Everyday Systems

This is quite fun; a variation on the BMI calculator that shows how your body fat compares with the rest of your country and the world.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18770328

Interesting. I had no idea that the Pacific Islands were the most obese. I thought that distinction went to the US.

Even though I'm smack dab in the middle of my BMI range I am below average for women in my age group (45-59) both for the US and the world. This actually makes me wonder about the BMI as an indicator. Should it be tweaked according to age?

Yeaheah! I made 90% and 92%... Well, OK. Back to the diet...

BMI is a TERRIBLE metric for obesity. Bad, bad science.

If you want to get really scientific, body fat percentage is much better.

(Which still has me as quite overfat, mind you)

Yep, BMI is terrible. When I was skinny, my BMI was 23.8. And that was unhealthy...

Having tried it out, I think I doubt the veracity of the figures. I mean, I'm obese. That's a fact. But I doubt that I am heavier than 100% of the entire world, which is what my result was.

I don't think they mean that we're heavier than 100% of the world! I think all they mean is that we are heavier (or have a higher BMI) than average person. I already knew that I'd a higher than average BMI. It just tells me my BMI is higher than the average person in each of those countries. I'm not surprised that there isn't a country where the AVERAGE woman of my age and size is heavier than me. That WOULD surprise me. Actually, I was surprised how close Tonga got - I thought I'd be way above all the country's averages.

I think that only means "You're heavier than 100% of the persons from the world who are of your height and age, and that came to our site". I think they're refining the stats with every person who fill in the form.

This was fun. Thanks for sharing. I was below average in US even though I am overweight. That is not good.

Thanks for,that link. BTW, Imwas not surprised about the South Pacific Islanders. In their case it is a combination of genetics and modern foods. It is my understanding that they weighed more than Europeans at time of discovery (look at Gaugain's paintings). However there has been experiments with the Pima Indians in America that showed returning to a diet of native foods pretty much fixed the modern obesity problem. I am assuming that a native food diet would do the same for the Islanders.

That said, him is completely useless for anyone who is thin (but carrying waist fat) or has a lot of muscle.

A better measurement is hip to waist ratio

http://www.bmi-calculator.net/waist-to- ... alculator/

Of course, I really am obese so for me the bmi is accurate. Maybe I should move to Tonga--apparently I'd fit in there.

I take comfort from the waist to hip ratio. (NO matter how much weight I gain, I don't lose my waist).

But I'm still overfat! Mebbe I should join you in Tonga!

I apparently belong in Sudan.

I would regard this chart as just a comparative measure of weight to height and ignore the reference to obesity.

I can't believe I came up as most like the French. There is no way I am thin like those gals. And I'm not aiming to be.

The Pacific Islanders seem to value being heavy, as well as having been affected by modern foods. I know Samoan students who have NO intention of losing weight and they are way above average.

I think I was more surprised by Egypt, which has a large number of people in poverty. Their heavies must be pretty big to balance out the poor. There is definitely a CORRELATION between poverty and low body weight.

The mean BMI in Ethiopia is around 19. Many American celebrities have BMI's under 18.5, which is considered the lowest in the "normal" category. but they sure are admired for it.

Although I think there is a CORRELATION between weight/BMI and health issues in populations, I don't think it's predictive for individuals. And I'm also not convinced that bodyfat is that much better, although trainers would like you to believe differently. The French and Italians have the lowest BMI's in Europe, and pretty good health statistics, but their populations don't look very "cut" to me. That's not a criticism. You don't have to be an athlete to be long-lived. In fact, some athletic pursuits may cut your life short. Moderation, people!

Ah, right, I misread their description of what the results meant.

IIRC, BMI was originally intended to be used like this, that is, as a statistic for characterising populations. Its limitations as an indicator of personal health have been discussed at length by many others, though.

It's interesting that Pacific Islanders are at the top of the range, given that historically a larger body size was considered more attractive in these cultures. A convergence of genetics and cultural practice?

Oolala, I've read somewhere (perhaps one of Anne Barone's Chic and Slim books) that the French are not necessarily thin-thin, but are normal weight.

Oolala : not all girls in France are thin, and most of them are not. (I'm a Frenchman, I can tell) They are of various figures and sizes, and overweight and obesity are growing problems. (Not yet at the level of the USA, but the government fears that it becomes so) Of the 7 girls that work in the same team as I, 3 of them are thin, and 1 of these 3 is "thin-thin". The others can be qualified as "normal size".

TUK wrote:Oolala : not all girls in France are thin, and most of them are not. (I'm a Frenchman, I can tell).

TUK, I appreciate the "eyes on the ground" report. I'm sure you will feel it's your duty to look at women from now on. You know, just so you can report back here about French waistlines. All in the interest of science, of course.

TUK, I didn't mean to imply that all French women are very thin. However, they do have the lowest BMI average in Europe, or near it. Plus things may have changed. I just know when I lived and traveled overseas, and worked with foreign students here in the States, when I saw a very thin woman, she was usually French. May have been a fluke.

The odds in the States would dictate that out of a random group of 7 women, it would be unlikely that all be either thin or "normal" size.

I was just surprised because after puberty, I was of a healthy BMI but definitely thicker than many of my peers and have never been on the slender side. No S has had me decrease my weight while my peers have been gaining.

Blithe Morning, oolala: Did not mean to be offensive, so if so, please forgive me.

I am French, so I may not have a reliable point of comparison with United States. When I went too US, I was to young to care about these problems. (obesity and such, although I was very overweight for a French person)

The French mentality, as I perceive it in many women here (and men to a lesser extent), is to consider that having half a handful of fat on the belly is being fat. I agree that probably, a French girl telling an average US woman "I have weight to lose" would make the US woman laugh to the ground. But it's not so uncommon, and it's frightening.

There is a French doctor, Dr Dukan, that came up some years ago with a high-protein diet that works "rather well". (Rapid loss, long stabilization) He reports that 5 million people in France have used this diet. (Including my wife and I) Man, that's 10% of the total population! And it's not a 70lbs loss every time.

Most people considering themselves "fat" in France should be called "sedentary-shaped" at most. But there are infomercials and ads and commercials for diet food everywhere in France.

Double post delete.

TUK wrote:Blithe Morning, oolala: Did not mean to be offensive, so if so, please forgive me.

No offense taken on my part! I was just teasing you. Because, really, don't men look at women? I don't think when a man looks at a woman he's necessarily making her into a sex object. I think it's just some hard wired part of his brain responding to visual stimuli.

Now if the look turns into a stare or he makes an inappropriate comment, yes that crosses a line.

But getting back to my original point - I really do appreciate the perspective of someone who actually lives there. I suspect we in the US have sort of romanticized the French a bit. Personally, I picture well dressed, elegant thin people lingering over tiny little plates of intensely flavored fabulous food. Wine and cafe au lait and baguettes and good cheese figure into my understanding but in no systematic organized way

TUK wrote

... to consider that having half a handful of fat on the belly is being fat. I agree that probably, a French girl telling an average US woman "I have weight to lose"

There are sub cultures in the US where they think the same thing. Hollywood for example. I remember when the movie Titanic came out that some people were calling Kate Winslett fat. Really?

Also, if you work in the fitness industry having any little roll or bump on you is bad. You have to have very low body fat and very defined muscles all the time. Think Michael Phelps during the Beijing Olympics. Oh, but if you are a woman, you need to have a big bustline as well.

And if a "mean girl" in a school or social group has body dysmorphic syndrome, heaven help everyone else because there is no normal. There is extremely thin and there is fat. There is nothing in between.

I agree this is frightening and there are many people here who will attest to the fact that this type of thinking of caused them to actually gain weight in the long run. They would do a regimen with extreme diet and exercise and then crash because of the unsustainability of it all only to gain back everything they lost and more.

Blithe Morning wrote:Because, really, don't men look at women?

Officially no, when they're married.

Blithe Morning wrote:Personally, I picture well dressed, elegant thin people lingering over tiny little plates of intensely flavored fabulous food.

Good thing you don't talk about beret and baguette! Okay, let's do a reality check:
* well-dressed : yes, my wife forces me to
* elegant thin : too subjective, I guess
* tiny little plates : only in the most expensive restaurants, but actually, the plates are big, but the portions are small. You can get a good full plate in other places.
* intensely flavoured fabulous food : I guess it depends on how dull your everyday food is, and the willingness of people to cook.

By the way, would anyone be interested in photos of my plates as a French NoSer ? (I know, I make weird proposals) I thought about this yesterday, we may have misconceptions of the cultural differences between France and US. (Anyway, can we post photos on phpBB?)

That makes me think. I used to be part of a French-American bilingual church, and once, with some Americans, we went to McDonald's (in France). One of them told us "The burgers here are TINY! In America, when you have a Big Mac, it's big like this." And he showed us a size of burger that you can barely hold in one hand. Is that true?

(Sorry ThomsonsPier, I think I stole your thread...)

TUK wrote: Officially no, when they're married.

Good answer.

Since this thread is totally off topic, I'll just point out that I have on occasion found myself noticing a... er... certain type of man. I uniformly call them Art because I realize that while they are nice to glance at I do not want the headache or work of actually having one. I put them in the same category with pastries, babies and puppies - absolutely delightful as long they aren't mine.

TUK wrote: Good thing you don't talk about beret and baguette!

Only because I forgot.

TUK wrote:...
"The burgers here are TINY! In America, when you have a Big Mac, it's big like this." And he showed us a size of burger that you can barely hold in one hand. Is that true?

The Big Mac actually is not the biggest fast food burger anymore. You can buy some beastly sized ones, and yes, you cannot hold these triple patty with bacon, cheese and mayonnaise in one hand. At least, not my hand.

I wasn't offended, either. Just conversing, I hoped.

I would love to see pictures of your plates! A lot of the formatting icons here don't work for me. Not sure why. And I don't know how to post pics. I take pics of my plates sometimes, too.

Psychologists consider it normal in the U.S for women to be displeased with their bodies and/or weight. Given that the average media representation of women shows someone whose BMI is lower than that of the average in the countries at the bottom of the scale, where there is actual starvation, it's no wonder. On another site, there is a mid-30's woman who was obese, got down to the 130's seven years ago, but thought she should weigh 122, and monitors every morsel every day, even bringing food to Christmas dinner. She is 5'6", as I am, and eats 1000-1200 calories every day. She is terrified of overeating. She gets a lot of admiration and support on the site for sticking to her guns. But she sure doesn't sound happy to me. I sure wouldn't be, if I thought I had to weigh 32 lbs. less than I do to be acceptable.

ThomsonsPier wrote:This is quite fun; a variation on the BMI calculator that shows how your best weight bench for home compares with the rest of your country and the world.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18770328

Hi
I don't think they mean that we're heavier than 50% of the world! I think all they mean is that we are heavier (or have a higher BMI) than average person. I already knew that I'd a higher than average BMI. It just tells me my BMI is higher than the average BMI of people in those countries.

kia10 wrote:

ThomsonsPier wrote:This is quite fun; a variation on the BMI calculator that shows how your best weight bench for home compares with the rest of your country and the world.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-18770328

Hi
I don't think they mean that we're heavier than 100% of the world! I think all they mean is that we are heavier (or have a higher BMI) than average person. I already knew that I'd a higher than average BMI. It just tells me my BMI is higher than the average person in each of those countries.

Gave me a good laugh. It says if everyone in the whole world had my BMI, which is about 27, it would add 41 million tonnes to the world's weight.

Doesn't that just make your day?

Well, I have descended down the scale from France to Madagascar where the obesity rate is under 5%. One other chart on Madagascar I looked at showed that about 9 of 11 girl children born at the same time as I was have already died. There thinness seems unrelated to longevity.

oolala53 wrote:Doesn't that just make your day?

Well, I have descended down the scale from France to Madagascar where the obesity rate is under 5%. One other chart I looked at showed that about 9 of 11 girl children born at the same time as I was have already died. There thinness seems unrelated to longevity.

In comparison, I'm supposedly the same as men my age in the Russian Federation. So the only two names that came to mind were Khrushchev and Baryshnikov, lol. I recently looked at the website for our 50th High School reunion next year, and was kind of shocked at the pics and names of my dead classmates.

May I ask what year that graduation was? My high school year was '71. I went to a small school. I know of only one, but there must be more. But I think about it a lot of times when I read of people dying who are younger than I am...

I knew I shouldnt do this and did it anyway.
I was so far to the right off the graph I didnt see it or understand what the graph was saying at first.

oolala53 wrote:May I ask what year that graduation was? My high school year was '71. I went to a small school. I know of only one, but there must be more. But I think about it a lot of times when I read of people dying who are younger than I am...

It was 1968. I was 3rd youngest in my class. I think our class size was approx. 340-350 more or less. Except for Vietnam, which took a couple of my classmates, I think the 50's & 60's were a great time to grow up.

Ouch, that hurt!

Wanted to bump this up for recent NoS converts.
Have fun!

Hah! So fun to see this.

Thanks for resurrecting this thread.

Time for me to move to Gabon!

Bring on the cassava, rice, and yams.