Everyday Systems

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:11 am**

I've been considering No S since the beginning of April, and each time I think about it I like the idea more and more. It's just enough structure for someone as rigid and black-and-white as I, and I think it will work out splendidly!

A little background on my dieting history: from November of 2011 to July of 2012 I was on a very strict diet and managed to lose about fifty pounds. April is when I started to think about getting back into a "normal" lifestyle, and thus that is when I stumbled across No S.

I finally allowed myself to start eating sweets again in early July, and immediately I developed what is, in my opinion, binge eating disorder. It's gotten to a ridiculous point now, where it's happening every day, always after dinner, and always on sweets. Any advice to counter this while diving into No S? What do I do if I have the urge to eat something sweet on a No S day? (I know for a fact that I was able to lose so much weight due to the fact that I did not allow myself to have a single sweet for eight months; I'm addicted to sugar even though I don't even truly like the taste of it, it's pathetic)

Well, here I go on a leap of faith! (October 24: Day 1 of No S!)

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:51 am**

Welcome to NoS! The great thing about it is that it teaches you a normal way of eating that doesn't exclude any particular food but limits the window of eating them.

I suggest a big pot of herbal tea. Mint tea really works for me and there's a yogi chocolate teat that I drink with milk but unsweetened when I really need a chocolate fix. It's not sweet as there's no added sugar but still smells like chocolate.

I'm still bingeing on some weekends but it's definitely getting better and better so you'll need some patience with yourself on S days. On N days, it's a clear rule just not to eat sweets. If you managed to stay off sweets completely for a year I have faith that after a little struggling you'll be fine with NoS.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 1:24 pm**

BritishFool wrote: It's just enough structure for someone as rigid and black-and-white as I, and I think it will work out splendidly!

You just made me realize something: No-S is too structured or rigid for me. I followed it (as I thought it was written) for about a year, but then had to make modifications so it better suited me.

I'd never thought about that until I read what you wrote.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 1:52 pm**

wosnes wrote:
BritishFool wrote: It's just enough structure for someone as rigid and black-and-white as I, and I think it will work out splendidly!
You just made me realize something: No-S is too structured or rigid for me. I followed it
(as I thought it was written) for about a year,
but then had to make modifications so it better suited me.

I'd never thought about that until I read what you wrote.

wosnes, Great Insight !
No S is a great basic plan, that allows for many personal modifications.

Many people doing "vanilla" No S don't even realize that they are making personal modifications.
Actually....Even adding personal rules such as:....
........
eating mostly unprocessed foods, or
dividing the contents of one's plate in certain micronutrient percentages, or
eating on a smaller plate, or
even avoiding fried foods etc.
.......
.... is actually modifying the basic plan...

Adding calorie counting or low-carb eating to the basic No S plan
is really only modifying it to a different degree,
the difficulty and effectiveness of which, also varies from person to person .

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:18 pm**

BrightAngel wrote:
wosnes wrote:
BritishFool wrote: It's just enough structure for someone as rigid and black-and-white as I, and I think it will work out splendidly!
You just made me realize something: No-S is too structured or rigid for me. I followed it
(as I thought it was written) for about a year,
but then had to make modifications so it better suited me.

I'd never thought about that until I read what you wrote.
wosnes, Great Insight !
No S is a great basic plan, that allows for many personal modifications.

Many people doing "vanilla" No S don't even realize that they are making personal modifications.
Actually....Even adding personal rules such as:....
........
eating mostly unprocessed foods, or
dividing the contents of one's plate in certain micronutrient percentages, or
eating on a smaller plate, or
even avoiding fried foods etc.
.......
.... is actually modifying the basic plan...

Adding calorie counting or low-carb eating to the basic No S plan
is really only modifying it to a different degree,
the difficulty and effectiveness of which, also varies from person to person .

The funny thing is that what I eat and my basic meal structure has changed very little. I was already avoiding processed foods (for health reasons) and had a basic meal plan that worked well for me.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:03 pm**

If tempted by a perishable sweet, stick it in a container, label it with your name and a threat (ha...I have 4 kids)and pop it in the freezer for an S day. Then you know it will be fresher and saved for you. The freezer is my close friend.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:34 pm**

Don't be too quick to label yourself with 'binge eating disorder' or 'addicted to sugar' - those seem pretty harsh labels for someone who didn't eat sweets at all for months on end and is now trying to work out a healthy way of introducing them back in! It also might make it seem harder to change. It might be tough, but not impossible

I think people are too quick to label eating more than the regular amount a 'binge'. I don't know what the technical definition is, or even if there is one, but my advice is always to be kind to yourself and accept that you will make mistakes and you might not do everything perfect first time, but it's a work in progress!

You know what your trigger time is - after dinner on weekdays so I think it's about planning! You could try a few things:

- have a plan of things to do to keep busy at those time.
- brush your teeth after dinner
- go out for a walk if you start getting a craving
- Don't buy sweets that will be in the house on weekdays.
- Have a 'back up plan' of something to drink (a glass of milk, cup of tea or coffee for example, or even a fruit juice) when you start to crave a sweet.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:42 pm**

Well, I just had eight or nine cookies, and now I feel like a total failure. ):

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:48 pm**

BritishFool wrote:Well, I just had eight or nine cookies, and now I feel like a total failure. ):

Mark it and move on.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:06 pm**

I guess I could describe my totally irrational rationalization for it...

I made about three dozen cookies last night and they've been sitting untouched in my kitchen all day. I came home from school today after only about half an hour because I am unbelievably sick (my dad thinks I have mono). I was making some coffee at the time and my thought process was too quick to even grasp, but it went something like "I'm sick, and this will make me happy," and before I knew it a whole bunch of cookies were in my belly and there my coffee was on the counter, untouched.

What are some techniques you guys used toward the beginning of your No S journies to take the sweet beast and stick to your No S guns? I could really really use a hand. The scale just climbs and climbs...

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:39 pm**

BritishFool wrote:I guess I could describe my totally irrational rationalization for it...

I made about three dozen cookies last night and they've been sitting untouched in my kitchen all day. I came home from school today after only about half an hour because I am unbelievably sick (my dad thinks I have mono). I was making some coffee at the time and my thought process was too quick to even grasp, but it went something like "I'm sick, and this will make me happy," and before I knew it a whole bunch of cookies were in my belly and there my coffee was on the counter, untouched.

What are some techniques you guys used toward the beginning of your No S journies to take the sweet beast and stick to your No S guns? I could really really use a hand. The scale just climbs and climbs...

Well, sick days are S days. When I'm sick, I crave both salty and sweet things.

I think it takes time and patience to get the habits under your belt.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:49 pm**

All I can say is, I understand, as I'm going through the same thing right now. I can't stop binging and unfortunately don't have any advice at the moment. My only thoughts and what I do when I fall into binging again, is to keep trying your hardest every day. At least then some days are a success. Good luck to you. Let us know how it goes.

Posted: **Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:55 pm**

Thank you. You too. It's good to know we're not alone.

Posted: **Thu Oct 25, 2012 5:35 pm**

I posted a few suggestions of things to try already - the main thing is just to note the failure and move on to the next meal or day. One failure one day does not mean you have to abandon everything. There's no point pitching for perfect compliance straight away, it'll take time to get these new habits down!

Also, remember how much better you are eating by following NoS on even some days, or some meals! If you are successful even 25% of the time, that's 25% of the time you are eating better than you were - that's something to be proud of and build on.

Good luck and keep at it

Posted: **Thu Oct 25, 2012 6:33 pm**

If you are sick, self control is harder too. It takes energy to use will power. I'm battling a chronic infection and suddenly No S is hard again.

Posted: **Fri Oct 26, 2012 1:38 am**

You are certainly not alone. I am also starting No S after a strict diet followed by a period of overeating.
I'm only a couple of weeks in but, so far, what has helped me is; being very strict about the rules, using Habitcal, and making my meals satisfying and balanced, or better yet, 'sumptuous' as oolala53 advised me in another post. Also relaxing about S days and letting them be a time to eat freely.
For the particular time after dinner on N days, I basically do what milliem suggested, floss and brush my teeth then have a cup of peppermint tea or go for a walk.

And sick days are S days so mark it yellow and move on.

Posted: **Fri Oct 26, 2012 1:43 am**

Sounds great. (: I agree, I think the strictness will really help me. It's what helped me lose all the weight in the first place, after all. And, I would imagine, each day of strictness gets easier and easier as you go...

Today was much better. I had a handful of M&Ms, but I'm still sick so I guess it's okay. Progress, not perfection, is what matters at this point, right?

Posted: **Fri Oct 26, 2012 11:57 pm**

BritishFool wrote:I made about three dozen cookies last night and they've been sitting untouched in my kitchen all day.

Is there a reason you needed to bake so many cookies mid-week and keep them in your house?

What are some techniques you guys used toward the beginning of your No S journies to take the sweet beast and stick to your No S guns? I could really really use a hand. The scale just climbs and climbs...

In the early weeks, I never had snack or sweet foods in the house. It takes a lot of willpower to resist dozens of freshly baked cookies sitting in the kitchen. It is a lot easier to resist hypothetical cookies that would require me to go to the store, come home and bake. So, I would suggest making things easier if you can by getting trigger foods out of your environment and leaving baking for S days.

Hang in there - it does get much better. I now have two open packets of sweets in my cupboard, I opened them last Sunday and they've been there all week waiting for Saturday. I could never have done that in my first month.

Posted: **Sat Oct 27, 2012 1:49 am**

Thank you. (: Must keep pushing forward!

Today was a success! Woo hoo! ^.^

Posted: **Sat Oct 27, 2012 3:39 am**

Nevermind. ): I was in bed tossing and turning for an hour and a half and I decided to come downstairs for some water and ended up eating a whole bunch...

Sigh...

Posted: **Sat Oct 27, 2012 8:16 am**

BritishFool wrote:Nevermind. ): I was in bed tossing and turning for an hour and a half and I decided to come downstairs for some water and ended up eating a whole bunch...

Sigh...

You have a choice. Every time you're about to eat something that you "shouldn't" ask yourself if you really want to eat it. If the answer is yes, then indulge and accept responsibility. If the answer is no, then move on.

To avoid temptation, keep a glass of water at your bedside.

Posted: **Sat Oct 27, 2012 12:39 pm**

Good way to look it, I'll keep that in mind. I think I've been eating in excess lately because of stress... I've never been so stressed out in my life, and I guess I'm not sure how to cope.

Posted: **Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:59 am**

It sounds like you are where I was a few months ago. A website that helped me understand and get past it (in addition to this one) was First Ourselves http://www.firstourselves.org/ It is all about nurturing yourself to heal overeating.

Posted: **Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:12 am**

Thank you very much emmay! I will certainly use this site. (:

As for now, this binging thing is getting really out of hand. I binged every day but one in the past week, and since last Sunday I've gained eight pounds... Tips to get a really killer jump start?

I reallllllllly need it. I'm eating the me way I ate before I lost a whole bunch of weight, only now I just can't seem to stop. )':

Posted: **Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:34 pm**

You are binging because youR brain is freaking out after the strict diet and thinks you are heading into a famine, and it has got into the habit of driving you to over eat. Try this when you get an urge to binge, send your primal brain some love but ignore its desires, after all it believes it is helping you, but it has got confused, you must choose to ignore it. Don't argue with it just observe what it says, everytime you don't give into the desire to binge the cravings will lesson, plus as you are eating plenty your body will realise there is no famine ahead and your metabolism will increase. Good luck:)

Posted: **Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:18 pm**

I agree that bingeing happens as a reaction to restricting food as well as a response to stress and anxiety. I think the answers are to establish an eating structure without restricting and to sooth your stress and anxiety in ways other than eating.
A way to have structured eating without restriction is to follow No S strictly and, at each meal, ask yourself what you really feel like eating, size the meal according to your appetite at the time, be generous and include foods you really love to eat. Real, satisfying meals, not diet meals. I sometimes get a feeling that I just want to keep eating after a meal. A tea or coffee or glass of water seems to help symbolise an end to a meal. Brushing teeth also helps.
When you feel like bingeing, give yourself a chance to feel your feelings, rest, and find a way to look after yourself without food, take a bath or a walk.

Posted: **Tue Oct 30, 2012 12:09 am**

I am going to disagree about asking yourself if you really want to eat something. That can mean different things to different people. And once you start eating refined foods, your neurochemicals can fool you.

I do agree that you should go ahead and have nice, full meals including portions of things you like, even refined foods- but not sweets on S days. Put the food on a plate and eat it slowly. Then stop. That's it. The way not to binge is to just not do it. Know that whatever urge you have and whatever thought you have that makes it seem like eating is a good idea is to be tolerated, but not acted upon. It's just the old neurochemical pattern being activated. It may be unpleasant to tolerate the desires or to have to make efforts to divert yourself, but it is not harmful and it will make the urges weaker over time.

I also often use having a separate beverage, such as a cup of tea or decaf, after I've finished my meal and cleared my dishes. It feels like putting a period at the end of a sentence. Eating is done and the kitchen is closed for more food. What did you fill your time with when you were "dieting"?

Posted: **Wed Oct 31, 2012 1:30 am**

That's what I've decided to do and I've been trying it since early August... I guess my willpower just isn't enough, eh? ):

Yesterday was great but today ended up being a total failure. I don't even know what happened. I pretty much blacked out, and when I "woke up" I had eaten half the kitchen and then some...

Posted: **Wed Oct 31, 2012 11:53 pm**

BritishFool,

Try not to let one small slip turn into WTH syndrome. If you had a snack, it does not have to turn into binge. I am also addicted to sugar. That's why eating 'just one cookie' is difficult for me. Are sweets triggering your binges? Maybe you can try smaller steps - if you don't eat sweets for a day, consider it a success.

And, maybe you should choose more positive sounding nickname. What we call ourselves and what we tell ourselves makes all the difference.

Posted: **Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:08 am**

Very good point, freegirl. I also struggle with such. The past two days I've done very well, but today I went over to a friend's house and it didn't go so well.

But, on the bright side, it wasn't nearly as bad as my binges have been lately. Today's was around 2500 calories, when more often than not they're around 6000. :X That's so embarrassing to admit! Maybe it'll be enough to convince my subconscious to stop tormenting me with the urge to eat everything...

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 12:25 am**

How are things going?

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 12:32 am**

I was actually just about to post on here! Honestly, not so hot lately.

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 12:46 am**

My first attempt at No S, I had one completely green week just before Thanksgiving of that year (late November in the US) and then fell off the wagon for the next 13 months with just a few green weeks. Dec. 26 was my 3rd anniversary.

I got scared that I would live with food insanity for the rest of my life (I guess they call that hitting bottom) and finally surrendered. When you're convinced that you're in more pain from overeating than not and that there aren't likely better alternatives, it will be easier. Not easy. Easier.

No one knows what it will take to get there. I hope it takes you less time than it did me!

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:23 am**

I got kind of a wake-up call last night. I was on the phone with a really nice guy he just met and he said something along the lines of "fitness is really attractive" and I thought "well I'm quickly losing my fitness and pretty soon I'm not even going to be attractive to you anymore..." And it made me really sad.

He's a great person. I met in him on a private college group I was added to and we've been messaging and texting for about two and a half weeks pretty much nonstop. Last night was the first he called me. I'll probably be meeting him at a thing at our college in April, and I don't want to be a disappointment... :l Perhaps that's a stupid motivation to really get going on is thing... Sigh.

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:18 pm**

You can do it Britishfool! Love is a great motivator! Just stick with regular No S and you will look fit

Posted: **Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:19 pm**

Commit to a minimum of activity and then no matter what, hold your head up high. Many thin people are not fit at all.

A woman on another site I'm on was all worried about seeing people at Christmas time because she has put on about 20 lbs. this year and she is rather erratic with her eating. But she has been consistent with exercise, even going so far as doing either Insanity or P90X and she reported that people kept telling her she looked so fit. She said she definitely isn't as thin as she has been in the past. But fit looks good. And I don't think you have to go to the extremes to look vibrant and happy with yourself.

Posted: **Wed Jan 02, 2013 2:24 am**

Today was a good day. (:

And in terms of the guy, also a good day. We had a little video chat today.

Posted: **Thu Jan 03, 2013 3:34 am**

Another good day! Victory!

Posted: **Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:50 am**

Today was bad. Really bad. It was good, until dinner wasn't enough and I got hungry, and I had an academic thing tonight that had cake. So I had some. Then had more food when I got home because the cake didn't help. And then something happened and I got depressed, so I binged... Ugh.

Posted: **Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:08 pm**

Ah, the very human, very common what-the-hell effect. And the other common habit, self-flagellation. This is different from reasonable guilt that helps you really make changes. Self-beratement is actually part of the overeating cycle, and therefore will reinforce the whole thing. That is why here at No S, the motto "mark it and move on" is embraced. It's okay to look back at our behavior with curiosity and firm kindness so that if there really is something to learn besides "don't do that." But excessive guilt actually undermines our relationship with ourselves so that we are less likely to cooperate in the future. "The floggings will continue until morale improves."

Okay, it wasn't the best day. But it's okay. You can still learn this habit. Just keep going!

Posted: **Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:22 am**

BritishFool, reading your posts, what I've read has shown more successes than failures so, in my opinion, you're doing much better than not trying at all. You also seem to binge when stressed, I do the same thing, so it may be useful to look into stress reduction techniques to help you manage that stress more effectively. Here's a link to a site with a variety of methods to try: http://www.helpguide.org/mental/stress_ ... irect=true. Personally, the better I become at managing stress, the less I binge eat. Good luck!

Posted: **Sat Jan 05, 2013 4:07 pm**

I actually didn't get better at using stress reduction techniques UNTIL I determined that I would not use food no matter what on weekdays. And usually NOTHING reduced the stress or bad situation well enough in the moment anyway. I just had to tolerate the situation/thoughts/ feelings for the few hours until the next meal, usually dinner or breakfast.

I don't mean don't use the techniques suggested. I'm glad I use some of them now, but I couldn't depend on them in the beginning to stop me from binging.

Posted: **Mon Jan 07, 2013 12:20 am**

Britishfool, maybe you should do something to build your self-esteem. I don't know what, but for instance, running in a marathon.

Posted: **Mon Jan 07, 2013 2:59 pm**

That's true, oolala53. It doesn't help a lot in the moment because you aren't thinking clearly at the time. What I noticed, at least with me, is it helps with the accumulation of stress so I'm not as overwhelmed during extremely stressful moments. A bit like pouring water into a cup; if you ignore it until it becomes a problem, it's a mess but if you're mindful you'll be able to stop it before it overflows.

Everyday Systems

Finally committing to start No S!

Finally committing to start No S!

Re: Finally committing to start No S!

Re: Finally committing to start No S!

Re: Finally committing to start No S!