 · Post by **Eileen7316** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 6:57 pm

No, don't leave the board! I was just trying to keep you from making a rash, impulsive decision. Breathe........

I think maybe you are relying too much on your feelings, instead of trying to establish the habit of 3 meals a day.

I tend to be an impulsive person, and I have learned over the years to just give things some time. If I have made a decision to stick with something for a period of time, then I have to not cave to my "feelings" when things get hard. I can do hard things! And SO CAN YOU!

Someone on this board has talked about building the "muscle" of resisting temptations. Each time you successfully do it, it gets easier the next time because you are stronger. I think Reinhard, Wosnes, and KCCC have all talked about this.

Good luck to you! And keep saying, "I CAN do hard things!"

Kevin · Post by **Kevin** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:21 pm

Do you need a small fourth meal at 4:00? What are you eating at lunch? Enough?

There are times when I had to add a small fourth meal at 4:00 for a few days or weeks. It's no big deal. It sure beats the heck out of binging. And I don't have the additional monthly stressor that you do (being a man, I mean).

gettheweightoff wrote:I was going strong on no-s for a few weeks and then BAM I hit a brick wall, got extremely hungry and binged. This one binge has led to several days of binge eating. I get back on track and then I get very hungry around 4pm and I get the shakes and then I find I am just too hungry to just have the 1 plate and before I know it I am having a binge which leads to more and more of this horrible behaviour.

I am totally humilated sharing this because all of you must think I'm absolutely pathetic.

This binge eating has taken over my life again and I've been doing it all week and feel terrible about it.

I am starting over again tomorrow on no-s and am determined to do this because I know for a fact that 1 bite outside of a plate leads to more snacking, and more snacking and then a full on binge.

Why is this getting harder? I know a lot of this has to do with PMS (sorry to any men if you are reading this). My hunger is quite out of control this time of the month which is making this difficult but I need to deal with this because I can't let this dereail me every month.

When I first started 3 weeks ago I was going strong even after 1 fail day but now I just can't seem to find my way. I guess I have no choice but to just do it day by day until it becomes a habit.

I was just about to erase this post but I need the encouragement no matter how humiliated I am because I want to succeed at this more than anything. I honestly, truly do. I have to get this weight off once and for all and now I weigh even more than when I started this 3 weeks ago.

Kevin · Post by **Kevin** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:27 pm

Fungal, actually.:P But mushrooms are fibrous and have lots of protein, I think.

NoSRocks wrote: ...not to mention, boosting my vegetable intake at the same time, then I think it might be a good idea. Does anyone have any advice or opinions on?

BrightAngel · Post by **BrightAngel** » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:31 pm

gettheweightoff wrote:This binge eating has taken over my life again
and I've been doing it all week and feel terrible about it.

I need the encouragement no matter
I have to get this weight off once and for all.

I have had difficulties with binge eating for all my life.

During this past 3 years I've posted a lot of information in my personal check-in Thread
Perhaps there will be something there that strikes a chord with you...
something that will be helpful to you in some way.

Please feel free to PM me at any time,

if you think I can be of help to you.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:45 am

THANK YOU EVERYONE!

I started no-s all over again and I DID IT! I feel soooooooo much better. I can't explain what a relief it felt like today not to binge and I found so much comfort in the 3 plates. I kept myself busy cleaning and working inbetween meals.

I had 1 coffee in the morning with my breakfast and started feeling shaky after lunch. I kept thinking it was the lack of snacking that was causing my shakes lately -- which is one of the main reasons for the first binge of the week --but now I realize that it is the coffee that is giving me the shakes. I am majorly addicted because I wanted another one in the afternoon but I did not cave. I managed to go the entire afternoon without a drink and I DID IT!!!!

I love no-s. I don't know what I was thinking but now that I have experienced a completely hellish week of binge eating and how wonderful and sane I felt when I did No-S today I KNOW 100% that this is the only way for me to be.

I still feel pretty depressed at how much more weight I gained and how my clothes don't fit etc. but you know what it was a good lesson and I will never have to go through this again. This is the biggest I will weigh.

I forced myself not to count calories today and just enjoy my meals. I decided to accept myself the way I am or will be once the post binge bloat is gone and tone up and give all my small clothes away. I just don't think it's realistic for me at 40 to try and get back into my size 0 clothes. Too much pressure and why should I be so miserable trying to fit into them. I don't think I'll ever get into a 2, maybe not even a 4 again either. It's time to just face the facts and accept it.

Anyways, thank you all for your support. I am not giving up. In fact it's only GREEN days from now on! I'm NOT going back to that hell of bingeing again. What I went through this past week was scary and out of control and very depressing and I just can't do this to myself again. My body hurts and my clothes are cutting off my circulation!

Only positive posts from here on in!

Kevin · Post by **Kevin** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:20 am

That's a long time after coffee to feel shaky. Did you have a lot of carbohydrate with lunch? At another lunch, try skipping the bread/potatoes/pasta. See if you feel less shaky. Look up "glycemic index" on Google and try picking foods with low scores.

It's just a thought, but it is one that works for many. Many people over-produce insulin when exposed to highly refined carbohydrate, which just leads to craving more carbohydrate.

gettheweightoff wrote:THANK YOU EVERYONE!

I had 1 coffee in the morning with my breakfast and started feeling shaky after lunch.

NoSRocks · Post by **NoSRocks** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:38 am

Thanks guys for your opinions on the mushrooms...

Upon reading over what I wrote, I feel a bit embarrassed since it sounds like I was talking out of my ahem... diet head ....It does sound a bit like splitting hairs when I'm still having to question whether something as innocuous as a mushroom could cause 'harm' i.e. weight gain, doesn't it? And I had given some further thought to it after I posted: you're right, there would be nothing wrong in having additional vegetables with dinner since they're pretty nutritious anyway. She says, trying to avoid saying low in calorie and non fattening and so on ....

You can tell I still have a long way to go until I finally get out of the diet head way of thinking!

Anyway - rambling over! I just wanted to come back on and say a big congratulations to you Nicole for your successful day on No S and it was a joy to read your upbeat post this evening. I also wanted to add that even if you felt you had to take a break from the board, i.e. posting etc. that's perfectly understandable....even though you'll be sorely missed

Talking about my own perspective here, I stress - given my current state of mind (food and weight wise) I am not sure if its a help or a hindrance for me to log my food intake regularly on the board since I feel sometimes I'm putting too much emphasis on food etc. and my aim at the end of the day is to put food to the back burner and not be uppermost on my mind all of the time.

Have a great weekend everyone.

NoSRocks · Post by **NoSRocks** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:47 am

PS Nicole: sorry if this seems like a silly question, but when you say you're doing only Green Days from now on does this mean you're not going to take any S Days at all? Just curious.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 3:58 am

Thanks NoSRocks! I'll still be on the board.. I'm just not going to be so obsessive, trying to be so perfect and chill a bit more. Thanks for all your support.

When I said "green" days I meant no more binges which means no more "red" days.

I am feeling a lot better and determined. I feel like no-s when done right cures my binge problem.

As far as the shakes go I had a steak sandwich on whole wheat bread with coleslaw and some snap peas. I have been having the shakes since drinking so much coffee (up to 4 a day which is really a lot for me). Do you think it was the bread? For breakfast I had scrambled eggs, 3 pieces of bacon and 1/2 piece of low carb soy bread with butter, coffee w milk. No shakes.

I'll experiment and see what happens.

exdieter · Post by **exdieter** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:26 am

Heya Nicole --

Coffee gives me the shakey hungries -- hours and hours after I have it -- and always seems to trigger overeating for me. So I think you could definitely be onto something.

In fact, just did a quick google and found we are not alone. Here are links to a bunch of articles about caffeine causing hunger: http://yinningnyanging.blogspot.com/200 ... ungry.html

I've switched to decaf for the most part, but I know that isn't possible for everybody. (incidentally, I didn't today, and had to eat a piece of pizza between meals. Yay for S-days!).

Another thing that helps is to drink my caffeine in a latte (I think milk or soy milk makes it less harsh on my stomach).

Also, my No-S rule is that I will ALWAYS will have a snack if I get shakey. For me, I know that shakies always preceed a binge. So I don't ever try to ride out the shakes. One thing -- my snack is always a piece of fruit, a big glass of milk, or a decaf latte (sometimes soy latte).

It's a learning process. You can do it!

(((hugs)))))

exdieter · Post by **exdieter** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 4:27 am

Also -- love this quote: â€œIronically, caffeine can make it more difficult to lose weight because it stimulates insulin secretion, which reduces serum glucose, which in turn can increase hungerâ€.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:01 am

Kevin wrote:That's a long time after coffee to feel shaky. Did you have a lot of carbohydrate with lunch? At another lunch, try skipping the bread/potatoes/pasta. See if you feel less shaky. Look up "glycemic index" on Google and try picking foods with low scores.

It's just a thought, but it is one that works for many. Many people over-produce insulin when exposed to highly refined carbohydrate, which just leads to craving more carbohydrate.

gettheweightoff wrote:THANK YOU EVERYONE!

I had 1 coffee in the morning with my breakfast and started feeling shaky after lunch.

I agree about coffee and the shakes; I don't think it's the coffee. I'd also look at what you're eating just prior to feeling shaky.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 8:03 pm

So after saying 1 coffee yesterday and then 2 today I realize that I am majorly addicted. And since this experiment I can tell that it is definitely the coffee that is giving me the shakes.

I just went to the cupboard and threw out my instant and organic ground coffee and am quitting for sure.

Water and lemon, plain water and herbal teas from now on.

I am so determined that with no-s and no caffeine I will be a healthier and less stresed and less addicted person!

(Day 2 BTW having started over and doing fine).

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:15 pm

I don't think you're addicted to coffee/caffeine. I think you're sensitive to it. Huge difference.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:54 pm

Sensitive re: shakes yes,

I think I am addicted because I can't go a day without it and when I have a cup I want another one which always leads to more and more. It definitely controls me and not the other way around which is why I know I have to quit. My husband even noticed and commented that I am addicted as he recently quit and I guess can see it more than I can.

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:25 pm

I think somewhere between 1 week in and the first month might be the maximum point of difficulty for No S.

At first, it's new and exciting. Just about any diet is sustainable for a week. This is why some ridiculous crash diets seem to work for some people. After that, the newness and excitement wear off.

It takes about a month to establish new habits, according to researchers on human behavior. No S gets easier after the habits get established, as many people on this board can tell you.

Unfortunately, there's that gap between the initial enthusiasm and establishing new habits.

I think there's also a learning curve on learning to eat sustainably on a three-meal pattern, especially for people coming off other diets. Lots of other diets restrict what you can eat at meals to the point where, if that's all you ate, you wouldn't be able to make it to the next meal without a snack. You have to get into a pattern of eating more at meals to get through to the next one without snacks.

Most people will eventually get used to eating less, and not need to eat so much at meals, but that takes time. You can't rush the process. As Wernher von Braun once said about the space program, "Crash programs fail because they are based on the theory that with nine women pregnant, you can get a baby in one month". Building habits is another process that just can't be successfully sped up.

It's a leap of faith, committing to something that has you eating what seems like too much at meals. Leaps of faith are not always easy to take.

gettheweightoff · Post by **gettheweightoff** » Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:36 pm

Thank you Nicest of the Damned

What a great way to explain this. It totally makes sense and now that I've had the experience of not being on plan and basically going nuts I appreciate it that much more.

Day 3 of my vanilla re-start and all green!

Thanks again for posting that. It was a big help.

Everyday Systems

Why is this getting harder?

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