when do s days feel better?

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:53 pm

today i feel pretty good and it's almost a relief that it's monday. this weekend i had some pretty difficult moments and i'll tell you why. i still want to stay with NoS because for once i don't feel (as) obsessed with food as i once was. but i'm still thinking about it a lot which i wish i didn't.
so i was looking in the mirror and all the pockets of fat i had that i didn't have when i was calorie counting. and i'm noticing clothes are feeling rather tight. but i don't want to go back to calorie counting. i feel like a child stomping my feet "no i don't want to have to live that way anymore" but i'm torn because i look at the weight that i've probably gained (i dont' know because i haven't weighed myself and don't plan on it until april) and i want to change something.
but my fear is putting too many mods in place too soon. but at the same time, i don't want to gain weight either! i've made it into my 5th week now doing this, gone past the 21 days at this point. so i feel like some mods are in order but i'm not sure how to go about doing it.
i'd like to say to myself "just act like a normal person without past binge eating disorder on sdays" but that's so hard to do! my mind is saying "eat all the food now!" and i've learned that when i do that i get overfull feeling that i hate, so that has kept me from overdoing it a bit... but there's still that mad frantic feeling on friday night/sat morning... i know it is supposed to get better at some point but i'm starting to wonder when that's going to happen. and i don't want to place unnecessary mods on myself making me rebel. so i'm thinking at first just the mods in my daily check in thread are good... i didn't stick with them this weekend because we went out of town but maybe trying a little harder next weekend and seeing if i feel rebellious is the first step.
mods are: sticking with original structure of 3 meals but allow 3 s-events each day, no going out alone to sneak in solitary s-events (or no solitary eating/snacking), sday hours friday 10pm to sun 10pm (that one worked well this weekend), 1 s-event friday night, etc... should actually be pretty easy to do this and i really shouldn't feel too restricted doing this if i make this an actual aim for this weekend!
i know it gets better i just woke up this morning feeling a bit frustrated. i will be really paying attention to whether i feel deprived or not and use that as a guide. i did notice if i felt full i was more likely to stop myself from overdoing it this weekend so maybe that was a start...

i know calorie counting and demonizing entire groups of food is way worse than how i feel now. and i have to remember that.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:05 pm

It will get better when you think it will get better. Let me explain: thinking precedes action. When you think, when you decide it will get better, it will get better. It doesn't mean a mod. It just means that when you decide you're done with wild S days your S days won't be wild.

By the way, 5 weeks is way too soon for any mods. I think most of us long timers haven't made any mods until at least 6 months or a year.

~reneew · Post by **~reneew** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:10 pm

wosnes wrote:It will get better when you think it will get better.

I like that! It's all in the mind.

wosnes wrote:I think most of us long timers haven't made any mods until at least 6 months or a year.

Or we shouldn't have!

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:25 pm

wow i could gain a lot of weight if i don't put some mods in before 6 months! hopefully it gets better before then! that's what scares me.

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:34 pm

OP, I feel your pain. I am still new myself so I have no answers, other than that I'm in the same boat with wild S days. I'm not doing mods, though. Just trying to ride it out.

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:14 pm

this is why i am torn, leafy greens.... i worked really hard to lose 27 lbs and i gained some of it back but i'm still about 15 from my highest weight. i don't want to gain that 15 back while i'm "waiting for this to work" but at the same time i really really don't want to go back to the drudgery of calorie counting. i feel like there has to be some middle ground where i can still enjoy some treats on the weekend but not go crazy and not gain back all the weight i worked so hard to lose. i am definitely sticking with NoS i just wonder if since i have been doing ok on Ndays if maybe i can try and set some basic ground rules like not making all Sdays a permasnack/sweet eating frenzy. I don't feel good about overstuffing myself anymore. I still enjoy my treats but i feel like i'm needing to reel myself in a bit. I'll probably be out of town again next weekend which seems to work well for me because it keeps me from wanting to look like a pig in front of other people!

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:24 pm

Have you actually gained any weight in the five weeks? Or are you just afraid you will?

Since you're not eating as much during the week by cutting out snacks and desserts, then the extra weekend calories probably aren't going to do much harm. It's true that right now you're simply displacing some extra calories that you would have eaten during the week to the weekend, but it should be temporary, until your appetite is trained. At least that is the theory.

I really don't know how long this takes to be over the wildness. Hopefully someone more experienced can weigh in. I know that there are a lot of people with food issues that have overcome them with No S, and there are some stories on the testimonials page. Hopefully, that will be us one day.

Listen to #34 podcast about S Days Gone Wild.

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:31 pm

oh i haven't weighed myself. because i know i have. my clothes aren't fitting the same and that definitely means weight gain. if i see the number though it could be very detrimental to me. not weighing until april. i figure by then i could have less wild sdays. i was doing a calorie counting thing right before this so i know i was eating a lot less then. so i know i've gained weight, unfortunately.

i have listened to the podcast a few times. and it helps. so i think in time it will come.

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:47 pm

Your clothes might be "snug" but that's probably normal with a few lbs. fluctuation. Could be due to any number of things. I wouldn't worry until you have to buy NEW clothes...

I have noticed a decrease in bloating during the week. The weekends I have gone overboard, but the N days put it all in check. It's Monday, so there's a slight S-day hangover. I am not worrying about it, because judging by the past four weeks, by the end of the week I'll be back to running on E before dinner time. (Buddy Oolala53 says she prefers getting hungry about an hour before meals. She has made it 3 years. We have been sold a bill of goods that we can never be hungry or our metabolism "slows down.")

From the podcast: "When your appetite sees how well it's being taken care of, it's gonna relax. It's not going to feel resentful, brooding, and waiting for the first opportunity to lash out and gorge itself on whatever trash is lying around." - I'm still in the "trash phase" myself, but if Reinhard and others say it will pass, then I believe it will.

Liz46 · Post by **Liz46** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:11 pm

MJ7910, I'm just starting out and you've been at this longer than I have, but I wanted to throw in my version of this past weekend (my second weekend on No S, which didn't go as well as the first. I know that "S" days are considered "free" days, but I went a little crazy yesterday because I cooked one of my favorite meals and went back for seconds, thirds and fourths throughout the day.

That being said, I've decided that I do need to put some restrictions on myself during "S" days. I'm going to allow myself the three meals per day and allow myself 1 or 2 (but not 3) of three things on "S" days and those things will be only one small portion of seconds, or one serving of a sweet, or one reasonable snack. I can have two sweets and no seconds or snacks. I can have two seconds and no snacks or sweets and so on, just no more of two things in any combination. I hope I'm making this understandable.

I know we aren't supposed to put restrictions on ourselves on "S" days, but I feel I must to keep from undoing the effort of NS days. The only time I will make exceptions for this is holidays or vacation days when I'm out of my normal routine.

I wouldn't worry about weight gain too much in the beginning, though I know that's hard, but first worry only about breaking the cycle of yo-yo dieting and getting back to a place of peace with food.

Best wishes to you.

Blithe Morning · Post by **Blithe Morning** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:52 pm

Some suggestions. Remember, these are guidelines not rules.

1. Add weight bearing exercise i.e. shovel glove or weightlifting.
2. Start reducing the size of your plates. Check the thrift store for "lunch plates" or 7"=8" plates. Try adding them in, not always, but sometimes. It's a guideline, not a rule.
3. Make half your plates fruits and veg. Again, a guideline.
4. Cut back on any wine. A nightly glass of wine caused a bump in weight for me. However, it's worth it to me, so I'm not cutting it out entirely.
5. Long walks. Will you burn enough calories to lose weight? Probably not. But you will feel less stressed.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 10:55 pm

Liz46 wrote:
That being said, I've decided that I do need to put some restrictions on myself during "S" days. I'm going to allow myself the three meals per day and allow myself 1 or 2 (but not 3) of three things on "S" days and those things will be only one small portion of seconds, or one serving of a sweet, or one reasonable snack. I can have two sweets and no seconds or snacks. I can have two seconds and no snacks or sweets and so on, just no more of two things in any combination. I hope I'm making this understandable.

I wouldn't consider that a modification, just common sense. A modification might be further restricting S days to only one, for instance. I also wouldn't consider changing portion sizes or making your plate half vegetables restrictions. Also just common sense and good for reasons other than weight loss.

I think a modification is anything that changes "No snacks, no sweets, no seconds , except on days that start with S."

Liz46 · Post by **Liz46** » Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:41 pm

Thank you for your input on my plan Wosnes. I also like the idea of 1/2 plate being vegetables or vegetables/fruit, both of which I never eat enough of and I'm going to start doing that, at least for two meals each day.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:08 am

Liz46 wrote:Thank you for your input on my plan Wosnes. I also like the idea of 1/2 plate being vegetables or vegetables/fruit, both of which I never eat enough of and I'm going to start doing that, at least for two meals each day.

I first read about making the plate half vegetables in an article in Prevention well over 10 years ago. The remainder should be divided between protein and starch. More recently, Ellie Krieger wrote about this in Fine Cooking magazine. I don't think it's necessary to make all grains whole grains, though.

Liz46 · Post by **Liz46** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:19 am

Thank you for the info about the starches included on the protein side. Good to know to include non starchy vegetables on the other side of the plate. That's good information!

sleepygirlzzzz · Post by **sleepygirlzzzz** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:59 pm

I'm in a similar boat to you MJ, although you're much further ahead on your No S journey than me. This is week 3/4 for me but I've had a few slip-ups on N days and serious overindulgence on S days. But overall, I'm happy with how it's going.

I've also gained weight/inches since I stopped calorie counting when I started No S and agree it can be hard to come to terms with it when calorie counting was 'working'. I say 'working' because it helped me lose weight when not bingeing but then it drove me absolutely bananas.

I've probably been eating less sweets/snacks on No S than before but I think my problem is that my meals are a lot bigger/calorific than they were before. Calorie counting taught me that I could be satisfied on a lot less food than I was eating and I suppose I've been using the theory that in the early days of No S that it's normal to overfill your plates as an excuse to eat loads (lots more than I allowed myself when calorie counting). Although I have found that since I started No S that when I overeat, I do feel pretty awful more quickly than in the past.

Next step for me is to find a balance between the minimal amount I was eating before and the platefuls that I am eating now.

As for S days, I'm also struggling to stop myself from going overboard when the weekend comes along. To be honest, I've been struggling to make it the full 5 N days without a sweet. Made it to Thursday evening last week but then sadly, I gave in. I like your idea of making your S days from Fri evening to Sunday evening. That sounds a lot more do-able for me so I may give this a try (Fri 6pm to Sun 6pm). I'm also trying to work on not eating any snacks/sweets that I feel that I have to sneak or hide because if I need to hide it, then I obviously shouldn't be eating it!

Apologies that I haven't been able to offer an advice - just wanted you to know that there are others in the same/similar boat...

Best wishes

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:33 pm

sleepygirlzzzz wrote:I've been struggling to make it the full 5 N days without a sweet.

Join the club.

That doesn't mean you have to give in, though.

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:25 pm

Been thinking on this some more and really what I am calling mods is just further defining "don't be an idiot" for myself. I know what is too much and placing a few suggestions on sdays shouldn't harm anything since I can't really "fail" anyway. The ideas I have only make it easier for me to feel good about sdays and that is the most important part.

Liz46 · Post by **Liz46** » Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:31 pm

MJ7910 wrote: The ideas I have only make it easier for me to feel good about sdays and that is the most important part.

I agree with this. I think we each need to tweak our "s" days to what works for us as individuals so that we don't go too crazy on those days. And you're right that no matter what, we cannot fail on an "s" day. Isn't that wonderful!

vmsurbat · Post by **vmsurbat** » Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:48 am

sleepygirlzzzz wrote: I've probably been eating less sweets/snacks on No S than before but I think my problem is that my meals are a lot bigger/calorific than they were before. Calorie counting taught me that I could be satisfied on a lot less food than I was eating and I suppose I've been using the theory that in the early days of No S that it's normal to overfill your plates as an excuse to eat loads (lots more than I allowed myself when calorie counting). Although I have found that since I started No S that when I overeat, I do feel pretty awful more quickly than in the past.

Next step for me is to find a balance between the minimal amount I was eating before and the platefuls that I am eating now.

NoS is one of the few diets that treats you and expects you to be an intelligent human being with a mind capable of making rational, good decisions. The opportunity that NoS provides to figure out the bolded is one of its greatest strengths.

Best wishes for continued success; you are definitely on the right path.

germanherman · Post by **germanherman** » Wed Mar 06, 2013 10:35 am

I can give only one advice regarding "S-Day-Binge":

Relax! It isn't worth going mad about it. Just give the No S Diet some time to work.

When i started, my weekends looked like eating contests. But over time the amount of food i ate under the week became so small that it started to transfer on the amount on the weekends.

I still vividly remember my first 6 weeks, some weeks i couldn't even get my five "green" NDays and i exploded on the weekends.

But every green day became a building stone and i learned to accept, that sometimes there are red days. Finally i was able to get my NDays clean and that was all i needed to do because i couldn't eat bad enough on the two S-days to reverse the five Ndays.

And at some point my subconscious seems to get the note. I started eating a lot less an the weekends without even trying. That happend around my 3 or 4th month on the No S Diet.

It may sound silly, but i reached the point, where i had to force myself to eat more on the weekends, because i noticed, that when i eat on the S-Days like on the N-Days i lose less weight than if eating a more on the S-days. I guess through the S-days i dodge the "starvation mode" when the body lowers his calorie-consumption as an effect of undereating.

I always gain weight over the weekends, but at the latest i'm back to my former weight on wednesday.

Some hints that helped me:
* Exercise: The fact that i got my exercise-habbit build faster than my diet-habbit helped me to sustain the first few weeks ("If i can do that i probably can do this too")

* Failures: Failures are part of life and always helpful to learn something. My first 20 NDays on this diet had 12xgreen and 8xred. Never expect a perfect start, or perfection at all. Expecting perfection is a foulproof way to drive you insane!

*I used one mod: I call it "refuel when neccessary". If you start doing some serious exercise you will get problems with the eating-times. After a training session i'm all out of gas. So i allowed myself a fitness/protein/whatever-Drink after exercising, if i needed it. That isn't snacking in my book.

That's my only mod.

*Patience: You got to be willing to wait for you results. Expect fast results and you are only on the fast track to failure.

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:04 pm

germanherman wrote:i couldn't eat bad enough on the two S-days to reverse the five Ndays.

Yes I believe this too, that's why I'm not concerned yet about my wild S-Days. I have not gained weight for 5 weeks, so I'm probably not going to, even with some wild S-days. No reason to worry.

Thank you for mentioning it took you 3-4 months for your appetite to relax. I think most of us are just wondering when is that going to happen, because it's obvious that 21 days or a month doesn't click for many.

Strawberry Roan · Post by **Strawberry Roan** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:08 am

To answer the question,

S Days feel better because most people like to have a sense of control in their lives.

I have never done the No S Days gone wild concept, just can't do it. It seems counter productive. I know Reinhard never implied that one should abandon all sensibilities and throw caution to the wind on the weekends but I read on here that many do. I have seen people say they stay up until Friday midnight so they can start eating.

That isn't a sane way to live.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 12:37 pm

Strawberry Roan wrote:To answer the question,

S Days feel better because most people like to have a sense of control in their lives.

I have never done the No S Days gone wild concept, just can't do it. It seems counter productive. I know Reinhard never implied that one should abandon all sensibilities and throw caution to the wind on the weekends but I read on here that many do. I have seen people say they stay up until Friday midnight so they can start eating.

That isn't a sane way to live.

I agree.

AnnaBanana · Post by **AnnaBanana** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:56 pm

My S days are very similar to my NoS days. Only difference is I may have a slice of pie or cake, or an appetizer if we eat out, perhaps a glass of wine. S days gone wild is why I think so many give up too soon. Reinhard never meant it as a food fest.

AnnaBanana · Post by **AnnaBanana** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:59 pm

.... That being said, there is a learning curve and I think it can take some time for some. I've been at this a long time so I know I may be forgetting my early days

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Sun Mar 17, 2013 7:03 pm

Don't want to scare anyone but it took me two years before my S days calmed down, and that was with about an 85% average of green N days. And I did have time when my weight loss stalled for months at a time because of it. But I took the long view and each year, I lost weight, got into my healthy BMI range, and I continue to lose.

The only consolation I can give is that your odds of finding something else that will help you be eating less food a year from now are very low, unless you or someone close to you has a serious health problem that makes eating less life or death. Most people who diet traditionally are heavier two years later. The National Weight Loss Registry reports that having a health problem was central in making changes for a high percentage of maintainers. It seems health motivates people when the threat becomes real.

I have not found that health (had even better blood readings when I was younger and heavier, though they are still good) and appearance were good motivators for me. Simply wanting to keep detaching from excessive overeating has been my impetus. I say excessive because I believe that overeating is natural and an acceptable part of life sometimes. I overate at a St. Patrick Day's party last night and I feel fine about it. I don't do it often, it wasn't a lot, and it was fun!

It may work to use mods, but if it backfires, don't sweat it. Just keep going. Keep your N days green, keep improving the quality of what you do eat, and keep looking for other ways to spend your time when it's not really time to eat. Keep noticing how dull you feel when you overeat and how much better you feel when you don't. Don't beat yourself up over it. Just notice. You'll very likely get tired of it and be willing to go through the anxiety of not eating when it occurs to you more often. It may not go away without some pain. But what's the alternative?

Blithe Morning · Post by **Blithe Morning** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:28 pm

oolala53 wrote:Don't want to scare anyone but it took me two years before my S days calmed down, and that was with about an 85% average of green N days. And I did have time when my weight loss stalled for months at a time because of it. But I took the long view and each year, I lost weight, got into my healthy BMI range, and I continue to lose.

If this scares someone, that means they might not be really ready for No S.

leafy_greens · Post by **leafy_greens** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 3:35 pm

It scares me everyday. I'm still trying, though. Even if it takes 2-5 years, that is better than living the rest of my life with food issues.

Oolala's experience has been invaluable to me. Thanks for blazing the trail!

MJ7910 · Post by **MJ7910** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:19 pm

i mananged to have a few moderate sdays during my roughly 7 weeks doing this, but i think our tendency is to treat ourselves on early sdays and it's ok. it will all even out throughout the week. i really hope to also get to the point of oolala53. when i wrote this post i was really struggling. since then, i actually have managed to have a few moderate s-weekends. funny how things change when they change, not when we think they will change.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:21 pm

BlitheMorning, I think if someone isn't ready to face that or something similar in terms of long term eating habit changes, they aren't ready to start at all. But most people want all the trouble to be over with in a few weeks. Possible, just highly unlikely.

I'm stupidly lounging on my first day off and I saw a Dr. Phil show on which there was a 385-lb. woman insisting to him that she is really ready to change her life even though she has never lasted on a diet for more than two days. He kept saying that she had to be ready to change her lifestyle. To me, that is still not delivering a focused enough message. Many people will claim they are willing to change their lifestyle when they are in the midst of being sorry for overindulgences, but it goes out the window when they get that first desire to go back to the offending habit.

We have to be willing to keep to our plan even when it's hard. Even when our mind is telling us to forget the whole thing, and our body has a terrible sense of anxiety and discomfort that it seems only food will relieve. We have to recognize when these moments are. And we've got to be willing to admit that it's not as hard as we make it out to be. Annoying, irritating, maddening, but not the kind of pain or hardship of chronic disease, or a headache or a burn.

BrightAngel · Post by **BrightAngel** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 12:37 pm

oolala53 wrote:We have to be willing to keep to our plan even when it's hard.

So True.

noni · Post by **noni** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 1:15 pm

oolala53 wrote:And we've got to be willing to admit that it's not as hard as we make it out to be. Annoying, irritating, maddening, but not the kind of pain or hardship of chronic disease, or a headache or a burn.

I've been having a tough few weeks of keeping the N days green. I entertain thoughts of allowing myself to snack on fruit, which turned into fistfuls of cocoa covered almonds, which turned into eating the sandwich fillings as I make sandwiches for hubby's and son's lunches. Sunday night, my 17 year old son, who for some years, has had to drop weight for wrestling, told me... "stop thinking, 'could I?...should I?...maybe'... if you know it's 'no' to any food you wouldn't think so much about it and it would be easier." Yesterday WAS easier and I'm hoping the week goes better. We know this stuff, but sometimes it's good reinforcing to hear it from others. That's why the boards are invaluable.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:34 pm

Your son is wise! Judith Beck actually recommends writing "NO CHOICE" on an index card and reading it everyday as a reminder to use it at the times of dickering.

The dickering is a habit, too, and can take time to be changed. But we're on our way!

Imogen Morley · Post by **Imogen Morley** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:37 am

I hate to be such a wet blanket, but I really feel that for some people - including myself - they never get better, and some mods need to be introduced in order to move beyond the dreaded "diet plateaus". I've just been celebrating the third No S anniversary, and I can honestly say that I wouldn't be at my current weight if not for moderate cardio 4-5 times a week and weekly dessert budget of roughly 800 kcal.
S days certainly do work for some people, but for those with a history of disordered eating it may take far too long to tame them down. You decide.

nonoodles · Post by **nonoodles** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:34 pm

I think, from following this board for ages, that the whole S Day concept (which was originally stated as "sometimes") has been twisted to allow people to think that the weekend is just a long binge-fest. Come on now, if you believe you are building moderate life long habits during the week, do you not believe you are also building a 2 day binge habit on the weekend?

BrightAngel · Post by **BrightAngel** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:44 pm

nonoodles wrote:I think, from following this board for ages, that the whole S Day concept (which was originally stated as "sometimes")
has been twisted to allow people to think that the weekend is just a long binge-fest.
Come on now, if you believe you are building moderate life long habits during the week,
do you not believe you are also building a 2 day binge habit on the weekend?

So very true.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:04 pm

The point about S days, besides that they are not meant to give permission to "be an idiot" and somehow still lose weight, is that some people have the get tame naturally and some people tame them with a chair, but that a whip is probably no different than past tactics that didn't work long term. If they don't calm on their own, the person has to decide when to introduce mods, and that has to come when some equation- the pain of restraint and the pain of indulgence- is present, and that for many is not going to happen for several months, not the 21 days or 30 days or whatever that people want. If someone has successfully used a mod sooner, it just means the equation was present for them. (Sorry, math people. I'm probably really mangling this analogy.)

All you can do is experiment. If you rein in hard, you do run a risk of backfiring. Are you willing to accept that and deal with it? Then go ahead. If not, just keep worshipping N days, and do what you can to make your weekends pleasantly busy. That's not a bad idea anyway.

But regarding the idea that you are BUILDING a 2-day binge habit- well, I had a 7-day binge habit before NO S, so 2 days was a huge improvement. I guess if you were never "an idiot" before No S, and you start afterwards, that is what's going on. But if you were before, try to focus on whether your idiocy is TRENDING downwards. I just always saw it as a way to REDUCE my eating over time, and since my TREND was in eating less, even with the highs of S days, I kept going. And you usually can't judge a TREND on something like eating in a few weeks or months.

finallyfull · Post by **finallyfull** » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:55 pm

I have a question for you, oohlala -- do you do habitcal? I seem to remember you (or maybe someone else saying the habitcal turned No S into a diet for them.) I have also found that keeping close track of red/green days seems to turn it into a diet for me, meaning something I go "off". I've gone more than three months now without tracking (makes it so much easier to "mark it and move on" if I skip the mark it part.) But my concern, of course, is that I could have a bunch of red days every week and tell myself I'm doing No S.

What I think is that I have teensy slips, not so infrequently, but that I am sticking with it much longer and building a firm foundation and commitment to a lifestyle rather than being on a diet. Previously, one teensy slip would turn easily into a "what the hell" day.

Since you are kind of my No S hero, I wonder if you would share your opinion on this, and what works for you.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:34 pm

finallyfull wrote:I have a question for you, oohlala -- do you do habitcal? I seem to remember you (or maybe someone else saying the habitcal turned No S into a diet for them.) I have also found that keeping close track of red/green days seems to turn it into a diet for me, meaning something I go "off". I've gone more than three months now without tracking (makes it so much easier to "mark it and move on" if I skip the mark it part.) But my concern, of course, is that I could have a bunch of red days every week and tell myself I'm doing No S.

What I think is that I have teensy slips, not so infrequently, but that I am sticking with it much longer and building a firm foundation and commitment to a lifestyle rather than being on a diet. Previously, one teensy slip would turn easily into a "what the hell" day.

Since you are kind of my No S hero, I wonder if you would share your opinion on this, and what works for you.

Unless someone else has said it, it was me who said using habitcal turns No-S into a diet. I think it's possible to have a bunch of red days and still be following No-S. But I think there are red days and then there are RED days. Technically if I popped a couple of grapes in my mouth, that would make it a red day, but those grapes wouldn't do much damage to weight loss or habit. Eating a plate of cheese and crackers or half dozen cookies is something else again and could affect both weight loss and habit formation.

I don't aim for perfection. As long as I'm not snacking daily or grazing all day long, I'm still following No-S. If I nibble at something (the grape example), I find it usually happens when I'm preparing or plating a meal. I'm just not going to worry about whether or not that's a snack.

I've always looked at it this way: I consider myself a Christian, though I know I'm not perfect. But because I'm not perfect doesn't mean I'm not a Christian (I don't think anyone could claim perfection in that). I'm not a perfect mother, but I'm still a mother. I do my best.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:54 pm

I haven't used habitcal much, but I wasn't avoiding it. I'm just lazy about it. I guess it just wasn't reinforcing enough for me, and the delightful feelings of hunger and satiety, plus the deliciousness of my food when not snacking was and is.

Over43 · Post by **Over43** » Sat Mar 23, 2013 3:40 am

When I am lying (?) on a beach that is being lapped by Caribbean waves.