Octavia is finally checking in!

Counting carbs/calories is a drag. Obsessive scale stepping is a recipe for despair. If you want to count something, "days on habit" is a much better metric. Checking off days on a calendar would do just fine, but if you do it here you get accountability and support. Here's how. Start a new topic in this forum called (say) "Your Name Daily Check In." Then every N day post a "reply" to that topic as to whether you stayed on habit. A simple "<font color="green">SUCCESS</font>" or "<font color="red">FAILURE</font>" (or your preferred euphemism if that's too harsh) is sufficient, but obviously you're welcome to write more if you want. On S-days just register that you're taking an S-day. You don't have to do this forever, just until you're confident you've built the habit. Feel free to check in weekly or monthly or sporadically instead of daily. Feel free also to track other habits besides No-s (I'm keeping this forum under No-s because that's what the vast majority are using it for). See also my <a href="/habitcal/">HabitCal</a> tool for another more formal (and perhaps complementary) way to track habits.

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Soprano
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Soprano » Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:34 am

Well done on your loss and I love how you are embracing hunger.

Jx
Never give up on a dream just because of the time it will take to accomplish it. The time will pass anyway.

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Octavia
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Jul 24, 2020 10:10 am

Thanks, Soprano!

These last two days, I’ve actually had more trouble with the hunger. Not in the sense of accepting it, but in the sense of feeling icky. A little light headed, anxious/irritable, and with a few tiny flashes of queasiness. I wonder why it’s suddenly gone like this? Probably unbalanced blood sugar stemming from not eating enough protein (Georgie Fear has written a fantastic article about this on her blog - it’s the only place I’ve ever seen ‘false hunger’ or ‘bad hunger’ addressed). I’ve just had an all-carb breakfast, in fact: two slices of toast and some grapefruit. I need to address this. I sleep badly and feel really zonked in the morning, desperate for fuel, too tired to cook an egg. Why is this? Well I need to change the bedding as it’s all rumpled. Also I’ve been devouring kindle books late at night. And also, not being active enough during the day. I feel unfulfilled, even though I’ve been more creatively active since lockdown...I’m still working too, but I feel I’ve become more and more lazy and allergic to effort. Funny, I’ve spent my life hating ‘effort’ and longing for a slower pace of life, and now I’ve got it...hmmmm.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:41 pm

I have trouble with lightheaded hunger too. I will go look for that article by Georgie Fear about it, it sounds interesting! I also stay up waaaay too late at night devouring kindle books. Curse you Kindle paperwhite for making it too easy to read in bed! :)

Edit: I did go find that Georgie fear article and it was great! Im so glad you said something about it. I have never seen anyone address that either and it has been a frequent problem for me.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Sat Jul 25, 2020 9:49 pm

My kindle paperwhite is one of my simple joys in life. :-)
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Jul 30, 2020 9:15 pm

Hi both - yes, that article by Georgie Fear is quite a one-off. It addresses the fact that hunger isn’t always a ‘slight discomfort that you can accept’. It can be very unpleasant. I used to have functional dyspepsia which made me feel painfully empty - I think the pain came from gas, though no doctor had anything very illuminating to say about it. Being hungry was a nightmare. And at other times, faintness can strike. These problems need to be addressed by diet writers, as I dare say most over-eaters probably have trouble with digestion and unbalanced blood sugar.

Haven’t checked in for a while, but I’ve managed to stay green for the month, and am enjoying the No S lifestyle. Weight has bobbed up and down but I seem to have lost around 2lb or just under. That’s a good result for me - I just hope it continues. The eating style is really suiting me anyway.

Now I’m going to be disciplined and not do internet things till too late! Must improve my sleep.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:04 am

Hurrah - weight has gone down to 10 stone 10 1/2. It’s so funny how yesterday morning it was 2lb higher! Those scales. :roll:

Wow, boiling weather again here in the south east of the UK. I have a lot of work to do today so will have to keep cool somehow!

Feeling very happy to be at the end of my first all-green month in years. It feels like a miracle to be honest. Getting one’s head in the right place is a subtle art. I’d say it has required:

- education, ie. an ongoing engagement with the dreaded ‘diet books’. I learned about the importance of hunger.
- optimism, a belief that No S works and I can do it
- vanity, acknowledging that I really would like to be slimmer, and that’s an authentic desire
- Self-parenting, seeing that random treats and snacks are not good for my body or mind
- Habitcal, perhaps to channel the compulsive part of me

...that’s it really. No S doesn’t require much organisation or mental effort. I try to eat balanced healthy meals, but if I’ve run out of wholesome ingredients and occasionally have a takeaway or ready meal, that’s ok.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Soprano » Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:18 am

It's great to hear you're so positive and in the groove :)

Jx
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Jul 31, 2020 2:03 pm

Yay Octavia!
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8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Jul 31, 2020 6:31 pm

Functional Dypsepsia sounds awful! I am glad that doesn't' trouble you anymore. I did read a diet writer who acknowledged the importance of balancing your blood sugar but her book is VERY IE and very eat whenever you are hungry. However, she says getting your blood sugar balanced by eating every 3 hours is the first and most important step. Its called How to Be a Normal Eater by Jenn Hand, but like I said it isn't totally congruent with No S.

Congratulations on an all green month! That is so awesome and quite an accomplishment!

I have to keep constant engagement as well. Especially with the reading, but I have to be careful to only read books that support no snacking. I am way too easily influenced.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:24 am

Yay on your weight going down but sorry about the heat. It’s 114 here today of that makes you feel any better. On the plus side I think it’s helping to kill the covid. 🤞

Keep up the good work. I’d be thrilled to have a green month!!
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:16 pm

Linda - 114 degrees!?!? :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :!: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 7:19 am

Hi all, and thanks for checking in with me!

Had a fairly mad weekend and weight is up again which is slightly disappointing but of course, this is all to be expected, with the rhythm of No S. I’m still very pleased to have had a green month.

I haven’t heard of Jenn Hand, pink - but that whole thing of eating every 3 hours seems to be a fairly common idea. It’s good that Georgie Fear disputes this, as does No S of course. Though Reinhard doesn’t give scientific reasons (not that I recall) - and I find it helpful to be assured scientifically that it won’t necessarily upset my blood sugar to go for longer. I certainly noticed this weekend that with a few snacks and sweets thrown in, I didn’t feel so good. Before dinner yesterday I felt incredibly tired and low. Bigger, wholesome meals are by far the best policy. Probably a good approach for this week, for me, is to look up some new recipes and do some decent cooking.

This morning’s weight - 10 stone 12

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:19 pm

This morning I spent some time looking back at the early days of my thread, December 2017, and it was very interesting and quite uplifting really. My life has become much less stressful as DD has become older and more independent, plus I work less...my health is better - I sleep better even though it’s not as well as I’d like, and I am way more capable of sticking to No S. Much less reliant on calorific drinks, much more able to tolerate hunger (even though I still have moments where it’s not good).

It was also great to read helpful comments from Oolala and many more of you. I’d forgotten some of Oolala’s great motto phrases, and how ‘addiction-proof’ I found them -eg. ‘I’ll be happier if I stick to my plan’. So simple, so devastatingly effective!

Also, I remembered some of my old, addictive mantras which I mentioned back then: eg. I’ll eat healthily as long as it makes me lose weight. Lord, talk about the voice of depression! You can see why I was doomed to a. put on weight and b. not be very healthy from that terrible logic. I haven’t thought that thought for a long time. That’s great! :)

I’m going to spend more time looking back (though I don’t want to get too immersed in sad or difficult memories) and also, looking at other No Sers’ threads. As pinkhippie said, it’s good to stay engaged.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Jen1974 » Mon Aug 03, 2020 2:39 pm

I too learned so much from my original thread!! It was funny to watch me do so well yet not be happy with “good enough”. It taught me this time to really focus on “mark it & move on” instead of mark it & try to eat less to make up for it 😊

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:13 pm

I am glad you are finding wisdom in your earlier entries! I find it so helpful to spot patterns and mindsets too. Sometimes I cringe when I read my old posts but I am glad they are there. I also always had the not good enough must be perfect mentality.

I know that idea of every 3 hours for blood sugar seems to be quite prevalent. However, my blood sugar actually seems to do a lot better when I have more hours in between eating. I did find a guy and a blog who is really refreshing to read if you are doing 3 meals a day and not trying to stick to a certain way of eating. (Vegan, Keto, low carb, etc)He basically says eating moderate balanced meals with no snacking saved his life and is the key to good health. Anyway, I find him great to read when I am trying to stay motivated for No S and not getting crazy with restriction or weird meal plans. His name is Chris Mole and his blog is called 360 degree health if you are interested. As always, I take everything with a grain of salt but I like what he has to say for the most part.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:53 am

Thanks so much auto and pink. Will check out this Chris Mole guy! And yes, I take most things with a pinch of salt, too! And I’m sure my blood sugar is more balanced than when I was permasnacking. In those days I could get hungry very soon after a meal - like one and a half to two hours. It was bewildering. Things are better now, even though I do have a few spells of desperation.

Yesterday I had dinner around 6.30pm and it’s now 9 am, and I still haven’t eaten anything (DH is taking up all the space in our small kitchen...). A long fast! Hopped on the scales. Argh! Have gone right back up, almost to my starting point a month ago, give or take half a pound. But this is something I learned from my thread. It does take a while to start working. The scale does not cooperate in a simple way. But I still like to weigh almost every day. It keeps me focussed, and forces a certain realism. This is not a quick fix. As if... :lol:

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Soprano » Tue Aug 04, 2020 11:45 am

Pinkhippie, I've just been checking out Chris Mole, an interesting read thank you

Octavia, I recall it took me a while to start consistently losing and I often see the scales go up and down even now. As long as the trend is down I wouldn't worry

Jx
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Tue Aug 04, 2020 3:08 pm

Octavia I used to have the same problem too with being hungry shortly after meals.

Scales really do wildly fluctuate and they can be discouraging, but for me its a good idea to weigh every day. Any time in the past that I have stopped weighing myself I gained a lot of weight. My scale was up a few pounds this morning too but I know I didn't gain 2 pounds in one day. So, I have just had to get a lot more laid back about the scale. It's great to remember that this is not a quick fix.

Soprano, glad you found Chris Mole interesting! I am always on the lookout for people who tout 3 meals a day with no snacks! It is kind of rare.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:40 pm

I feel like 3 meals a day w/o snacks has gained momentum in recent years. Probably thanks to the popularity of intermittent fasting, because people are then more accepting of the concept that humans are perfectly fine without eating so often.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Wed Aug 05, 2020 3:57 pm

Very true auto. I feel like 2 meals a day has gained a lot of traction also because of intermittent fasting but eating only 2 meals a day on purpose always feels like deprivation over the long haul for me.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 05, 2020 11:08 pm

Same here, I don’t think I’d do well without my three meals. But I can do a long fast between dinner and breakfast the next day. I do feel slightly hungry but it’s not interfering with my sleep.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:50 pm

Yes, I am the same Octavia. In fact, I discovered that eating after dinner actually WILL wake me up at about 5 am with a rumbling stomach. If I don't eat after dinner, that doesn't happen. I assume because I get hungry around 1 am or so but I am deeply asleep so it doesn't wake me up and by the time morning rolls around its been long enough that I haven't eaten that I'm not hungry anymore.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Fri Aug 07, 2020 5:54 am

Yes it’s not a quick fix. Sometimes it takes awhile for the scales to catch up to us. I get frustrated with the scales too but what’s the alternative right? Now that i stopped IF, my brain has been quieted again. It’s so nice!

Anyway, you’re doing great!
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Aug 07, 2020 3:29 pm

I have a similar thing where if I eat a lot of processed food/fast food for dinner, I'm starving the next morning.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Aug 08, 2020 8:21 am

Had my first NWS day yesterday - an afternoon party. Ate fairly lightly but did snack a bit later. Tried to weigh myself this morning but my scales have broken! Put new battery in but still no joy. They are very old though. Maybe I should get some new ones, perhaps old-fashioned ones. I’ve never used the fat/muscle function - how does that even work? - well I did use it that one time, when it told me I had so much fat I was pretty much obese, despite my moderate weight. I was so disconcerted that I vowed never to do it again. To change all that fat into muscle would have been a full time job, so I thought... :roll:

Not much else to report. Must go and update Habitcal.

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Octavia
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Aug 08, 2020 12:10 pm

Wow it’s so hot, I have become totally inert. Lying around is making me feel depressed, but I can’t find the energy to focus on anything. Bah.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:42 pm

I think I have read that the fat and muscle readings on scales at home can be pretty inaccurate. It is so hard to get up energy when its hot! Maybe just lazing around would be all right. Sorry you are feeling depressed. How long does your hot weather typically last? Are you due for a weather break yet? Can you go swimming anywhere? Even a kiddie pool in the backyard maybe. Anyway, I hope you feel better soon!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Tue Aug 11, 2020 8:00 am

Aww thanks pink. I’m OK. And apparently the hot weather is going to last till the weekend. We don’t normally have long, boiling hot summers in the UK, just occasional weeks or fortnights when it’s hot. Saturday was a write-off for me, for three possible reasons - I’d done a lot of travelling the day before; I’d taken an antihistamine the day before; and I’ve clocked up a lot of disturbed nights due to the heat...maybe those things combined made me go all floppy. In fact I slept for most of the afternoon. Yesterday, Monday, I felt my energy return. And in fact despite the heat I got a lot done.

I experimented with a new mind-set yesterday. I often have problems with feeling overwhelmed, and end up inert and frustrated, because I feel I have no hope of getting everything done, and the small niggly tasks distract me from settling to do anything meaningful or satisfying. So I just decided to calmly do one task at a time, not thinking ahead but having an attitude of trust, that it would all get done. I was amazed at how well this worked, even in the heat and having to take lots of breaks. Usually everything seems to crowd into my head at once. I need to be more ‘sequential’, and definitely avoid getting angry or frustrated at life’s disruptive trivia. Since lockdown I’ve felt more in control of all this, to be honest. I have done more creative things and more self-care, without a doubt.

Yesterday was the first challenging day I’ve had since I re-started No S last month - challenging in the fact that I was invited to a friend’s for a small garden social, including nibbles and drinks. Two things were unclear: how much food would be served and at what time. So I actually asked for clarification, feeling a little rude. But I needed to know whether to have some dinner before going out. It turned out that there was enough food to call it dinner, but I had to survive till after 9pm. I did this by having a late lunch and a drink of milk...and alcohol at my friend’s house...anyway I was fine, and glad to call it a green day, as I was wondering just to make it an NWS. Convoluted days like this are more rare now, during lockdown, which I suppose is why I feel a bit more in control. But as lockdown continues and there is word of a second wave of COVID infections, I am starting to wonder if normal life will ever be resumed.

Tomorrow we are having two friends round, so that will definitely be an NWS day. And my scales are broken so I’m feeling like I’m losing momentum a bit, but I’ll just have to remember that it’s not all about weight loss. This last weekend reminded me of the insanity of feed-on-demand. How with snacking, you’ve never had enough - there is no stop point (well, not until you’ve had too much!). It is better to have some boundaries, and if my own are somewhat broken then they have to be reimposed from outside.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:18 pm

I am glad youare Ok! I hope that the hot weather goes away for you very soon. It's hard to be motivated when you are hot.

Your mindset sounds very successful! I find that when I make a little list with a box next to each item of all I need to get done, I feel way less overwhelmed because once the task is on paper, I don't have it crowding my headspace anymore. I don't do it as much as I should though.

I am sure it can feel worrisome to have your scales broken but just remember forming the habits is ultimately more important than the scale. I am a hypocrite here as I like to weigh every day but I do logically know that is the truth. Waiting until after 9 pm to eat dinner is amazing! I would have a very hard time with that. I totally agree that feed on demand just doesn't work. I think because I never really get truly hungry with feed on demand so I (ironically) lose touch with my body's hunger and fullness signals.

Good luck with your social event tomorrow! Enjoy your NWS day!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:27 pm

Today is being challenging. It’s very hot again, and I’ve been working, hoping to finish something but not able to - realising it’s much more sensible to leave a project than to struggle on getting depleted. Also shopping for the hosting tomorrow.the house is a tip. DD has ordered lots of homeware for her move to college in September, even though I told her there wouldn’t be room in the car for too much stuff and it would be better to get some things once she arrives in her shared house. But ordering and preparing for ‘adult’ life is too much fun for her to resist, and (bless her) she is paying from her own bank account, even though she doesn’t have to. But massive boxes are mounting up in the house! She is so child-like in some respects, endearingly desperate to be independent and play house with her friends.

There’s been a lot of petty frustration today - including not having enough room in the fridge for all the food I bought. As I tried to make room, I found lots of out of date food that I’d bought for DD. How many little frustrations does it take to make a person abandon their diet plan? I’m hungry, DH is cooking later, but DD isn’t home from her part time job yet. I could just stuff down one of the three ‘Tesco Finest’ scotch eggs I found in the fridge which go out of date tomorrow...ARGHHH. I’m really fed up.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:12 pm

I hope that things settle for you soon.

I loved that you have moments when you just focus on the thing in front of you and are able to shut out the noise of other "to-dos". That is embracing the Power of Now, as Eckhart Tolle would tell us! :-)
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Aug 13, 2020 4:50 pm

Precisely, auto! Although I don’t feel like a New Ager, there are some very powerful concepts in The Power of Now! In fact one or two paragraphs have helped me enormously with anxiety. The general idea of ‘one thing at a time‘ is such a great life skill.* Over the last couple of days I’ve started wondering if I might be on the ADHD spectrum, as I get distressed when there are many competing priorities in my head, and am very easily distracted when juggling trivial/unrewarding tasks. I also find boredom really intolerable. However, I think many of us feel that way.

*one thing at a time also resonates with No S - the idea of one meal at a time...

Anyway, back to the present moment...which is all we have... :) I’ve had my first Fail day since restarting No S. Ate cake this afternoon. Was feeling tired and low, and it was left over from yesterday when we had friends round. Yesterday was such hard work, tidying and decluttering in the blistering heat before our guests arrived, and I was also feeling very sensitive and easily hurt by one guest who is a lovely person but very outspoken. Naturally this led to rumination over friendships and why do I find them so difficult. So I was somewhat primed to have a lapse today.

However, I’m feeling a bit better now. But I MUST buy some new scales, because I’ve lost touch with the idea of losing weight. I know it’s not the main point of No S, but I still feel it’s something I mustn’t lose touch with.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Aug 14, 2020 3:29 pm

Yesterday was so tough for you - I remember when I read that post I thought how unusual of a post it was for you. I even scanned back in my mind because I couldn't recall you ever feeling so ... frustrated. So it's not surprising, like you said, that you had a little slip. But we know that's no big deal, right? :-) Mark it and move on. One meal at a time, as you said!

I'm thinking about you - between the heat, the new things with your DD, and this outspoken guest........
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Aug 14, 2020 8:03 pm

I am sorry that you are feeling so frustrated. I had to look up a scotch egg to see what that was! Those look very interesting. I have never heard of them before.

I have trouble with feeling sensitive over friendships too. My feelings get hurt easily and I also overthink everything TO DEATH. What really helps me is to focus on the present moment like you mentioned, and to remind myself that they are probably not even thinking about whatever it is I am obsessing about. It helps. I don't know if you have ADHD but my husband does and that is exactly what happens to him. He gets very agitated when too many things are going on and he is easily distracted. Sometimes he gets upset with me because I do not stay on task or even on subject and its hard for him to follow, and it frustrates him.

I hope you have been able to buy some new scales! I understand feeling that it is a necessary part to stay in touch with.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:13 pm

Thanks so much guys. I’ve felt down again today and had another red day! Not doing too well after a great July. No matter how much I read about stress and anxiety, I still buy into overthinking and analysis paralysis!
pinkhippie wrote:
Fri Aug 14, 2020 8:03 pm
I had to look up a scotch egg to see what that was! Those look very interesting. I have never heard of them before.
They are a bit grotesque really...a hard boiled egg encased in sausage meat with breadcrumbs on the outside. A festival of processed protein and fat!

Pink, I so appreciate your sympathy - I don’t understand why friendships have become so fraught for me. I seem to have become more self-reliant as I’ve got older, and I don’t want to waste time having long lunches or phone calls when I could be reading or doing creative projects. So I’m always tense and dreading the inevitable invitations to time-consuming social ventures, which I don’t know how to refuse. Is this a ‘women’s’ thing? Are men routinely expected to drop everything for lunch or coffee mornings? And yet I appreciate and love my friends, so I feel guilty and conflicted. People talk about setting boundaries, but such complex, hidden forces and subtle rules are at work in these social interactions.

I need to get back to my Leslie workouts! Finally the weather has got a bit cooler, so maybe tomorrow I’ll get that healthy selfishness thing going again.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Aug 14, 2020 9:15 pm

PS. Have ordered scales on Amazon! I really need to re-focus.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Aug 14, 2020 11:31 pm

I don’t want to waste time having long lunches or phone calls when I could be reading or doing creative projects. So I’m always tense and dreading the inevitable invitations to time-consuming social ventures, which I don’t know how to refuse. And yet I appreciate and love my friends, so I feel guilty and conflicted.
I so, so, so, so relate. I am quite content on my own, but I do know that I value my friendships and don't want them to disappear. I am grateful for my friendships, but I just don't need a ton of interaction to feel satisfied.

I feel like you are describing an introvert's problem, not necessarily a gender issue (although it could be - but in my house, my husband also feels pressure sometimes to interact with his friends and to stay connected).

Oh, and the dread you mentioned? I totally get that! In fact, my husband teases me when I set up a social thing because he knows that when the day arrives, I'll be wanting to stay home. :-)
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Tue Aug 18, 2020 10:55 pm

...that makes me feel better auto, knowing that you understand and empathise.thanks so much. :)

I’ve had two fail days this month, preceded by one NWS - I wonder if the NWS day interfered with my rhythm, knocked me off course. So in fact I’ve only had 8 green days, and I don’t feel at all as if I’m on the path to greater slimness. I’ve got right out of the habit of welcoming and tolerating hunger! Must get back to it. I think it’s a cornerstone of weight loss. But I have got back on the wagon this week, even if I’m using calorific drinks more to tide me over. I did that a lot in my last successful phase of No S so I’m not too concerned about it. New scales have arrived! Arghhh I’m once again in terror of getting on them. I’ve a horrible feeling that my fledgling weight loss will have all been cancelled out by my recent fails.

Still, I am not just doing this for weight loss. I’m doing it to impose a much-needed healthy routine in my life, and because Feed on Demand leads to misery!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 19, 2020 9:52 am

Well hurrah for the new scales! They say I have lost a little weight! :o

Can this be possible, in a month where I’ve had slightly more yellow and red days than green? (Ratio of 8 greens to 10 non-greens!) The new scales are ridiculously specific, and said I was 10 stone 9 and 7/8ths. :lol: :lol:

If I remember rightly, I was about 4lb heavier when I started my recent No S journey not quite 2 months ago. Hmmm. It must be the scales... :lol: :lol:

Apologies if this weight loss talk is triggering for anyone reading.

So I feel a little encouraged, but I know better than to ‘run with it’ and try to continue my ‘winning streak’ by cutting down on calories. It’s better just to keep plodding away with three randomly planned (yet hopefully healthy) meals a day and whatever exercise I can do. One must not wake the lightly-sleeping Giant of Binge!

Breakfast: piece of German-style rye bread with peanut butter, plus a little ramekin of dried fruit and nuts. Coffee with splash of milk.

Lunch will be: some sort of egg thing probably
Dinner will be: in pub with friends, trying to socially distance. So I’m likely to consume stodge* plus white wine. Neither healthy nor light...

* my favourite word to denote doughy, fat-making food, usually carb-rich and the opposite of a tossed salad with quinoa and watercress. :wink:
Last edited by Octavia on Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:43 pm

Yay for your weight loss!! I agree we need to be careful not to go too far in the other direction and start restricting and/or over exercising. That seems to always backfire on me too!

Enjoy your pub night. Boy do I miss socializing! 😊
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:52 pm

Thanks Linda, and I will think of you this evening in the pub...it must be hard, self-isolating. 💐

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Wed Aug 19, 2020 3:10 pm

I just wanted to say that I have the same problem with socializing Octavia. I am terrible about setting boundaries and have a hard time saying no when I need to not hang out.

Congratutlations on the weight loss and I am glad you got new scales! I agree with not taking it to the extreme and trying to achieve results by cutting down. Just keep doing what you are doing. Sometimes 3 meals a day of random stuff just doesn't feel like doing enough of a change but then whenever I go off the rails a bit, vacation or something, I realize how it really IS a big change and a healthy one and over time it will make a difference.

Enjoy your pub night! I agree with Linda here and really miss going out.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 19, 2020 3:40 pm

Thanks, pinkie. It is indeed hard saying no...I have a big circle of friends and even if I only saw each friend once a year, that would make a busy social life. Sometimes when I meet a new person and get on really well, part of me is thinking NOOOO, please don’t make friends with me, I can’t deal with another person who’ll need coffees and lunches...terrible thought, huh? But that’s how it is, that’s how I feel, and honesty is what our forum is good for.

My happy news regarding the scales was quickly put into perspective when I tried on what i thought was a newish dress, and it was too tight! Maybe 3 years old? Can’t remember when I bought it but it was a navy wrap style from the super cool brand, All Saints. Bah! Had to swap it for an old favourite which thankfully still fits, just about.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:11 pm

Octavia, I am not surprised (but a little envious) about how clearly popular you are! :mrgreen:
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 19, 2020 9:42 pm

...i was wildly exaggerating I’m sure...as well as being a bit grumpy... :oops:

Pub evening went well, though we were sitting outside and it was a bit cold. I was driving so had just one alcoholic drink which didn’t help me feel jolly...but still enjoyed it.

I’m going to have a nice relaxing bath now and hopefully get a good night’s sleep.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:37 pm

I was going to say the same as Auto! You must be just as likeable in person as you are in print! :) I am glad the pub night went well! It sounds pretty nice to sit outside. Too bad it was chilly!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Aug 21, 2020 3:47 pm

Thanks pinkie! :)

Weight has gone up a pound since the Happy Morning of the New Scales. Despite me staying green! Still, I seem to be about 3lb lighter than at the start of July. If only I could trust that I’m truly going in the right direction, and it’s not just luck or a random fluctuation. I would love to lose a stone, but whether vanilla No S can get me there, I’m not sure. It is so important to have non-weight loss motivation! I just keep remembering how permasnacking leads to constant dissatisfaction and unfulfilment. How it exaggerates negative moods in order to perpetuate and justify itself.

When I had my two fail days last week, following on from an NWS, it was a sober reminder of the power of bad habits. I’d just wobbled in the wrong direction momentarily, but quickly found myself shackled again to the alter of Sweets and Snacks! And yet here I am, green again. The way I got back was by using a small glass of strawberry milkshake to cope with the intense cravings for a treat. Calorific drinks are for me a really useful bridge back to green-ness, when the Giant of Binge has me in its grasp again. After a while, the No S rhythm reasserts itself and I no longer need the comfort of the milkshake.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:12 pm

Oh yes! I totally relate to what you are saying about the power of bad habits! I was worried that after vacation last week, that I wasn't going to be able to find my way back to No S. it's amazing how quickly they take hold! I did something similar with the shake only mine was yogurt and fruit. To me it feels desserty enough to be a useful bridge back to no sweets. And, the first few days when I really really wanted something sweet I reminded myself that it would just make getting back to my good habits even harder and so I managed to avoid it.

I agree that it is really important to have non-weight loss motivation! I am pretty sure that weight loss motivation doesn't' make it for the long haul, but wanting to have a good relationship with food and feeling good every day is a motivation that seems to last.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Aug 22, 2020 8:29 am

Totally! And yet I still feel the need to track weight loss...it’s a strange thing. I’ve written about this before, the subtle, tricky interaction between our weight loss wishes and our other important motivation. For me, neither works alone. Is it that weight loss is a carrot, and the insanity of permasnacking is a stick? We need something to go towards, and something to run from? But for some, it’ll work the other way round....weight gain is a stick, and greater peace around food is a carrot....

...not my most coherent post... :lol:

But anyway. I weighed myself this morning and weight had gone down. Really pleased. I’m going to keep my own record of this as I would really hate anyone to be triggered by any specific details. This morning I feel no particular craving for treats, but then my S days always start like this. I know that after one or two snacks or sweet things, woah! I’m as addicted as I ever was. It really is incredible, the strength of that habit.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Sat Aug 22, 2020 7:48 pm

I know what you are saying. It makes sense to me about the carrot and the stick. Congrats on your scale going down. I also keep track too. I do notice that I seem less insane about the number then I used to be. And I put the number out of my mind pretty quickly where as the number used to define my entire day. It is such a tricky thing.

And yep, it's amazing how only a few sweets or snacks seem to immediately trigger the desire for more more!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Aug 22, 2020 8:37 pm

...yes, and I have already fallen victim to it! :oops: Have eaten a large chocolate bar and am already wondering how I’ll get through tomorrow without more chocolate! The strength of these habits!

But although I’m marvelling at my brain wiring, I’m not worrying too much, because S days are a vital safety valve. I am not yet ready to modify them, and I’m not going to try. My last stint on No S fizzled out for a few reasons, one of which was trying to use willpower on weekends. The others (as far as I recall) were giving up Habitcal after becoming afraid of the feeling of rigid compliance; failing to see that hunger could be a good sign and something I could often endure; and forgetting that calorific drinks could help in situations of strong craving.

In my most successful vanilla days, I ate chocolate on the weekends, filled in Habitcal, and had calorific drinks when I needed them. The difference this time is that sometimes I feel strong enough to welcome a bit of hunger. But I’m being careful not to push it.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:17 am

Seems like you’re learning to get just the right balance with the whole eating/food thing. It’s so nice when we get into a good groove and find that sweet spot.

In the book I’m reading it talks about how sugar just created a continued cycle of craving/giving into craving/more cravings. I can see how that is true but don’t know if I’m ready to give up sugar forever...
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:03 am

That’s definitely my experience, Linda. It’s amazing how quickly a bite of something sweet (which feels like a choice) leads to a feeling of no-choice, a distracting, maddening preoccupation with getting more. I can’t believe how much chocolate I’ve eaten this weekend. I’m tempted to start a rule of no sweets on Saturdays, but i suspect that an extra rule will backfire. It has to be a genuine choice, and yet....an amber light is a green light to my addictive appetite!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Tue Aug 25, 2020 11:17 pm

Mmmm chocolate. Lately I have really been craving hot chocolate so I have been checking out chocolate teas... I count them as an N day.

I know what you mean about an additional rule backfiring. If you don't feel ready for it, definitely don't do it! I think S days are really a wonderful release valve when we need them. Some S days have more "releasing" than others. :D

Hope you are doing well!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Wed Aug 26, 2020 10:01 am

Thanks pink! This week is going well, I think - in that I’m enjoying the rhythm of No S. I had slightly mad weekends before and still managed to lose weight. I think if you accept how they are, just go with it and enjoy it, then you can return to N days with no problem. Really establishing the habit is my ultimate aim right now.

Chocolate tea!!! I didn’t know it existed! Must find some. :)

I’m being so careful to keep to my old routines. Habitcal every day, and calorific drinks if hungry or craving. I feel those drinks really break the snacking habit and for me, are better than white-knuckling (which seems to bolster the WTH effect). Though I’m managing to welcome hunger a bit more. But it’s basic Vanilla all the way for me. I think it will be a long time before I have the brain-space to tweak my plates and make them smaller or leaner.

At one time I used to have a mod I called Fibre Supplement, which was fruit eaten as an afternoon snack. But I think that was part of the unravelling of my good habits. I would rather tag the fruit on after a meal.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Wed Aug 26, 2020 1:27 pm

Good stuff to hear about with your pure vanilla. I'm currently off the rails.... so reading about your careful fencing of the rules helps me keep my feet on the ground.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Thu Aug 27, 2020 12:31 am

I have been doing the same thing with calorific drinks Octavia. I have decided that chewing snacks seem to cement the snacking habit too much. I am trying really hard to just do 3 meals a day now with a smoothie or a glass of milk if I need it. I think it has made a difference in terms of mental habit, as I have not been craving snacks as much once I stopped chewing something for a snack and started just drinking something if I needed it between lunch and dinner.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Thu Aug 27, 2020 1:24 pm

Glad things are going so well. Wish I could say the same. I think you’re smart not to tweak too much. I used to put a piece of fruit on my plate with my other food just to make sure it all fit in one plate. Then I’d take it off and eat it directly afterwards.
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:02 pm

...thanks pink, Linda and auto. I think there is a real magic to the Vanilla routine. I really believe that anything you do within that fence is OK. Smoothies, milk, even soup or hot chocolate: if it’s not solid then it’s not a snack*, and it can help to build the habit of moderation. I admit though, I’ve sometimes wondered if I’d be better off floating past my cravings instead of giving in to a calorific drink, which is after all a form of habitual response. However, I’ve never got very far with that sort of floaty thing - the elusive ‘accepting’ and ‘dismissing’ cravings that many writers speak of (Eg. Gillian Riley or Kathryn Hansen). I’m not sure my brain is very good at abstract, highly evolved concepts such as acceptance! I’m more a ME WANT! or ME NO LIKEY! sort of gal.

*I’d draw the line at melted ice cream, though... :lol: :lol:

In my experience it’s better to divert a craving into a gratifying glass of juice or milk. I think that retrains the habit. The habit may still be alive, but it’s less harmful. Erasing a compulsive habit by ignoring it is a tall order. Though obviously there are people who can do it! I think I can occasionally, but eventually the self-denial feels insane and I crack. Accepting true hunger is slightly different - I can do that!* But a mental-physical-habitual craving is a more dangerous animal. Maybe it’s a case of gradually modifying those mental pathways instead of trying to erase them. Anyway...I feel classic Vanilla helps me do that.

*on a good day, when the wind is blowing in the right direction... :lol: :lol:

This is all so individual isn’t it? We all have such different challenges, our habits have evolved in different ways. Auto and Linda, I hope these tricky times pass for you. Thanks so much for cheering me on while I’m - by some miracle - managing to stay green. :)

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Mon Aug 31, 2020 6:26 pm

I agree with you about habit. That is why I have made a line between chewing and drinking calories for snacks. If I drink calories, my brain and mental craving aren't satisfied. However, eventually, about 20 minutes later, I realized that my body IS satisfied. So I think that drinking my calories doesn't reward that mental craving, but gives my body something it actually needed.

Hope you are doing well and had a good weekend!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:09 pm

Thanks, Pink! I haven’t checked in for a few days because there’s not been much to report. I’m gently being aware of my good No S habits and doing my best not to disturb them. Weekends are still mad, but I’m noticing that the madness starts late on a Saturday, so I might just observe that to see if this might develop - perhaps I will start postponing the treats till Sunday. But oh boy, I don’t want to rock this boat... :lol:

Weight very much the same as last week, up half a pound in fact. Again, I don’t want to react to this in any particular way. Trying to stay Zen...slightly detached.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:52 pm

No news is good news as they say! :) I understand about not wanting to react to the scale! It's tough isn't it? I just remind myself that my worth can't be weighed by the scale. It helps sometimes. :)

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:39 pm

...not much to report at present...I’m just doing Vanilla in a nice, easy way and not wanting to interfere with the habit. Forgot to weigh this morning but the last time I did, I was slightly up. I’m around 3lb lighter than when I started back on No S in July. That sounds rather unremarkable, but to lose anything is a miracle in my view! So I’m still just staying calm and steady.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Fri Sep 11, 2020 12:11 am

Sounds like you are doing great! Vanilla No S and 3 pounds less than July IS remarkable since you are eating in a sustainable calm and steady way. I am glad things are going well for you.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:01 am

Ah, thanks so much, pink. I needed that reminder that it is a good result. This morning I weighed myself and the number had gone up again, leaving me feeling very disgruntled. I did a 10 mile walk yesterday! :roll: It is so hard to tell if No S is ‘working’ - though it is of course working in that I feel less insane and out of control, and very much enjoying my meals. But the small weight gain just feels a bit like a punishment or a mockery somehow. No doubt because my expectations are still unrealistic. That’s the trouble with my age, height and weight. How I am now is normal (but at the heavy end of normal) and my body won’t necessarily want to shed that weight. I must go back to the post where I did a bit of rough calorie counting, and calculated how much I thought I’d lose per month, eating the amount I now do. My conclusion was that I was on track to lose a tiny amount each month. That’s how it should be. But because I had a couple of weeks when it dropped more quickly, my expectations rose. I need to get my head around this. I am still perfectly on track with my hard-headed calculations!

Eating the amount I do, though, there will come a point when the weight loss will stop, and I will just be the size of a moderate-eating woman. Perhaps that point has come? Already? That’s the fear when one reaches a plateau. I’m hoping that by moderate eating I can lose at least another half a stone...ah well, I’m not going to give up now. These vanilla habits are too precious to me.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Whosonfirst » Fri Sep 11, 2020 10:11 am

Octavia wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:01 am
Ah, thanks so much, pink. I needed that reminder that it is a good result. This morning I weighed myself and the number had gone up again, leaving me feeling very disgruntled. I did a 10 mile walk yesterday! :roll: It is so hard to tell if No S is ‘working’ - though it is of course working in that I feel less insane and out of control, and very much enjoying my meals. But the small weight gain just feels a bit like a punishment or a mockery somehow. No doubt because my expectations are still unrealistic. That’s the trouble with my age, height and weight. How I am now is normal (but at the heavy end of normal) and my body won’t necessarily want to shed that weight. I must go back to the post where I did a bit of rough calorie counting, and calculated how much I thought I’d lose per month, eating the amount I now do. My conclusion was that I was on track to lose a tiny amount each month. That’s how it should be. But because I had a couple of weeks when it dropped more quickly, my expectations rose. I need to get my head around this. I am still perfectly on track with my hard-headed calculations!

Eating the amount I do, though, there will come a point when the weight loss will stop, and I will just be the size of a moderate-eating woman. Perhaps that point has come? Already? That’s the fear when one reaches a plateau. I’m hoping that by moderate eating I can lose at least another half a stone...ah well, I’m not going to give up now. These vanilla habits are too precious to me.
10 mile walk, that's great! How long does that take, 3-1/2 to 4 hours? Wow. As to weights, I have a theory(totally unscientific) that our bodies have a desired weight, and they often snap back to something relatively close to that weight after being told what to do. We've all known people, relatives in my case, that were very skinny and some of them could eat like lumberjacks. And I've seen the opposite true as well. Somehow the skinny types seem to defy the laws of physics about burning excess fuel(food) and adding on weight.
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Current weight(9/2020)-212 lbs.
Goal Weight- 205 lbs.
NoS Goal: >= 80% Success days

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:59 pm

Hi Whosonfirst! The walk took us a bit under 5 hrs, with two decent breaks. I was totally done in afterwards! Nice to walk in the countryside though.

I’ve had a classic, bad fail tonight. I got really angry as dinner was delayed due to what I thought was selfish behaviour from DH. I would love to write more but it would be peevish and piggy-eyed to do so. :twisted: :lol:

I’m also stressed because a friend is coming for lunch tomorrow and the house is a tip, the dinner table isn’t even accessible! Anyway, I got so hungry and frustrated that I ate tortilla chips before our salad dinner, and chocolate biscuits afterwards. FAIL!!! It was particularly bad because it was very self-destructive. I was angry with someone else and couldn’t express it, so took it out on myself. I haven’t felt like this for ages - which I suppose is a good thing...!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Sat Sep 12, 2020 3:17 am

I totally could have written this post - mad at the hubby for his selfish behavior, but knowing marriage is just like that it's not worth feeling all high and mighty, so trying to let it go (good luck!). :-)

And then digging into the tortilla chips! One of my favorite fail-types! :mrgreen: :roll:

I hope you feel better tomorrow and that the house comes together easier than you were thinking, and that you enjoy your time with your friend!
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Sat Sep 12, 2020 5:46 am

Hugs! Sounds very stressful and understandable that you might revert to some old coping mechanisms. The good news is that youve built up enough days of better habits and the different ways in which they make you feel will seem very obvious. Im pretty sure you’ll be very motivated to stick with the healthier coping mechanisms after that. i feel like sometimes we just have to double check for ourselves. It’s like “yup, that still makes me feel like crap”. Then we can get back on track more confident then ever. onward. I guess it’s a week for being mad at the husbands! ☺️
Last edited by lpearlmom on Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
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GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Sep 12, 2020 9:11 am

Thanks so much for the solidarity, ladies. I so appreciate it! I could have made things better for myself yesterday, looking back, and probably could have avoided this fail by ensuring that some sort of dinner was ready on time. I got angry and stubborn because meal responsibility seems to be defaulting to me more and more, these days.

So....I am now just 2lb lighter than in July despite all my green days and exercise. But surrendering to the unlikelihood of weight loss is part of the commitment - I know that demanding weight loss in return for good habits is a waste of time - I must practise good habits anyway. That’s how I launched myself into No S in the first place. For someone of my age and weight, ‘slimming’ is not a good reason to do No S. For someone of my statistics, it’s more an anti-weight gain regime. And maybe that’s good - It encourages me to focus on the now, to cherish and protect what I already have, rather than living in the future with the expectation that things will be better then. Having said that, I did calculate that the vanilla routine should allow me to lose a little weight, very slowly. We shall see.

Well I’d better get on with tidying up for my friend coming round. I am looking forward to seeing her.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:06 pm

A 10 mile walk is so impressive! I have noticed sometimes the scale goes up for me after intense exercise. Like after my big bike rides. I agree with you that weight loss shouldn't' be the top priority on why you do the habits but I also know how hard it is to not make that the motivation in return for the habits. weight is so fluctuating and weird(dependent on many things) though, and habits can be rock solid and forever so, in the long run, focusing on habits as a measure of progress and success makes more sense logically, but I struggle with knowing this and still focusing on the weight too.

I have done exactly what you describe, getting angry at DH and eating my way through it. I even have some entry in my journal from a few years ago about realizing that eating (fill in the blank) is not really getting back at my DH and its only hurting me. It's great that you recognized what you were doing though! I have had times where I have done that unconsciously as well.

I am glad you get to see your friend! I hope you have a good time!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:37 pm

Thanks pink! I did have a lovely time seeing my friend. Also managed to tidy the house more quickly than I expected!

I’ve had a run of fail days since last Friday. I am feeling more stressed, and there were leftovers from the weekend, though that doesn’t entirely explain it. I am feeling very unmotivated - unless I change my weekends radically, I won’t lose weight this way, and I wonder if I might even continue to gain - very slowly. I know it’s not all about weight loss, but I’m not sure my routine is that healthy either! I have been enjoying my food though.

I need to refocus my mind somehow...

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:53 pm

Also managed to tidy the house more quickly than I expected!
This is my favorite feeling!

On the other hand, that scary feeling that weight gain is insidious is a feeling I don't like at all! :cry:
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:51 pm

It sounds like maybe stress is getting to you? I know its really having an effect on me and my eating and food choices. Even my exercise.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:56 pm

Even after years of doing NOS my S days never really resolved themselves on their own. I do much better with keeping some structure on S days. Right now my plan is to keep my 3 plates with 2 small plates added in to that for a snack and dessert if I want. Otherwise I tend to just have one long snackathon and that doesn’t feel good. Anyway, I hope you find something that works for you. 💜
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Jen1974 » Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:06 pm

I go through the same type of thing when I have something like a little bit of gain or clothes feeling a little snug where I feel pressure to “fix” it & end up self sabotaging myself. Not sure if you’re at all like me but I realized that too much focus on weight leaves me feeling low key restricted & leaves me responding with some low key rebelling :lol: I do better focusing on how awesome, energized, & happy I feel when I work on the habits instead!!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Thu Sep 17, 2020 6:00 pm

Jen, that’s it in a nutshell. Low key restricting leads to low key rebelling. I’ve realised that I must refocus on meals and good food. I’ve lost my focus partly because DD has gone to college, and the imperative to be organised and plan meals has evaporated. I need to get that planning back - it’s not so much the organisation that’s important as the mental focus, on lunch and dinner -ie. not on sweets and snacks. I feel as if I’m back on the wagon now after my wobble. Linda, that’s interesting about adding structure to S days. I definitely feel I need it, or I just revert to a snackathon, and all the old bingey habits come flooding back, jeopardising my N days. Pink, yes I have been stressed...and I’m realising that I need to learn to simply cultivate a feeling of ‘I am successful’. Whatever I do, I never celebrate it or feel I deserve to be pleased with myself, and I realise that until I learn this skill, I will always be held back in my attempts to change. I will always feel stressed, down and worried, and turning to the comfort and stimulation of treat foods.

Auto, there is a secret to my quick tidying up! DD has moved out to college! This means that when I tidy up, things STAY tidy! :lol:

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Jen1974 » Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:59 pm

I wouldn’t discount the impact your daughter leaving has had! When my son left my eating was off for a bit & I didn’t put it together until I was looking at the calendar where I keep track of how I’m doing. I had no successes for a while after he left :lol:

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Sep 18, 2020 11:38 pm

Excellent point, Jen.
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:25 pm

Yes - isn’t it funny how we down-play these major life changes? We feel it should be no big deal. But families are delicate eco-systems. A small change will affect the whole environment.

Last night I was listening to some ‘Spanish Chillout’ music on You Tube, and it prompted feelings of wanting to lead a more fun-seeking, laid- back, sunshiny life. Not always bent on achieving and fulfilling goals. I found myself imagining a more Mediterranean lifestyle...which may well be a complete fiction...and yet, trying hard to do good, upright things as a typical uptight Brit makes life so grey and tense. I thought to myself, how can I get a bit of this fantasy into my life? Of being more fun-loving and laid back? I have a little pack of fake tattoos (small, pretty designs) somewhere in the bedroom. I think they were a free gift a makeup product from Bourjois. So for years, I’ve been too timid even to put on a fake tattoo. But WHY NOT? could this be the gateway to a new Octavia? Bold and Alternative????? I will report back! 8)

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:27 pm

PS this is probably my first ever weekend where I haven’t gone to the shop to buy loads of goodies. I was aware that I didn’t really have the craving. I HAVE been non-green - I just ate a few nuts and crisps with a glass of wine before dinner. But I have no sweet treats in the house. This is perhaps a small step forward.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Sep 19, 2020 5:52 pm

I have applied the fake tattoo. It looks quite good, certainly realistic...though I feel a bit daft...it’s a feather shape and I’ve put it on my inner right bicep. It will be fun to clock DD’s reaction (she is home for the weekend). She knows I am a bit averse to real tattoos, as I would hate to have a random person’s artwork stuck on my body for ever. In fact I once found a folder on the iPad that she’d made, of cool tattoo ideas, and I inserted pics of really funny tattoo fails into it just to annoy her. :lol:

I’m going to pretend that it’s real and I had it done this afternoon while she was doing her part time job. This could backfire badly of course, if she decides to seek revenge... :lol:

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Sat Sep 19, 2020 7:50 pm

I LOVE this!!! Can't wait to hear the whole story, and especially if it backfires!!! :lol: :lol: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :wink: :wink:
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:43 pm

DD hasn’t even NOTICED it!! :shock: :x Is she pretending to be cool? I will confront her in the morning! Will definitely report back, auto!

It’s been one of my most moderate ever S days. I had a very small ramekin of ice cream for dessert. I haven’t had any excessive treats at all! Could I be finally learning? I just can’t eat to excess any more, regardless of the day of the week.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Sep 21, 2020 9:04 am

It turned out that DD had genuinely not noticed my tattoo. When I finally alerted her, she loved it, and DID think it was real! But I couldn’t bear to trick her for more than a minute. I once pranked her in the past by pretending I had met YouTube makeup guru Jeffree Star at a department store, and he had recorded a special message just for her. I got a very camp friend to do an impersonation on my phone. DD, who was only 11, was in raptures, and when I told her the truth she was so crestfallen. I felt terrible, and had to atone by buying her loads of expensive Jeffree Star products, shipped at great expense from the USA!! :lol: :lol:

Weight stubbornly not shifting. I’ve just seen some sort of diet advert with ladies going ‘I lost 30lb in four months’ and it lost 16lb in 2 months’. This ad just popped up from nowhere, and it has depressed me a bit, making me wonder if I am a bit useless at this dieting lark. But since the start of July I’ve only had about 4 red days, so that is surely quite good? I have hardly lost any weight at all, somewhere between 1 and 3 lb depending on the way the wind is blowing. Perhaps I should read the book again and recall what Reinhard has to say about weight loss tracking versus habits - i know it does take time for habits to bed in, and I think things are working well from that point of view.
Last edited by Octavia on Mon Sep 21, 2020 7:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Sep 21, 2020 10:24 am

Thinking of Healthyskillz’ signature motto: not giving up = winning!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:33 pm

I’ve had a green day, but slightly tricky. Breakfast was too small, a crummy small bowl of muesli with half fat milk, hardly enough food to fill a hollow tooth, as my mum used to say. :lol: Within two hours I was desperate for more food. But I hung on till lunchtime, had egg on toast with mushrooms and a tomato...but by 4pm I was really hungry again and dinner was going to be at 7, earliest. So I had an asparagus cuppa soup, and later, some milk. I was doing something where I needed full concentration, or I would have endured the hunger.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:53 am

Oh my goodness Octavia! I loved your tattoo story! Also, I can't believe you pranked your DD with Jefree Star! Oh my goodness! That is a creative prank!

Congratulations on your green day. I have been having a bit of a stressful time lately and have not done a green day yet, but I have noticed when I eat meals that are too small green days are SUPER hard. I start having lots of frantic thoughts about how I don't care anymore and it can lead to off the rails eating. It sounds like you are reaching a good moderate place with No S and that is fantastic! I consider that a real sucess.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:25 am

You’re doing great. I noticed how important it is to eat enough at my mealtimes. Sometimes I feel like it seems like too much when I see the amount on my plate but then I remind myself that when I graze all day, I’m probably eating way more than that. It’s just easier to trick myself when it’s not plated.

After doing NoS for 1 year and only losing a couple of pounds, I realized that my habit was so strong that I could tweak my plates as much as I wanted and I still would stick to my 3 plates. That 2nd year is when i ended up losing those 40 lbs. That happened by eating lighter food, upping my exercise and getting control of my weekends.

That’s a long way of saying I do think it’s really important to focus on solid habits before worrying about making changes in order to lose weight. Hang in there. You got this! 💜
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Tue Sep 22, 2020 2:41 pm

Linda said -
After doing NoS for 1 year and only losing a couple of pounds, I realized that my habit was so strong that I could tweak my plates as much as I wanted and I still would stick to my 3 plates. That 2nd year is when i ended up losing those 40 lbs. That happened by eating lighter food, upping my exercise and getting control of my weekends.
This is fabulous Linda!
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:34 am

Hi ladies,
Thanks for these positive posts, which have really cheered me up. I’ve been busy this last week and haven’t found time to check in. I have been doing Habitcal, though. I’m staying steady, and have had lots of fairly effortless green days. Linda, it’s so interesting and inspiring to hear about the difference between your first and second years on No S. This really buoys me up. I’ve been back on Vanilla No S since the start of July, and my weight has shifted down by about 3 lb. It’s not much*, but the habit side of things is going really well. Generally, I feel my addiction to sweets and snacks is very quiet, almost dormant, which is a wonderful, liberated feeling. Snacking just doesn’t seem to make sense at the moment. I really don’t want to disturb this feeling, so I’ll just carry on being vanilla, not trying to lose more.

* though of course if I think of three big bags of sugar/flour, it IS a lot.

I’ve been running a couple of times this week - I tried a new policy, of running for 2 mins then doing a recovery walk for as long as I needed, and repeating this till I had done 10 lots of 2 minute runs. It was really fun, still quite challenging for me, but I found as I warmed up, I needed much less recovery time. The whole thing took about 45 minutes, which felt like a decent workout. I liked that I felt in control, not subject to someone else’s idea of what constitutes a challenge. The shorter spells of running meant I had the energy to focus on good technique, not just flogging myself to keep putting one foot in front of the other any old how. Of course there’s part of me that thinks I should be able to run for 45’ without stopping, like ‘what’s the big deal’, but I’m trying to mute that mocking voice. In fact, running for me has been a great lesson in thought-management! I feel this time round I’m much more canny at recognising the powerfully self-destructive quality of those thoughts. And I truly believe that rather than trying to improve my performance, the only improvement I need is to get out the door, keep believing in myself.

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:22 pm

Nice job on finding an exercise workout that you felt empowered by! You the boss!
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by lpearlmom » Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:06 am

I’m so psyched you enjoyed running today! That’s exactly how I started out. The program I did was a six week thing that started out with 5 min walking and 1 min running. Each week it’d add more running on till we did a full 30 mins of running. I love Tommy Rivers the trainer for the iFit program. His motto is No Pain, No Pain. In other words start out very slowly and add in as you get stronger. This prevents injury and burnout. He also says that if you’re not enjoying running it’s because you’re pushing yourself too hard. Now I give myself permission to run very slowly and it is actually enjoyable! Anyway, I’m glad you had a good workout.
:twisted: SW: 210 lbs
CW: 172
GW:160

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Ellis » Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:29 pm

Good job with the running and for doing the recovery walks! :D
SW: 65.8 kg CW: 62.8 kg - GW: 59.9 kg

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Jen1974 » Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:42 pm

I love the idea of the run/recovery walk!! Sounds like you’re doing great with things :D

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by pinkhippie » Tue Oct 06, 2020 11:35 pm

I like your running plan!

Every time I start running I ALWAYS go too fast too far and burn myself out. Sounds like you have a great way to improve, get stronger, enjoy what you are doing, and not burn out. That is awesome!

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Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:50 am

Thanks so much, Jen, Ellis, Auto and Pink! I must look up Tommy Rivers and No Pain, No Pain! I really do think running should be enjoyable - I want my body to feel like it is achieving some sort of mastery, not struggling and failing. I did do C25K around 3 years ago, but I think I was really forcing myself to do it, and when I got to the end I just crashed. I got a bad cold, and when I tried to pick it up again, I had regressed right back. It’s as if I had ‘crammed’ for an exam and hadn’t really internalised anything. I kept trying to get back, and trying different interventions, such as breaking after a ‘mere’ 10 minutes...but it wasn’t till I accepted that I had to set the bar WAY lower that I was able to get back into running. Sounds like you can relate to this, Pink. :) The thing of doing tiny runs and small (but unmeasured) breaks is really working for me.

The other day on my run, these two jolly women cycled past me and one of them shouted YOU GO, GIRL!!! This put me into a FOUL mood! I would never shout anything at a jogger! I’d rather be abused by a white van man commenting on the size of my posterior, than be ‘helped’ along by these cheery fellow-oldies. It seemed so patronising - I wasn’t even struggling or going uphill, just jogging along thinking I probably looked quite cool and in command. Ha! Their comment made me feel I looked like a struggling, plucky ‘trier’. Or maybe I just looked noticeably older or fatter than the average jogger? :evil: I must certainly have looked sad and in need of encouragement. DH could not understand why I was so crushed by this innocent, ‘sisterly’ comment.

Yesterday I had a classic fail. I got into a very bad mood (sensitive, moi? :lol: :lol: ) after a work Zoom meeting with a kindly but slightly belittling manager. I’ve cricked my neck and was also feeling down about the many things I haven’t achieved in my life. I was in the supermarket and started thinking that some sweet comfort food would help neutralise that inner bitterness. Well I quickly dismissed these thoughts, reminding myself that such behaviour would be pointless, and went off home with my healthy/neutral shopping. But the feeling returned! Maybe I’d used up my last bit of willpower in the supermarket. So I ate some of DH’s chocolate I found in the fridge, and later a small pack of crisps. Not loads, but a fail. I think I’d also been affected by the fact that my weight has just been creeping up this last month, and I feel really fed up about it. I’ve had 5 red days in the last 3+ months. It’s hard to keep pressing on without gaining results, but as I keep remembering, there are other things at stake here. Linda, I know you were saying how gaining one’s perfect weight doesn’t necessarily bring happiness. I’m wondering about stopping weighing myself, with that in mind. Perhaps stopping weighing is only a slippery slope if it coincides with a loss of eating control? If I stopped weighing myself it might help reinforce the idea that I’m looking for other benefits here - ie. sanity, enjoyment of meals etc..Yes, I will think about this.

automatedeating
Posts: 5305
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2013 2:16 pm

Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by automatedeating » Fri Oct 09, 2020 2:41 pm

Octavia, I'm so sorry that you've been feeling down. The emotional waves can be amazingly rough sometimes, and seemingly come out of things that we are surprised affected us so greatly.

I hope you start to feel better today. It is such a lovely feeling when we realize - "hey! I'm happy again!"
Month/Year-BMI
8/13-26.3
8/14-24.5
5/15-26.2
1/16-26.9; 9/16-25.6
8/17-25.8; 11/17-26.9
3/18-25.6; 8/18-24.5; 10/18-23.8;
3/19-22.1; 10/19-21.8
6/20-22.5; 7/20-23.0; 9/20-23.6
4/21 - 25.2

Jen1974
Posts: 648
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2016 6:49 pm
Location: Colorado

Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Jen1974 » Fri Oct 09, 2020 4:45 pm

I quit weighing myself 3 years ago & it was SO GOOD for me!! I had been taking great care of myself & felt “thin” but the scale showed a gain. I doubt it was a real gain but it totally demotivated me. I realized that it was doing more harm than good. I can tell when what I’m doing will lead to an overall loss & what I am doing will lead to an overall gain!! A low number on the scale can make me feel like I deserve a “reward”, a high number on the scale can make me want to thrown in the towel, it just never really brought good in my life. The few days where the scale showed a weight loss that felt good didn’t make up for the days where the scale showed a gain EVEN THOUGH I HAD BEEN “GOOD” where I felt terrible!! It didn't change at all how I took care of myself, if anything it felt better to take good care of myself & just be proud of that without having a scale tell me “it wasn’t good enough”.

User avatar
Octavia
Posts: 901
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2015 8:01 pm
Location: UK

Re: Octavia is finally checking in!

Post by Octavia » Fri Oct 09, 2020 5:44 pm

Great points, Jen. I think I’m going to follow your example!

Auto, thanks for your sweet sympathy! X

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