Spook's check in

Counting carbs/calories is a drag. Obsessive scale stepping is a recipe for despair. If you want to count something, "days on habit" is a much better metric. Checking off days on a calendar would do just fine, but if you do it here you get accountability and support. Here's how. Start a new topic in this forum called (say) "Your Name Daily Check In." Then every N day post a "reply" to that topic as to whether you stayed on habit. A simple "<font color="green">SUCCESS</font>" or "<font color="red">FAILURE</font>" (or your preferred euphemism if that's too harsh) is sufficient, but obviously you're welcome to write more if you want. On S-days just register that you're taking an S-day. You don't have to do this forever, just until you're confident you've built the habit. Feel free to check in weekly or monthly or sporadically instead of daily. Feel free also to track other habits besides No-s (I'm keeping this forum under No-s because that's what the vast majority are using it for). See also my <a href="/habitcal/">HabitCal</a> tool for another more formal (and perhaps complementary) way to track habits.

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Spook
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Spook's check in

Post by Spook » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:40 am

Hello all, it's my second (or is it third?) attempt at getting into some sensible eating habits.

I'm not going to check in here daily at the moment, but I might post an update every week or so.

No S went very well for me for a few months in 2008, but I lost the habit as my life got stressful in the second half of the year. However, I did manage to get into some better exercise habits which I've managed to stick with.

Anyway, as it's a new year, it seemed like as good a time as any to get back on the NoS wagon.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Tue Jan 06, 2009 12:05 pm

Hooray, one day successfully done!

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Jan 07, 2009 12:01 pm

Wasn't going to post every day, but it's quite therapeutic. Day 2 = SUCCESS.

It's going pretty well so far. I'm MUCH more relaxed about it this time (this is my second serious attempt at No-S).

I'm also allowing myself a late-night piece of fruit and milky drink (see my comments in the 'No S mods' thread about my 'FAT' - Fruit Any Time mod). This is making the 9pm-bedtime period much more bearable. So far I've done this every day, but I think I'll gradually drop it as time goes by.

I'm also back on my cycling to work regime now for two days so far, hooray!

I keep telling myself I'm not doing this to lose weight - I'm doing it to change my eating habits. If I get it right, losing weight will inevitably follow, but I'm not focusing on that. I'm not bothering to weigh myself.

I'm also thinking of getting myself a copy of the No S book for some inspiration.

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Welcome back!

Post by la_loser » Wed Jan 07, 2009 2:00 pm

Hi Spook,

You definitely should get the book. It fleshes out and clarifies a lot of the details/suggestions although the three rules stay the same. But it's a nice tangible thing to keep around to check out when you have the urge -- plus it's "there" for you to see all the time.

Besides, I think purchasing it is a nice way to "thank" Reinhard for this "thing" we're doing!
LA Loser. . . well on my way to becoming an LA Winner. :lol:

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Jan 07, 2009 2:59 pm

I will probably order the book later. Don't seem to be able to purchase it in the UK any more - will have to buy used from Amazon or get the ebook.

Also, I'm using the Habitcal again.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Thu Jan 08, 2009 11:45 pm

4 days green so far. One more to go, then it's the weekend. I'm looking forward to the weekend, there's still lots of christmas cake left!

Weighed myself yesterday against my better judgement and got a bit of a shock - 207 lbs, the most I've ever weighed. Admittedly it was after dinner and I was fully dressed, so it's probably a little high, but now I'm even more motivated to stick with the plan - if I put on much more weight I'll be officially in the 'obese' category. My target is to lose 10% (ie 21 lbs) within the next 6 months.

I'm taking things much more slowly this time - although I have also started cycling to work again this week, that's not related to my NoSing, just a coincidence of timing. I really want to be sensible and not try to change more than one habit at a time, so I'm not trying to do what I did last time and try and get into three new habits at once.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:57 am

One week, all green. Feeling pretty good right now.

I didn't go too crazy at the weekend, either - finished off some of the christmas chocolate & cake, but not ridiculously excessive.

However, I seem to remember from last time around that it started easy and got harder in weeks 2 & 3, so it's time to get focused now!

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Jan 14, 2009 5:08 pm

Still doing OK - no slip ups yet.

This evening is going to be tough as I'm going to a meeting and there will probably be biscuits or cakes afterwards, probably about 9.30pm which is the time I always feel really hungry. My plan is to make my excuses and leave early. We'll see how that goes...

Spook
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Post by Spook » Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:56 pm

Got through wednesday evening fine. Thursday a little ropey as it was a stressful day, but did OK.

I'm currently allowing myself to have a piece of fruit as a snack, pretty much on an 'as needed' basis, although in practice I only do this at 9/10pm ish. This exception to the rules allows me to stay sane in the last couple of hours before bedtime, which is when I would traditionally have gone crazy eating sweets, snacks, etc. I also have a drink of cocoa at around this time.

I should probably cut out the cocoa drink in the long run, but I'm focusing on making small, sensible changes at the moment.

Next monday will be an S-day as I have a job interview around lunch time, so the whole day's eating will be a bit unusual. Thought it was important to focus on getting the job anyway.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Tue Jan 20, 2009 2:21 pm

Didn't get the job, unfortunately. Feeling a bit down today, and I really feel like snacking.

However, I've done 15 days now and I'm not about to start again from 0. I will make it to dinner time!

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:12 am

Yesterday was pretty good in the end, after I got past the desire for some comfort eating. For the first time I didn't get too hungry last thing at night - I think my body's getting used to not being fed at 9pm at last.

Still having fairly large portions at mealtimes, but I don't feel guilty about it because, well, it's not against the rules.

On my habitcal today would be day 21, although that's because I retrospectively called 1st-4th Jan 'S days' when I started on the 5th. They would have been S-days, but I wasn't actually doing No S at the time. So day 21 will actually be Jan 25th. Only 3 N-days to go until then.

Once I've done 21 days, I'm going to do another 21, then I'm buying a sledgehammer!

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:34 pm

A few more green days! 23 days on habit so far.

I'm amazed at HOW MUCH EASIER this is second time around. I'm being less legalistic, but I'm also not allowing myself any major leeway (except for my 'FAT' - Fruit Any Time mod - I don't do this a lot, but I do have a small portion of fruit (usually an apple) at around 9pm some days. I'd appreciate some feedback on this from people with more experience/knowledge!)

I keep being tempted to weigh myself. A few days ago I gave in to temptation and got on the scales, only to find that the battery was dead and I didn't have a spare! I still haven't changed the battery, but I'll have to do it soon as my wife uses them from time to time.

I've decided that weighing myself would be a bad idea, because it will inevitably crush my optimism if I haven't lost much/any weight. So I am adding another rule - no weigh-in. If I weigh myself, that counts as a fail.

Kathleen
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Post by Kathleen » Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:25 am

Spook,
Be careful of adding rules that aren't relevant to whether or not you follow the 3S guidelines on N Days.
Kathleen

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Post by Spook » Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:04 pm

Kathleen wrote:Spook,
Be careful of adding rules that aren't relevant to whether or not you follow the 3S guidelines on N Days.
Kathleen
It is very relevant, psychologically. Despondency leads to emotional eating. It's a pretty easy rule to follow, and impossible to fail at 'by accident', so I don't think I'm really risking anything. I will be careful though!

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Post by Kathleen » Thu Jan 29, 2009 11:31 pm

Spook,

I've been around and around on whether to weigh myself or not. I finally decided that the weight is coming off so slowly that it would be better to heed the saying "A watched pot never boils" and only weigh myself once per month. I just started this on Saturday and am happier for it. My concern is that the real core of the diet is following N Day rules, not exercise, not avoiding the scale, etc.

I thought I ate for emotional reasons, but the problem was that I was so happy being a stay at home Mom. Now I think it was just the collapse of restrictive eating as an approach to managing weight. After 20 years, it didn't work anymore.

Kathleen

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Healthy Fear

Post by SavvyV » Fri Jan 30, 2009 5:22 pm

Hi Spook!
This is what has worked for me with the scale. I've determined long ago that the scale is not my friend or enemy. But when I go too long without weighing myself, I set myself up for being total unaccountabe to myself. . .almost to the point where I"M AFRAID to step on the scale.
That's not good. Neither is it healthy.

I now weigh myself every week, whether I want to or not, and I record the pounds to the 10th degree. There is a certain number on the scale, that if I go over, it's my HORROR ZONE. (Kinda catchy, Spook, now itsn't it! :lol: ) Anyway when I allow myself to stay in HORROR ZONE for too long. . .all sorts of bad things begin to be aggravated in my body. Right now, I'm about 5 pounds into my HORROR zone. And all last year, I stayed in the HORROR ZONE, despite my efforts to make the scale move with diet and exercise (and subsequently starting and stopping).

Bottom line is the scale is my non-judgemental guage that keeps me on track. I'm already HORRIFIED and AFRAID of what excessive weight will do to my body therefore it causes me to look for solutions to help myself. I refer to this as a "Healthy fear" because it's moving me in the right direction.

This HEALTHY FEAR has taken the sting out of stepping on the scale.
If hunger is not the problem, then eating is not the solution. ~Author Unknown

You can't lose weight by talking about it. You have to keep your mouth shut. ~Author Unknown

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Post by Spook » Mon Feb 02, 2009 11:51 am

Thanks guys!
I think I may go with the once-a-month weighing after all. The 'healthy fear' is a good way of thinking about it.

Last few days have gone well, and I didn't overdo things at the weekend too much (but I did allow myself a few indulgences).

Still managing to cycle every day, except today (due to snow).

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Feb 04, 2009 10:13 am

Happy to say that I've got through two more GREEN days. Went running on Sunday (for the first time in months) and then found that I could hardly move on Monday!

Add to that the major snowfall that we've had in the UK, work stress and various other stuff (not good) that's going on in my life at the moment, and it was VERY difficult to not give up, but I managed to draw on my reserve willpower and stay on habit.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:20 pm

Just weighed - down to 201. (At the end of a somewhat excessive S day). Not bad - 7 lbs down. I'm happy enough with that!

Spook
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Post by Spook » Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:16 pm

Still keeping on, and it's getting (slightly) easier. I find that as long as I'm busy (which I am at the moment, very) I don't feel like eating at work. The hardest time is still late evenings, but I'm coping with those.

I'm still not really doing much to reduce plate sizes, but that will come later.

Not had much exercise lately, for various reasons - bike trouble, bad weather and hospital appointments - I haven't been able to cycle to work for a while. Planning to start again the week after next.

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Post by Spook » Tue Feb 17, 2009 10:19 am

Monday was my first failure day. Visited an elderly relative, couldn't say no to cake (and it was very nice).

Never mind!

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Post by Spook » Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:08 am

Oh dear... last week was the week of FAIL. Some days were only slightly bad, some were very very bad.

In my defense, it's been quite a sad & busy week.

Tuesday was probably the worst, as it was pancake day I declared an S-day - which in retrospect was probably wrong in itself - and it turned out to be a really over the top S-day. 'Emotional eating' kicked in a bit.

On the plus side, I'm back on the bike again after two weeks of no cycling, due to it needing some repairs.

I'm really hoping this week will be better. I'm looking for 4 greens here! (Thursday will be an S-day as I have to get up at 5am and travel to the other end of the country for a funeral, so I don't think I'm going to get the opportunity to have sensible meals very easily.)

Spook
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Post by Spook » Thu Mar 12, 2009 10:48 am

Not doing well at the moment. No green days for a week. I'm forcing myself to keep up the habitcal in the hope that the guilt effect will kick in and I'll get back on track.

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Post by TexArk » Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:50 pm

I am sorry you are having some tough times. For those of us who have a lifetime habit of turning to food for comfort, NoS really can be a great help, though. If I were on a "real diet" I would not have the emotional energy to "work it" and every time a crisis or rough spot came up, I used to be derailed for a long time; but with NoS all I have to do is just eat my next meal and wait. I think it is great that you are continuing to do your HabitCal, not because you want to induce guilt, but just to show yourself that you really could get a green day in more often than you are.

One meal at a time. One day at a time. No guilt.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Mon Mar 16, 2009 12:45 pm

Thanks texark, that helped. I've realised now that failure will keep coming. Sometimes I just won't have the strength to get through the day on No S. Sometimes this might even go on for a couple of weeks. If I can just keep the No S habit at the back of my mind (which is what the habitcal is great for) then I can hopefully just pick up the good habits again at the end of the tough times.

I realised this morning just how strong the 'emotional eating' urge is.

I had a decent, healthy breakfast and then cycled to work and got changed. I then had to walk past a sweet shop on the way to my office. This has not been a problem at all during the first 6 weeks of NoS, but in these last couple of weeks I have given in to temptation and had a chocolate bar on more than one occasion (hence the amount of red on my habitcal right now). I'd told myself that this was excusable because I've had a tough time recently for various reasons.

Today I was feeling a bit stronger - new week, let's get back on track, etc - so I put up a bit of resistance, and told myself that I was going to get back on track with No S today.

Well, my inner fat person didn't like this one bit, and we ended up having quite an argument about it. :D

He tried to convince me that I needed to look after myself, cheer myself up. Reminded me of all the things I've been dealing with (thanks for that), told me that I wasn't ready yet to get back on track with No S, etc. He pretty much managed to convince me that there was NO way I could get through the morning until lunchtime without a bit of extra sugar, 'to keep me going'. This seemed like a pretty compelling argument at the time because I was tired & thirsty from cycling and probably not thinking very logically.

So I thought about the very specific image of filling in my habitcal with another RED blob. Then I just kept walking past the shop and got out of the way of temptation as quickly as possible.

Two cups of tea and lots of work later, and I've made it to lunchtime. I've beaten my inner fat person this morning.

The other great thing about the habitcal is that I can look BACK at nearly two months of solid green and remind myself that this diet is VERY do-able. I had no trouble keeping to it for all that time, so I CAN get to lunchtime without eating. Take that, inner fat person!

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Post by Kathleen » Mon Mar 16, 2009 12:54 pm

Spook,
Consider the possibility that the kind gesture of having cake with an elderly level triggered the "I blew my diet" mentality. This isn't emotional eating. It's the sign of someone who prioritizes other people's feelings over a single minded focus on diet. Good for you. What you need to manage is your response to those inevitable situations which aren't classified as "Special Days" but where it is more than appropriate to eat outside the N Day guidelines of no snacks, no sweets and no seconds.

You could have come on the board to say how you visited an elderly relative and turned down the cake she baked special for your visit. Had I read that, there would have been an internal moment of revulsion.
Kathleen

Spook
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Post by Spook » Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:01 am

I've certainly thought about that, although I'm pretty sure it wasn't the main factor in causing me to go off the rails a bit. (Actually the main trigger was the sudden death of a family member the following weekend).

OK, so it was my first 'failure day' of the year, but it didn't really derail me. The rest of the week was green, and I don't recall it being a struggle.

The thing is, I'm really trying not to consider 'failure' as a negative thing, and I think it's working. (I just have to look over my habitcal for last year to see 'real failure' - the months and months of empty space where I wasn't even thinking about what I was eating. My 2009 calendar is a picture of success. Yes, there's a big red area there now, but at least it's being filled in. At least now I'm in control.)

Oh, and thankfully the next time we visit her will be this Saturday - so I can enjoy guilt-free cake!

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Post by TexArk » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:25 am

I just wanted to make a response to the question you have been struggling with, "To weigh or not to weigh?"

I really think this is an issue that each person has to work out for herself. And, what is true for you at one time in your journey may not be true later. I have in the past been so addicted to the scale while I was on a diet that I would weigh myself several times a day and even in the middle of the night! After losing weight I would weigh daily in an attempt to keep myself honest. Now after finding NoS (and I would like to remove 20 pounds) I use the following criteria:

1. Is weighing in going to change my behavior in a negative way?
This can happen with a gain or a loss.

2. Is stepping on the scale going to change my emotional state of being?
My happiness quotient for the day should not depend on the number on the scale!

For the first two months of NoS I did not weigh because I felt like the answer to both of those questions was, "Yes." If I had gained I would have been upset with myself and the plan and would probably have tried to add some restrictions onto the program. If I had lost I would probably have fudged some and not followed the plan exactly. My emotions can defnitely be affected by the number on the scale.

Now I have been weighing daily for a week or so just out of curiosity. I have confirmed my suspicions about the loss during the week and then the subsequent gain over the S days, and then the loss again on the N days. I have had 2 1/2 months of good N days and my S days are beginning to calm down. I have lost two pounds, but the success is that I am not restricting or bingeing, and I am learning really good habits. I will not weigh any more until the first of the month. I know eating my 3 meals a day without the snacking, seconds, and sweets is exactly what I need to be "measuring" and not my weight. I am confident that the loss will come. If I were not doing NoS, yes I would need to be weighing daily so I could tell if I needed to be more restrictive, but I am already doing what I need to be doing. Someone else has also mentioned using the Pant O Meter. If we are not wearing elastic waistbands, we can tell when loss is occurring.

But for now, what is more important, is that my whole body image has changed. The number on the scale always made me feel fat and disgusted with myself. However, it really was the out of control eating habits that were the problem. Now I actually do not feel overweight. I think the "positive body image" has more to do with my normalized behavior than the number on the scale.

So my advice would be to go ahead and weigh if it makes you feel good. But if it makes you feel bad, just keep your HabitCal and forget the scale for awhile. Getting those good N days stacked up is the first measurement of SUCCESS.

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Post by blue » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:47 am

TexArk , interesting post I like your questions before stepping on a scale

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:20 pm

Great post, very helpful!
TexArk wrote:But for now, what is more important, is that my whole body image has changed. The number on the scale always made me feel fat and disgusted with myself. However, it really was the out of control eating habits that were the problem. Now I actually do not feel overweight. I think the "positive body image" has more to do with my normalized behavior than the number on the scale.
That's kind of how I'm feeling at the moment. I don't think I could see any figure on the scale that would shock me any more (well I probably could but let's not go there). But I don't feel like I'm an overweight person in myself any more (even though the scales would still say otherwise).

I think the fact that I'm now getting regular exercise (cycling) is also helping with this feeling.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:27 pm

Tuesday was another GREEN!

Today is RED unfortunately - I had to take my daughter to a doctors' appointment this morning and this made me arrive late for a meeting at work at which we have a buffet lunch.

Because I was late, the only things left were the really horrible sandwiches that nobody else wanted, and a couple of cakes. Unfortunately I was too hungry and flustered to think 'No Sweets' until I was already eating one.

I think two weeks off-habit has made me careless. I would never go out of my way to eat sweets but when one appeared in front of me I completely forgot!

Oh well. I'm going to use this as an opportunity to try and see if I can get through the second half of a FAIL day without treating it like an S-day. My motivation for doing this will be the good feeling I will get when I post tomorrow that I managed to stay on the habit for the rest of today!

guadopt1997
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Spook's check in

Post by guadopt1997 » Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:32 pm

I read this on one of the bulletins and thought it might help you today:

"If I back into a pole, I'm not gonna say,'Oh well, the car is wrecked' and drive into a brick wall!"

This is where I've always had problems in diets. The idea that "oh well, I'm already in the red so I may as well go whole hog."
Liz
Weight goal: less than I weigh now
Basic goal: doing no-S for life

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Post by Spook » Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:46 pm

Well I didn't go too crazy on Wed, although it wasn't perfect. Thursday was a fail too, for reasons I can't remember now. Friday was good though, and the weekend was pretty sane.

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Post by VintageGeek » Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:39 pm

Sane weekends are great. It's good that you're being so honest about your failures, not just for the "guilt" factor, but because it's only when you can be truly honest with yourself that any kind of real progress will be made.

I have to weigh in (sorry) on this weighing topic as well, although my advice is pretty harsh. Throw the damn thing away.

I have never owned a scale, mostly because I've never thought to buy one. And now, with all of this new research telling us that muscle weighs more than fat, and that it's not just your weight but your "other numbers" like blood pressure and cholesterol and measurements that are really important, I think the scale is growing completely and totally obsolete. Also, to allow numbers to rule your life is to deny yourself any real pleasure in eating, exercising, or even just being.

I say judge your progress by your happiness, and your energy, and the way your clothes fit, and the distance you can walk without growing tired, and anything at all other than the number that shows up when you step on the scale. In being completely truthful, the scale will lie to you. The scale will display every bloat, every heavy meal, every extra layer of clothes and will convince you that you are somehow failing. It's treacherous, and dangerous, and wrong.

I'm sorry to barge into this thread and post all that, but I felt compelled to stick my nose into it.

You're doing great, Spook, and you should feel proud of yourself for even being aware of what you're doing with your body. Most people treat their bodies like garbage receptacles. You're treating your body with respect, and that's always a good thing.
8-bit is still awesome.

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Post by Spook » Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:02 pm

Thanks for posting VintageGeek. I decided that the main reason I strayed from NoS for so long was because I stopped posting here and updating my calendar, so the guilt factor went away. For this reason, I resolved to update my calendar every day for a year, even if I can't keep the diet habit going for some reason.

Re the scales - no chance of throwing them away because my wife and daughter both use them! (Well, my daughter doesn't really understand what they're for but she loves the blinky lights!)

I haven't weighed myself for ages now anyway. I don't feel particularly ruled by the scales. But I still think they are a helpful indicator of LONG-TERM progress.

My real progress metrics are:
  1. Habitcal (two more greens this week, hooray)
  2. Belt tightness (I bought a belt too small for me by mistake so this is acutely noticeable. If I get any fatter I will have to throw it out - that's a pretty powerful progress reminder)
  3. How long it takes me to cycle to/from work (I think I'm getting there a bit quicker and arriving less tired these days).

Spook
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Post by Spook » Fri Mar 27, 2009 2:30 pm

Ok, I did actually weigh myself again today. As I said, It's not my main measure of progress - that would be unwise. But I'm now 199 lbs, 2 lbs lower than 6 weeks ago, which is encouraging, especially considering nearly half of the days since I last weighed have been 'fails'.

Psychologically, it's really nice to be below the 200 mark. I plan never to go above it again!

Even if I carry on at this slow rate, I would lose my target of 10% of my weight within about a year. So I will finally be comfortable with my weight in 2010. I'm hoping to get there a bit sooner though.

This week has gone well - 5 green days (as long as I don't slip up today). Feeling unwell yesterday & today with a cold, but not really bad enough to call a sick day. However I seem to need more food when I have a cold, so I have made use of my 'fruit any time' exception a few times.

Kathleen
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Post by Kathleen » Fri Mar 27, 2009 3:28 pm

Spook,
I'm about where you are. It looks like I will have dropped 10% of my body weight in a year -- from 215 in September to about 200 now to below 193.5 by September. I dropped below 200 in late February for the first time, but I've been above and below 200 since then. There will come a day when I will no longer be above 200, but that day has not yet come. I was at 200.4 this morning. It can be frustrating, which is why it's nice to look at the overall trend and see that 10% of my body weight lost in one year is very likely to happen!
Kathleen

Spook
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Post by Spook » Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:40 pm

Been ill with a virus over the weekend, still recovering today - so it's been S-days all the way. Hoping to get back to normal tomorrow.

Spook
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Post by Spook » Fri Apr 24, 2009 9:08 am

Yuck. April is a write off. I haven't been sticking to No S at all this month :(

On the positive side, I don't think I've been eating quite as badly as I once did, and I have been getting plenty of exercise.

Still sticking with it though. Going for green today.

Spook
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:49 pm

Post by Spook » Tue May 19, 2009 2:25 pm

I'm still here... :?

But failing at No S :(

Kathleen
Posts: 1685
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: Minnesota

Post by Kathleen » Tue May 19, 2009 2:26 pm

How about going for green on no sweets?

Spook
Posts: 142
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 2:49 pm

Post by Spook » Tue May 19, 2009 2:28 pm

Kathleen wrote:How about going for green on no sweets?
Good idea, I'll try that!

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