The Anoulie Principle

No Snacks, no sweets, no seconds. Except on Days that start with S. Too simple for you? Simple is why it works. Look here for questions, introductions, support, success stories.

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automatedeating
Posts: 5305
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

The Anoulie Principle

Post by automatedeating » Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:30 pm

The title of this topic is a silly pun on the Bernoulie Principle. Sorry I couldn't resist.

Anoulie started a thread a few months back about needing to get back on track. I noticed that she mentioned having NINE whole months of all green. And yet now, she can't seem to string green days together. She's understandably frustrated and afraid, and when I read her post, I began to freak a little.

After working so hard to faithfully build 3-meals-a-day as a life habit, it seems massively discouraging to fall off the wagon. Any preemptive advice for newbies who are doing well, but maybe will get to a day when all of a sudden they lose willpower? I'm not sure how that happened for Anoulie (she mentioned an ice cream offered to her that she accepted..... and that one mistake sent her careening away from 3-meals-a-day, if I correctly understand). It seems, as I read the thread, that perfectionism may be one predisposing factor for this kind of overnight-reversal of habit.

I have been thinking (dare I say overthinking) the failure rates of those trying to make changes to their life habits. Are long-timers able to contribute a few opinions on 'WAYS OF THINKING' that keep them on habit, year after year? From following the threads, it seems:
1. From the start, consider this a lifelong change.
2. Focus on habit-building, not weight loss.
3. Forgive and forget when a slip-up occurs.

These three points seem to me to be critical to making this a WOE for the rest of my life..... am I overlooking some key psychology to habit change?

What is the name of that book about Habit I have seen mentioned in a couple of threads? I think Reinhard read it, and Wosnes and/or Oolala.......
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

vmsurbat
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:12 am
Location: Montenegro

Re: The Anoulie Principle

Post by vmsurbat » Sun Sep 29, 2013 7:20 am

automatedeating wrote:
I have been thinking (dare I say overthinking) the failure rates of those trying to make changes to their life habits. Are long-timers able to contribute a few opinions on 'WAYS OF THINKING' that keep them on habit, year after year? From following the threads, it seems:
1. From the start, consider this a lifelong change.
2. Focus on habit-building, not weight loss.
3. Forgive and forget when a slip-up occurs.

These three points seem to me to be critical to making this a WOE for the rest of my life..... am I overlooking some key psychology to habit change?
I think you hit on the biggies with the three keys you listed, but as a long-termer, I'll expand on them a bit as they apply to me...

1. Lifelong change: Absolutely! And this means quickly nipping in the bud any thoughts of different diet, or "This won't work, it's too slow". With the lifelong approach, I expect changes to happen over time and I have all my remaining years to practice NoS.

2. Habit-building: Yes! I think many of us long-term success stories focused exclusively on habits, and the wonderful benefits gained from habit alone: restored pleasure in eating, normalized relationship with food, enjoyment of social gatherings, control of eating habits, an appreciation of hunger/appetite before a meal, and so many more.

For newbies, that means (as Reinhard points out so very well in his book) that the focus should be on Ndays--they are the habit-builders of the program. It seems so many newbies feel good about their Ndays and then despair over Sdays and make Sdays become the focus (the whole "to mod or not to mod" question).

Keep the focus on Ndays and let the good habits trickle over naturally to Sdays. They will because after weeks, months, years of good Nday eating, over-the-top S days will NOT FEEL GOOD, and you'll have the tools (habits) to willingly, without "diet head", realign Sdays so they become pleasurable again.

Along with developing good eating habits which NoS takes care of so admirably, it is worth working on Mind-habits as well. I still use my litany of reasons, mantras, mottoes such as: One=done, "Mark it and move on", "I am not a snacker" and several more. There is a whole sticky at the top of the forum filled with catchy phrases well-worth filling our minds with...

3. Forgive and Forget NoS is all about looking ahead--past mistakes don't infringe on future success. If I counted calories (or carbs), a big blow-out meal would need to be compensated for in future meals. Not so with NoS. Yay! Success is always ahead at the next meal.

This is one reason why I don't use habitcal as set up. When I have used it, I had three calendars--one for breakfast, one for lunch, and one for dinner. That way on a day with a slip-up, I correctly marked two greens and only one red--no sense in not celebrating the two victories merely because of one slip-up.... But to be honest, I rarely track anything as I find it neither helpful nor motivating.

Please don't get discouraged about needing to be somewhat diligent about following NoS--the amount of effort is more than paid off with good living and good eating. We all have our weak spots. For me, I'm still terrible with virtual plating and when I find myself in that situation (camp/ministry season every summer), I do the best I can and am glad when it ends. And the worst now is still far, far better than pre-NoS....
Vicki in MNE
7! Yrs. with Vanilla NoS, down 55+lb, happily maintaining and still loving it!

automatedeating
Posts: 5305
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Thanks!

Post by automatedeating » Sun Sep 29, 2013 2:11 pm

Thanks, Vicki! I so appreciate you taking the time to chime in. I read your testimonials a while back, and your life story really resonated with me and is so encouraging ..... Which is exactly what I need.

I know that your elaboration on successful principles will be helpful not just for me, but so many others that read the boards.

Thanks again.... I'm going to go read that sticky you recommended. I adopted one without knowing about it. "I am not a snacker". I must tell myself that at least once a day.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

oolala53
Posts: 10059
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Mon Sep 30, 2013 1:11 pm

I think you've hit them. I guess I think of the forgive-and-forget as part of overcoming the WTH effect, and my version of it: "be tough-not mean- on yourself BEFORE you slip up, and gentle afterwards." Eating disorder specialists know that beating yourself up after overeating is part of the cycle and actually reinforces it. It also reinforces a crappy relationship with yourself whereby you don't want to cooperate with yourself. You're going to want to rebel against a tyrant! And they know that concentrating on how unacceptable your body is backfires.

Regarding not targeting weight loss, I was very fearful that I would binge forever and I saw that No S combined structure with freedom in a way that reflected some of the non-diet approaches of those who deal with eating disorders. I started willing to do it even if I didn't lose weight, though I don't know what I would have done if I hadn't. In the back of my mind, it seemed as if I should be able to get into my normal BMI range since I had been there growing up. And I still keep adjusting to accommodate a declining appetite. No way to know if that's the effect of No S or aging or both.

I told myself I had to work No S for a year at least though in the back of my mind, I was thinking five years because I knew that that was the gold standard of maintenance. I gave myself the option of reevaluating each year. It became clear to me that I could not really imagine pursuing any other plan unless there were dire circumstances. Honestly, I did entertain other ideas at times, but they never lasted. I got a lot of motivation for that from Willpower, in which the authors advised against swearing off any one food and against "going on a diet." They did recommend recording what you ate, but I nixed that. I opted instead for a rather routine makeup of my meals, which is what slim cultures do. The routine does the counting for you.

There have been people who have used No S successfully for vanity weight but it seemed to work because their pleasure in eating increased as well.

The book you might be thinking of is The Power of Habit. I've decided from reading it that what happens is that No S works when a practitioner reaches the point at which she craves the good feelings of moderation more than she craves the old pleasure of overeating. This can take awhile to really get solid. The brain pattern of fleeting pleasure is very strong and can take a lot of reversal experiences. So what? The time will pass anyway. Might as well be piling up those experiences.

This is not to say that a person at any time can't have a galvanizing thought and or experience that will suddenly make things easy. That happens, but I don't think it can be manufactured, so there's no use trying to copy it. I believe in playing the odds, and the odds are against trying to impose calorie limits from the outside.

I would add one more idea:
4. You have to believe that it is reasonable to limit your food, and that you will not be doing damage or sacrificing too much pleasure.

Sorry if I've just beat a dead horse.
Last edited by oolala53 on Tue Oct 01, 2013 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

automatedeating
Posts: 5305
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Thanks oolala!

Post by automatedeating » Mon Sep 30, 2013 10:35 pm

Thank you for your introspective thoughts. I like how you think about things, and then model your thinking process for us (you must be a teacher, right?!).

I think your last point is important for me. It seems that for most of my life I have believed I should eat before I get hungry, and that limiting my food intake would always result in binging. I don't believe that anymore, but if I did, it would be super hard to commit to NoS!

I don't have illusions of getting toward the lower end of my BMI, but I sure would like to eventually get into the middle range of it. Nevertheless, I yearn to exist in the peaceful place in which weight loss is not my primary goal, but rather moderate eating and a healthy activity level. wow, I never thought I'd say that.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

oolala53
Posts: 10059
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Tue Oct 01, 2013 12:32 pm

Regarding being a teacher, guilty as charged. I guess I can't hide it.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

User avatar
Jethro
Posts: 183
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:31 pm

Re: The Anoulie Principle

Post by Jethro » Tue Oct 01, 2013 4:00 pm

automatedeating wrote: 3. Forgive and forget when a slip-up occurs.
I consider this one to be the most important. Why? Because I'm not perfect and should expect bumps along the road.

I started NOS on Dec 2010. I've lost 66 lb. with 20 to go to reach my appropriate BMI. If you do the math, you'll see I'm losing 2 lb. per month. Why? Because I slip up. However, eventually I get back on track.

I read somewhere a story of a traveler on the freeway that misses her exit. Would it make sense for her to crash her vehicle in despair? No! She just collects herself, gets off on the next exit, comes back to the freeway and leaves at the correct exit.

This is how I approach NOS.

My motto: You are always a meal away to get back on track.
"Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."
- Vince Lombardi

Sometimes you need to take one step back for every two steps forward.

Time heals everything!

90% of a diet is 60% mental

oolala53
Posts: 10059
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Tue Oct 01, 2013 10:22 pm

One thing I took from the National Weight Loss Registry is that long term maintainers said they had failed many times before their last successful run and the thing that was most important THIS time was not to get derailed when they slipped up. Before, it had become a reason to give up on it all, but the last time, they would slip up for one meal, day, or perhaps week, but not for months or years! or not switch to something new.

It also said that the time after which the "loser" was much less likely to relapse was 2-5 years after reaching goal. I figure No S from day 1, because with each "phase" of my decreased appetite, I'm not thinking I'm going to go back to any other phase.

When i read that, I realized I had always relied on the honeymoon phase, when things were easy for whatever reason. I wouldn't have lots of thoughts of going off plan. but eventually, it would get hard, and I had never learned to say NO when the thoughts and urges were strong. I realized I had to learn to do THAT. When I had those times, I would think "This is that moment!" Sometimes it would be when I slipped up. It helped me to get back to compliance faster.

So, being able to not panic, but "forgive" and calmly get back to compliance has been key.

It certainly helps that I choose what I want for meals. I don't choose junk often, but it's not forbidden, so I don't feel stuck. The reasonableness of the actual plan helps hugely, but the WOT is necessary, too, for most.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

eschano
Posts: 2642
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2012 2:20 pm

Re: Thanks oolala!

Post by eschano » Wed Oct 02, 2013 2:18 pm

automatedeating wrote: I don't have illusions of getting toward the lower end of my BMI, but I sure would like to eventually get into the middle range of it. Nevertheless, I yearn to exist in the peaceful place in which weight loss is not my primary goal, but rather moderate eating and a healthy activity level. wow, I never thought I'd say that.
I think this for me summs it up for me. I realise I start putting pressure on myself when my goals start to become unrealistic (like comparing myself to a photoshopped Gisele Buendchen) and I start to think mean thoughts about my wonderful, supportive body who has so brilliantly allowed me to have all of the good experiences of my life. Then one slip after the other happens. So for me another thing:

Aim for peace, happiness, love and think kindly of your body.
eschano - Vanilla rocks!

July 2012- January 2016
Started again January 2021

oolala53
Posts: 10059
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:46 am
Location: San Diego, CA USA

Post by oolala53 » Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:16 pm

Hear, hear.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 69
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There is no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

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