Everyday Systems

Sinnie, it's wonderful to see you here again, and I DO apologise for such a late reply. Ironically, it's not the baby that keeps me up at night but work. I've started working at home to make some extra money and it seems like everyone needs my services now, which I'm generally very proud of... just not today. I'm tired and stressed, and I rarely pop in here. I miss the forums, though!
Sadly, I don't move much besides walking leisurely with the baby or running errands. I've had to say goodbye to structured exercise, party due to the unrelenting heatwave which has been stifling my city for a month (after a couple of vertigo episodes I quit), and partly because I'd rather read a book than do cardio in the evenings when it's cooler. But I miss exercise! I've always called it my superpower. Who knows, maybe I'll add 14 minutes of cardio to my daily routine in the autumn or take longer walks? In the meantime, I'm a hopeless couch potato. Answering your question straight, I eat about 1900 calories a day (never breastfed the baby) and weigh around 127 pounds, which is fine and perfectly acceptable for me. I no longer push myself to stay at 110. I have, however, restarted vanilla NoS, simply because calorie counting suddenly started to feel like another chore, and I tend to drop/delegate as many of those as I can. The work I do at home is mentally taxing and I need lots of free space in my brain right now. One less thing to do/plan into my day is huge! Anyway, I've lost a bit of weight in the recent weeks, but I'd rather wait a bit longer before posting my current stats.

I'm back. Currently at 130 pounds, with my food habits all over the place. While my weight is stable and I'm pretty happy with it, I worry about my dependence on sugar. I eat waaaaay too much of it, and occassionally binge. In my case, dessert today means dessert tomorrow, too... and two the day after. This isn't healthy nor sustainable. Plus, my maternity leave ends soon, and I expect many sweet temptations waiting for me at the office, not to mention the emotional rollercoaster during the transition.

Monday Had to drink chai tea with some milk in late evening. Already having some problems with the one plate rule, as I did in the past. When I'm strict about plating and no-virtual-stacking, I routinely undereat. I mean, I'm not that hungry, so it's barely noticeable, but whenever I roughly tally up the calories, the number rarely exceeds 1200, and that's not healthy. Wondering about possible solution.

Tuesday Tuesdays are always super hard for me - no motivation carried over from Monday, and the weekend is so far down the road. But I managed! I did have an oversized lunch plate, though.

Hi Imogen! Nice to see you on the boards.

Hi, automated! Nice to see you back I'm desperately hoping for some free time this weekend to catch up on everyone's threads, but with in-laws visiting, baby teething, and my usual work-at-home routine it's gonna be difficult.
Wednesday
Thursday I took Nina to my parents, and I succumbed to temptation when they put pistachio halva on the table. Then I went out for a walk and saw they were selling salted caramel ice cream in one of the little shops in the area. Ahhh, memories... In spite of the halva and the ice-cream, I kept it all contained and plated. Didn't have time nor appetite for dinner later, so the sweets were my third meal, as it turns out. Mixed feelings - I failed, but not miserably so. For someone with a history of binge eating and WTH effect kicking in every time an unplanned morsel crosses my lips, that's actually a kind of a victory.

Imogen Morley wrote:For someone with a history of binge eating and WTH effect kicking in every time an unplanned morsel crosses my lips, that's actually a kind of a victory.

YES! Good for you, this is definitely a victory!

Yesterday was good(ish). Today I failed hard I was stressed and overwhelmed with juggling in-laws, baby, cooking, work, and social obligations, and there was so much delicious food lying around the house and waiting for the guests. I had originally planned having some cake when THEY dig in, sadly, I ended up devouring several pieces right in the kitchen, standing up, just shoving them in my mouth without any attention nor pleasure. The sugar rush made me hungry soon after, so I also had a second dinner. Bleh.
My homework for the weekend: is there anything I'm really craving, or am I eating just because I can?

Hi, Imogen! It’s nice to see you! It sounds like you have a lot going on right now. Maybe you just need some relaxation time?

Absolutely! Hard to find any time for myself this weekend, but at least I can have a nice long shower. I don't know why, but it always puts me in a "fresh start" mode.
Tons of yummy food all around me, I'm eating A LOT, but over the top S-days are to be expected whenever I restart.

Monday. Plates were biggish, though. It's wonderful to have the structure again! Funny how every weekend I tell myself that free eating is the ultimate happiness, and then can't wait for Monday to begin. But free eating isn't compulsion...
I'm going to take (probably) two S-events this week - my daughter's first birthday party on Wednesday, and (maybe) Shrove Tuesday (which actually falls on Thursday). People are usually gorging on doughnuts, but since I don't like them, I don't know if I should participate. Probably not. There's no obligation to stuff myself just because everyone else around me does. The one exception - if my mom makes her homemade doughnuts, I'm going to eat some.

I'm a donut fiend. I'll eat all the ones you don't want.

Turns out my mum made her own, so this time I don't have any left, sorry!
Tuesday was OK, but things went downhill on Wednesday and Friday. One planned piece of cake at my daughter's b-day party somehow multiplied, I grabbed some of the snacks I was preparing, and in general permasnacked all evening. On Thursday dad brought us my mum's homemade doughnuts, two per person. I ate one in the spirit of Shrove Tuesday, but the second doughnut somehow found its way to my mouth on Friday, along with its twin which originally belonged to my husband.
Today is Saturday, and I snacked on some chocolate which I don't even particularly like (gift from the parents from their recent trip abroad), plus I've just had a cinnamon bun. VERY disappointing S-day. Tomorrow we're going for a big family dinner, and I'm bringing in carrot cake with mascarpone and whipped cream.

Am I reading this right that you are very involved with your family? Or is this just a series of special occasions recently?

It seems like heaven and hell to have big family get-togethers all the time. haha

Bit of a confession here... Yeah, I am terribly close with my family (parents and two brothers + SIL/kids), we all love to cook, eat, and celebrate with food... very European I guess With such a big family there are always birthdays, anniversaries, and holidays spent together, and each of those occassions revolves around food. Sadly, my husband, whose family is not nearly as close-knit as mine, doesn't get it. Ah, the ups and downs of living with an extreme introvert... Just yesterday he spoiled the occassion with some insensitive comments to my niece, and I was so furious that I forgot about the carrot cake we had left over in the fridge. I'd rather not use fighting with him as a way to tone down my S-days, though...
It's tough this Monday. I feel like my S-weekend was totally disappointing, plus family tensions still make me stressed and in consequence, hungry. Got some potentially bad-ish news, too. I'm white-knuckling it today.

Sounds like you’ve had a tough day, Imogen. Hope all turns out Ok with this worrying news you’ve had.

No S can be tricky even on days when we have near-perfect autonomy...I have no solutions to offer, just to say, i can relate! If I have family round, or I go visiting, I’m almost forced to have a mad S day. I think we’re sometimes not even aware of some of the pressures that such occasions bring. For instance, when I’m at my mother’s, I always end up in the biscuit tin...and it’s occurred to me that it could be the relative coldness and gloom of her house that makes me tense up, as much as the relationship! Even when I’m the host, I sometimes find myself longing to escape, and in those ‘trapped’ situations, food is such a solace. Especially when eaten in a subversive, secretive sort of way! Could this be the answer....to do something subversive that isn’t eating? Mind goes blank...

Take care!

Thanks for your insights! I always eat like a madwoman at parties where I feel uncomfortable, because I don't have to talk to people I don't like when I'm having my mouth full When it comes to my family, I love them to pieces, and we've mostly had very close, very supportive relationship. Some tension does arise from time to time, of course. To my mom food always equals love, and I think my brothers and I have all subconsciously absorbed this notion.
Tuesday has been green so far, but I virtual plated, as my dinner came unusually early. I normally avoid splitting my plates/meals, I think it messes with the habit, but it was either this or inevitable failure in the evening.

I think if you plan ahead and eat how you intended, splitting the plate where necessary, then it’s not a fail....you’re staying mindful and just being practical! The willpower muscle is still being used.

Yeah, I know it's technically not a fail... but it feels so to me. Sadly, even virtual plating didn't help, and I was ravenous around 8 PM. Hot liquids didn't cut it, neither did milk, so I ate a smallish meal. Tuesday was red, in the end, but at least I didn't give in to the binging thoughts that appeared! It occurred to me that I already failed, so I might as well have the chocolate, and some fruit... but I didn't reach for it. Refraining from binging is as important to me as being strict about N-day rules.

In a way, resisting the urge to binge when you’ve already had a slip is the biggest challenge of all. I’m rarely successful in that situation! Sounds like you did really well on a difficult day. Hope tomorrow is easier! 🙂

Octavia, seems like I'm practising my urge-resisting muscle too much. I had a fail on late Wednesday evening, combination of boredom eating and passing thoughts on getting back to the mod that allowed me to get to my lowest adult weight while having planned sweets on some weekdays. Still, no binge!
I'm afraid of the weekend. Silly, isn't it? I'm afraid of losing control, eating with wild abandon, just shoving sweets into my mouth on autopilot. I'm also conflicted over planning treats vs going with the flow. If I don't have anything special waiting for me, I usually end up mindlessly munching on whatever sweet I find in the cupboards, but when my planned treat doesn't taste as good as I expected, I binge from sheer disappointment. No idea for a solution yet.

Hi Imogen, sorry to hear you’re feeling conflicted - it’s (certainly for me) one of the worst feelings, and a recipe for inertia. And nothing soothes inertia like snacking! Maybe the greatest benefit of Vanilla No S is that there is no conflict - you don’t try to improve on it, or question whether it will work, you just do it. Maybe if that worked for you before, it can work again. I’m certainly taking great strength from what you told me, how your first year of Vanilla No S worked to help you lose 10% of your body weight. You mustn’t lose touch with how insping that is.

I often find in life that when I’m torn between two polarities (like, the decision of either planning S treats or going with the flow) then the real solution is a third answer...like maybe doing both. For me, that’s the real delight and freedom of S days - having planned treats like my chocolate bunny 😊 AND then freely grabbing a few grapes here, an extra bit of toast there.

Must go, have just filled the kitchen with smoke after not cleaning the oven. No idea what was smoking....

You're right, Octavia. I need to re-establish solid habits before tampering with the system. From time to time I get impatient... fortunately, then I read my old journal entries or comments such as yours, and all falls into place again. Thanks.
Thursday was green, so has been Friday so far. I overfilled my plates, though. Funny how it started to stand out... It really bothers me, not calorie-wise, but, to my great surprise, because I'd rather arrive at my meal slightly hungry. Even the plainest food tastes delicious! When I'm still full-ish but sit to a meal anyway (with a small baby at home it's either now or never!), I rarely get any satisfaction from it. I'm going to either go longer than 6 hours between meals, if necessary, or eat a bit less.
Curious about my check-in tomorrow!

Being hungry makes ALL the difference - it’s become a big motivator for me, on No S. Even a simple cup of tea between meals has a wonderful, soothing quality when I’m not stuffed and de-sensitised from snacking!

Hope you have a good weekend!

Hi Imogen --
I think that as much as you can fence around a few simple laws right now, the easier on your "willpower-muscles". I only say this because from my own experience with babies/toddlers/schoolage kids, I can never get enough comfort-food. So.....whatever you have found EASIEST to comply with long-term in the past, do it girl.
And be so, so, so gentle with yourself.

Octavia, you too!
Auto, thanks for reminding me to be gentle with myself. I stepped onto the scale this Saturday morning, as it was a real bummer to see I was up by roughly a pound - currently 58.8 kilos. 19 days under my belt, including only 6 truly green days, 4 idiotic and 1 relatively calm S-day, 3 hard failures (binges), and 5 near-misses (violated sweet/snacking rule or piled my plates sky high but without binging). No wonder why the results are so disappointing! I'm trying to stay positive, though. I'll enjoy my weekend, and watch my plates during the week.

...totally agree with Auto there...willpower is in short supply when you’re using so much in your everyday life, what with the sleepless nights, getting little wriggling feet into sleep suits, mopping up split juice and so on. I found early motherhood like wrestling with an octopus, and I only had one bubba! The fact that you’ve endured through all those difficult days is a sign of strength - recovering from slips is so tough, and you obviously have that toughness, Imogen. When life calms down, you’ll probably be the most resilient of us all!

My eating habits were fairly chaotic in those days when my DD was a baby. And 5pm could be wine o’clock! At junior school, she used to go to an after-school club, and everyone thought it was because I was at work. I’d actually got home from work hours earlier, but was now semi-passed out in bed with a load of chocolate biscuits!

Plenty of time to get the scale under control...No S is a long-term thing, after all. Keep smiling. (My late Dad used to have a funny saying to help put things into perspective: ‘as long as you’re eatin’ your dinner...’) 🙂

Awww, thank you for such kind words. The support on this forum has always been incredible... one of few such places across the entire Internet.
I binged on late Saturday evening (boredom + "because I can"). In hindisght, I shouldn't have brought home so much of my favourite chocolate. If it's in the house, I'm going to eat it all before Sunday night. I truly enjoyed it and had craved it all week... but too much of a good thing IS NOT a good thing itself. Went to bed stuffed and woke up with terrible stomach ache.
Sunday was tamer, but I can't say I enjoyed all my treats equally. Some were just passable, but guess what, I ate every last crumble. It's just past 8 pm, and I'm wrestling with my demons. Sunday evening has always been a difficult time for me, second only to Tuesday.
I noticed I don't enjoy my sweets as much when I eat them right after meals. I try to avoid snacking at all costs, though, so I perhaps need to create some kind of "ritual" to both enjoy my sweets between meals and not engage in mindless snacking. Sort of like planned snack/afternoon tea thing. Have my treat with coffee around noon, and then in the afternoon with tea? I'll have plenty of time to think it through till the next weekend.

I can't do vanilla anymore. I'm tired of the constant deprivation/binge cycle. I restarted NoS in order to regularise my eating and stop noshing on sweets every day and guess what? Every weekend has been a sugar rollercoaster, and my food journal clearly shows that I ate less treats BEFORE the reboot, even though I had imagined otherwise.
A mod has been instituted a few days ago. Besides regular three meals, I'm allowed to have one dessert, up to 300 calories, every evening after the baby has gone to sleep. Success was mixed so far (one minor slip-up, one binge-ish episode, 4 green days), but I want progress, not perfection or complete chaos of S-days. We'll see how that goes.

Imogen, I hear you! I had the same deprivation/binge feelings on vanilla, so created my mod two years ago. With the exception of directly after my daughter's wedding last year (conveniently right before the holidays with goodies galore!) when I purposely went off plan, having sweets available daily has been the "pressure release valve" that has really enabled me to lose, maintain, and now lose again (fortunately from a much lower starting weight than two years ago). Sometimes all it takes is a little adjustment to make it work for you, so know that the sweet mod can be successful.

Hi Imogen! You go girl. Do what needs be done! I thought you and Sinnie always had a mod similar to what Blessing described (a sweet every day, or something like that)? Do what works.

Good luck with your mod, Imogen. I think No S is a robust enough framework for you to tweak it to suit you. That feeling of deprivation must be avoided at all costs! You’ve got so many demands on you, with your young family, that it’s no surprise that Vanilla is really difficult right now. I have no doubt that when my bubba was tiny, I would not have been able to do Vanilla. A baby can prevent you from even finishing a proper meal (let alone cooking one) or enjoying a hot drink...the linchpins of Vanilla No S! I’m sure you’ll come up with something equally sane and effective. Do keep us updated! 🙂

Life, I remember your mod and I'm very happy it has worked for you so wonderfully. I tried it at some point, but sweets at meals were just feeding my cravings too much, so I stopped. Different strokes for different folks, right? But with just a little bit of tweaking, I might finally find the right way for me.
Auto, I've restarted NoS after a two-year break to give my eating some structure again - I wasn't happy about snacking and too many desserts too often, although I must say my weight has been perfectly acceptable. Somehow, I felt obliged to start from scratch, meaning vanilla. But it's never worked for me long term! Time to face the facts.
Octavia, vanilla NoS has always felt to me a bit like being on/off a diet. I strongly recommend it to everyone who's brand new to the whole plan, but I know some folks here (Sinnie, Anoulie, LifeisBlessing) who after a lot of soul-searching decided to apply the same rules to their eating day in, day out. For some of us it may be less demanding than holding out till the weekend and then being left alone without any plan.
Tuesday was Woohoo! I think I'll stick with Saturday morning as my weigh-in day. Feeling impatient already!

...what seems to be happening for me on S days at the moment is that I’m sort of doing Intuitive Eating! Only eating what my body truly seems to want, while allowing for a slightly festive approach...so there is a sense of boundaries, but not in the same way as the N days. I’ve landed up here after loads of stuffed, slightly nauseated S days.

Mind you, it’s still early days for me. I’ve no idea what will happen in the long run...please keep posting then I can copy you....😊😂

Octavia, it's entirely possible that NoS will work for you without any mods. Don't rush anything, just calmly observe and adjust when necessary. I'm pretty sure that I'd stick to vanilla if I needed to lose weight, just as I did in the past. But given my history with disordered eating, I'd rather try a little tweak than constantly wallow in misery every weekend.
Wednesday was yet another success My husband was shocked when he saw the assortment of sweets I'd bought for the next few days. If stockpiling backfires, I'll resort to buying individual treats every day. But I hate shopping so very much that I'm really rather hoping that this strategy will work out.

That's funny about your stockpile of sweets. I apply the same principle to alcohol -- buy enough for the whole week. When it's gone, it's gone!

Auto, your willpower must be amazing then! For me, when it's gone it's gone... until the next day, when I replenish my supply.
Thursday I had a couple of rough moments, but I reminded myself that giving in after so many successful days would make me feel really terrible afterwards. Plus, cravings stop going where they aren't fed... So I distracted myself and persisted! Yay me! The scale hasn't budged a bit in either direction, but I have to be patient during TTOM. However, the numbers are quite irrelevant to me right now - the feeling of normalcy, peace of mind, and the thought that I can enjoy a moderate portion of whatever I want each evening are priceless.

Friday was The funny thing is, the treat I'd prepared for the evening was totally disappointing. I took a small bite and immediately felt regretful, as if I HAD to eat it and be miserable. Then I reminded myself that there's no obligation to eat anything I didn't like just because I had planned it. I gave the stuff to my husband, who thought it was truly divine, and chose something much yummier for my Friday treat. The whole thing was a big reminder that binge mentality is very strong, but I can fight back, and nothing and no one forces me to eat - it's either my choice or giving in to compulsion.

Saturday I am loving this mod!

This is nice to hear!

Auto, thanks for your previous advice. Seems like the mod is working way better than vanilla ever did.
Sunday I was tempted to eat for emotional reasons for a few moments but persisted, reminding myself how many successful days I already had under my belt. I am positively baffled how easy it is to follow this mod. Maybe it has something to do with the fact that I wait an entire day to have my treat, and knowing there's something wonderful for me in store later in the evening makes it easier to turn down unplanned eating events. Plus, it seems to satisfy my emotional eating monster that is raging loose right now, just three weeks before I resume my job after 1,5-year break. Sitting down with a cup of hot tea and some carefully chosen treat to watch an episode of Outlander (OK, maybe two... or three ) after the baby has gone to sleep is my current destressing ritual. Very relaxing, and so much needed. Onwards!

Monday was I ate very little protein during the day, which made me ravenous in the evening. I gave in and had an egg salad sandwich and two pancakes with maple syrup and milk on the side right after my dessert at 8 PM. Had trouble sleeping afterwards! Of course, WTH thoughts started resurfacing right away - still, I managed to talk back to them. Refraining from binging is a success in itself. Hoping for a better Tuesday in spite of sleep deprivation and DD coming down with a cold.

Hi Imogen!
I certainly think that recovery after a binge is one of the greatest skills we can learn. I almost think that’s what defines success! Sounds like you gave WTH a good talking to.

....not that an egg sandwich and a couple of pancakes after dinner is a binge. Another of my late dad’s favourite sayings: ‘it’s barely enough to fill a hollow tooth.’ 😉

Octavia, I doubt you could call that a binge, but I certainly considered going full ballistic for a moment. What I love about my mod is that I feel it helps me learn true moderation, not just delayed binging.
Tuesday I skipped my evening dessert, because DD's sickness turned our everyday routine upside down, and I felt like I wouldn't be able to relax and truly enjoy my treat.

Wednesday I had a savoury snack in the evening after my dessert. The things light and carby breakfasts do to me...
Thursday Although I must say that my evening treat was completely disappointing, but I kept eating, sorta mindlessly.

I've had great success with this mod so far - no binging for two weeks, and a little bit of vanity weight coming off. Several times I was very, very hungry in the evening, to the point I was unable to sleep, so I resorted to a snack - without any WTH effect kicking in.
I wish I had more time to post here and read your threads, folks! But soon, perhaps.

Quick update: I got back to work, so there's not much free time for me unless I somehow organise the chaos of everyday life (with mixed success so far). On the upside, I've already lost 2 kilos thanks to my mod! Woohoo! I've been binge free for a month. Wishing everyone happy Eeaster!

Well then, hello.
I'm currently maintaining at 56.5 kg while counting calories, which is great, BUT I eat *mostly* sweets, and usually in the form of snacks. I'm already afraid of my dentist appointment this Thursday... So even though I'm pretty happy about the number on the scale, I'm definitely worried about my mindset and health. There's some jiggle here and there which I don't like, I can't walk as fast as usual for as long as usual, and so on. A major bummer for me.
So, guess what? I'm restarting with plain vanilla NoS. I need accountability! I'm not going to plan calories for the day, because that will very soon lead to a slippery slope - "I can have X, because my numbers are so low today", aaaand there go my habit formation efforts. I may or may not eyeball calories retroactively, e.g. the next day. I may need it, because I often did "panicky eating" at meals during my vanilla phases.

Hi Imogen! Great to see you on the boards!

Hi auto! It is great to be here again, although I always imagine people must laugh at me for failing and restarting so many times. Or perhaps it's my inner critic talking... Anyway, hugs!
Monday was I did have a rather large dinner (fit on one plate with some edges showing, sure, but still...) and milky coffee between lunch and dinner. I was so sleepy all the time that I feared I'd fail from pure exhaustion on my first day. But I managed! I've also stopped weighing myself every day. I'll do it once a week, on Saturday mornings. That used to be a great motivator in the past - if I wanted accurate data, and I only had one chance a week to get it, I had to be strict.

Nope, not laughing about you at all. I always find your journey interesting. Good luck

Thanks for your kind words, eschano! Are you updating your thread? I'd love to know what's up with you and yours.
Wednesday was I was actually amazed how easy and natural it was for me yesterday... But I know it's the honeymoon phase still.

Imogen -- our dear eschano is "Tess' Daily Check-in" or something like that! I didn't know she had a thread either!!!

Thanks, auto! I'm not the most observant person
Thursday
Friday was more problematic <- this is gonna signify a "controlled fail". I was very hungry in the evening, and knowing that I would not be able to go to bed before midnight, I had a small, portion-controlled bowl of cereal. No binging, though, still counts as a success to me. Hope I'll be able to catch up on everyone's threads this weekend. We're also going to visit my ex-colleague, who completely changed his career path and now lives in the country, breeding rare semi-feral horses - the konik. There's going to be a barbecue of some sort, weather permitting, and I have some cake and caramel-filled biscuits in the fridge.

Oops, looks like I confused everyone by coming out as Tess 😊
Imogen, sounds like a wonderful weekend ahead! Enjoy. And as for the controlled fail: I don’t mind controlled fails that much personally it’s the crazy ones like I had yesterday that are tough.

eschano, I reckon everyone has to come up with their own definition of failure, don't you think?
Saturday weigh-in: 56 kilos. I'm quite pleasantly surprised. So far, sweets have been oddly off-putting this weekend, so I use my freedom to have seconds and larger than usual meals. We'll see how that goes later, when I realise the weekend is coming to an end! The Last Supper syndrome is strong with this one...

Helloooo dear Imogen! It’s lovely to see you back. Good luck with your return to Vanilla. Your struggles with calorie counting sound just like mine. CC reassures you that you’re eating little enough to lose weight - so it has a certain inbuilt motivation - but it doesn’t help with habits. I used to incorporate as many sweets and snacks as I could when I was doing it! Eventually my self-control would break, and the sweets etc. would just multiply! Also with CC (I found), you have to keep on caring about weight loss, and I think for most of us busy people, there will be times when we don’t care: sleep becomes more important than slimness, or a family issue or work project starts to dominate our consciousness. Then it all goes to pot. I’ve found with vanilla No S, my motivation to drop a dress size can wax and wane, but I can still see many other great reasons for doing the No S routine.

I’ve been on No S now for 9 months, doing pure vanilla (and more recently a small mod I call Fibre Supplement!) and I’ve lost about 9lb, and a lot of this is thanks to YOU!!! You explained the logic of Vanilla and told me not to be afraid of mad S days. You were so right. I’m so grateful to you (and to many others who helped me to understand the process, when I was afraid that all I was doing was moving calories around). I can’t thank you enough.

Have a great weekend! X

Octavia -- that was a glorious testimonial right there!! Love it!

Octavia, I echo what auto said: that's a fantastic testimonial! I'm super happy for you! I know how frustrating vanilla can sometimes get, especially if your default alternative is cc... I've kept switching between the two for the last 3 years. One fail and I was instantly declaring "that doesn't work!", and going vanilla, cc, vanilla, cc, endlessly, with predictable results. I also second what you said about not caring (well, pretty much EVERYTHING your said). Some days, even if I do care, I just don't feel like eating what I planned for my meals, so I rebel and go hog wild, because why not? With vanilla, I can make decisions right at the table and eat what I want most at the moment, and still be on plan, still within the gentle boundaries of NoS. That's another thing I love about vanilla.
I'm definitely satisfied with my Saturday. Besides keeping pleasantly busy (visiting my parents and helping them with the kitchen makeover, and then seeing my friend and taking a lovely walk in the woods), I kept asking myself what I really, soulfully wanted. I had large meals, but didn't feel stuffed, never snacked, I drank my favourite sweetened iced tea, and only in the evening I caught myself craving some treat, so my husband went out and brought me one piece of insanely good Oreo cheesecake from our local bakery. The key to satisfaction, I think, was constantly reminding myself that if I eat something just because it's there or because of the fear of missing out, I always end up disappointed - because I don't eat what I really want, duh! And how do I fix disappointment with food? With more food, of course, because maybe that next thing will bring me the bliss I was expecting...

Sunday was disappointing. I kept permasnacking, but nothing really satisfied me. I didn't plan my meals either, so no wonder why my eating was all over the place. Bleh. Monday comes as a blessing.

Imogen -- I absolutely think you are on to something with trying to keep mornings "N"ish, even on S Days. I guess that sounds pretty basic, although pure Vanilla wouldn't have us worry about that, so now I'm feeling a bit bad for even bringing it up again. But I'm currently not doing pure Vanilla anyway, so I just want you to know how much you're helping me with my new healthier ways of eating.

Awwww! I'm so happy I could guide you in the right direction. I think the explanation for this is actually scientific, and probably has to do with blood sugar spikes during the day - but to hell with theory, as long as it works!
Monday
Tuesday has been mixed to far. Light and carby breakfast sent me to the cafeteria for second lunch. The square has turned slightly pink, but I'm determined to keep it that way and not give up NoS for the rest of the day. I genuinely needed extra protein, and now that I've got it, there's no reason to step out of the boundaries anymore.
EDIT: I managed to keep the rest of Tuesday green

Wednesday has been an S-day (national holiday in my country). I've kept it under control by refraining from sweets until my usual coffee time at around 10 AM - so no sugar at breakfast. Cravings were weaker than usual, and I didn't have any embarassing bingey episodes (yet). Saving three biscuits for the evening. Yay!

Hi, Imogen! It’s nice to see you again! I can relate to your experience with the light and carby breakfast. I’ve learned the hard way that my eating goes much better for the day when I have more protein at breakfast.
Good job sticking with the habits!

Yes, I'm trying to be mindful and eat more protein in the morning. It doesn't always protect me from binging or failing, but as far as I can tell, it's my best shot.
Thursday was Light breakfast again. In consequence, I had two lunches, plus my boss brought cheesecake and chia pudding for us to share... and so we did. It wasn't a binge, true, but nevertheless overeating at its finest. I marked it and moved on.

Friday
Saturday weigh-in: 56.8, but I'm not panicking yet.

Happy S Days!!!

Yep, I don't think you need to panic about 0.3 kg...... but I get that gaining weight is a damnably slippery slope. One glance back through my own thread shines that fact in my face.

It's actually 0.8, but as I said, no big deal. I'm sure I didn't overeat that much in the past week, and it's very likely water weight or something like that. I need to see the overall trend to make adjustments, if any.
Saturday and Sunday were very satisfying - again, I believe because I refrained from sweets at breakfast. On Saturday I had three moderate meals, plus dessert with coffee, and Magnum ice cream bar in the evening. On Sunday, three meals again (one rather large - soup plus main course when we were visiting my parents), and one large piece of banoffee cheesecake later in the day. I feel satisfied, not stuffed, and frankly, quite proud of myself. The best thing of all is that I barely used any willpower - it seems that a protein-based breakfast and "no sweets before noon" rule keeps cravings at bay.

Yay! This is encouraging for me to hear too - I'm also trying to keep my S mornings normal.

I'm very happy that this little mod works for you too! I swear by it.

Monday
Tuesday Two scoops of ice cream on my way home from work (emotional eating). Also, large plates at meals.

Sounds like maybe you had a rough day Tuesday? Hope things are going better now.

Ugh, relationship issues. But all is solved now.
Wednesday: and uneventful.

Glad for a green day. And your relationship "all is solved"? That got me laughing, because my husband and I tend to just have a spat and then never really go too deep about it later. More like, "all is pushed under the rug" at my house sometimes.

Haha, Auto, you nailed it, as this weekend we're all miserable and snapping at each other again. Same old, same old, I guess.
Thursday I had a small piece of cheesecake that my boss brought in.
Friday binge-ish episode. But it didn't feel good this time, gave me no comfort, and felt forced, just as if my brain was automatically trying to push me into the old habit while knowing really well that it would feel weird and uncomfortable. I didn't even polish off everything I'd intended.
Saturday has been pretty tame so far, with sugar-free morning and a Snickers bar and some homemade cake after dinner. I must admit I feel like I overdid a bit on the cake, though. The morning weigh-in was okay, I went down to 56.1 kg in spite of the weekday fails. This convinces me that I can lose a little of the vanity weight, and not just maintain, on plain vanilla. That requires strictness, of course, but that's a whole different story, heh.

Sunday - ugh. Ate waaay too much, and went to bed stuffed and miserable. Tasting sugar in the morning is a slippery slope.

Well, thankfully N Days have arrived!

Quick weekly update:
Monday
Tuesday -> massive fail
Wednesday -> massive fail
Thursday -> massive fail
Friday: kinda sorta fail-ish (I'm going to have a slice of cheesecake in the evening)

All week I've been sleep deprived, rushed, grabbing whatever from the fridge, and not eating enough protein. Also, more guests arrived, so there was plenty of yummy food and desserts at various celebrations and events, tempting me all the time. It would have been quite different if I'd had the time to plan my meals and pay attention to how much protein I ate... not to mention grabbing an hour of extra sleep each night. I'm quite anxious about my weekly weigh-in tomorrow, but determined to keep the weekend sane to minimise the damage. I have some extra motivation waiting in my wardrobe: I've found a pair of pre-pregnancy perfect skinnies, which are just a tad too tight for me now. Oh, to lose a kilo or two... *sigh*

Hi! Imogen, thanks for your comment on my thread! And Auto, thanks for what you said about my glowing testimonial!


May I join you in this N-style mornings on S days mod? It’s a great idea. Recently I’ve been lazy and have given up my good egg breakfast habit, replacing the egg+1 slice of toast with 2 slices of toast. I must go back to the egg. Protein doesn’t change our bad habits, but it gives us that extra bit of strength, physically and mentally.

I too am at my most vulnerable when guests come round. It’s so funny how I offer things like wine and nuts, but end up consuming more of these things than my guests...

I bet hosting guests is one of the toughest moments for any dieter or a person changing their eating habits. Who doesn't want to partake in celebratory eating? I probably need some extra rules
Weekend was as crazy as it gets and it ended up with massive tummy troubles. Saturday morning weigh-in showed 57.1, but I double checked on Monday and it went down to 56.3. Half of Monday has been a sick a day, but I've just eaten lunch and since I'm feeling better, I'll have a light supper, too.

Hi Imogen!

Sorry about the Wild weekend, also about not feeling well.
And oh my -- if there is anything that makes eating healthy hard it's being tired.

You said your weekend was crazy -- does that mean you had sugar before noon?

Hi auto! Sorry for taking so long to reply. Yeah, I did have sugar with breakfast. It always ends badly! I guess I should have known better...
I've had a string of sick days (stomach flu, followed by a cold) and fell off the wagon BIG TIME. Current weigh-in is downright terrifying - 57.5 this very morning. I guess some of my weight gain has to do with rebound eating after being ill with zero appetite for two weeks. Oh well. The only important thing is to get up when I fall.

Inspired by some advice in my thread on the general forum I've decided to commit to the simplest, canonical version of vanilla NoS, and my husband is joining me too!

FRIDAY
Moderate breakfast, sweet and decidedly milky coffee, small lunch, big dinner. I'm done with eyeballing calories and restricting my portions in any way: one plate rule is enough for now. In the words of our Dear Leader, "if it takes you a few extra calories up front to buy the habit of structured, mealtime eating, they're calories well spent".

SATURDAY
Weekly weigh-in: 56.7
Treats: 2x oreo cheesecake, 1x fudge candy. 3 meals.

SUNDAY
Treats: oreo cheesecake, 2x chocolate&orange cake, Kit Kat peanut butter bar. 3 meals, 1 snack (hot dog).

oreo cheesecake? Yum!

Yup. My demise!

MONDAY
Small breakfast, moderate lunch and dinner. Nothing but tea and water between meals. My boss brought goodies from her trip, I put them away out of sight to bring home on Friday (Friday afternoon is when my husband starts his S-days, I prefer the canonical version for now).

Oh wow, your husband does it with you?
Hey, seems like you are doing brilliantly.

Just popping by to say hi. Hope all’s well with you, Imogen. Good luck with your new commitment to Vanilla!

Eschano, he's put on 5 kilos since started working from home. I calculated his BMI and some other metrics for him to see, and he was quite shocked he was borderline obese. Even I wouldn't have said so just looking at him - he's a big, well-built guy, so the extra weight he carries is distributed quite evenly. He just looks bigger all over, not exactly fat, if you know what I mean. Nevertheless, something has to be done about it. I'm happy he's trying to follow NoS, but urge him not to restrict normal food too much during weekdays.
Octavia, so nice to see you here! I'm planning to catch up on your thread as soon as I can. Your insights have always been tremendously inspiring to me.

Sounds great though to do it together. Thankfully my husband has also agreed to no sweets during the week. So at least one rule.

Eschano, that's great! I hope your husband sticks with it. I do think we as a society eat way too much sugar on a daily basis. Does he track his progress in any way?

TUESDAY
I white-knuckled it today, with the help of chai latte early in the afternoon. My plates were decidedly big.

WEDNESDAY
Yeah, I binged. For a really stupid reason.
I was curious if my weight had gone down (even by a hundred grams, I'm such a sucker for data tracking), so I stepped on the scale, even though it wasn't my designated weigh-in day, which is Saturday. And I saw 56.8, a whopping hundred grams more than the last time. 'Screw it', I said, and binged like no tomorrow all Friday long. It was a mixture of disappointment, regret, and the realisation that pure vanilla without calorie counting has always been OK for maintenance, but never good enough to get rid of any of my squishy bits. To add insult to injury, my entire week had been exhausting, and that Friday I didn't have proper, protein-based breakfast.

THURSDAY S-day (national holiday)
Binge-ish episodes this afternoon. Not as much damage, calorie-wise, as yesterday, but I still feel terrible. I keep wrestling with my thoughts: straight vanilla, vanilla with calorie counting, mods? Why can't I get back to my lower weight? I even feel resentful that my genes made me so short that I have to restrict my eating more than anyone else I know just to stay below 60 kilos. Ugh. Not a good S-day at all.

I feel ya on the resentment that we are short and that makes the eating thing trickier.

I'm right there with you, Imogen, on knowing that pure vanilla doesn't help me lose weight anymore - maintenance, absolutely. I can't remember how old you are - I'm guessing 30? but now that I'm 42 I definitely need to stay more focused on my intake. But......the truth is that I am actually enjoying my food more now than I ever have in my whole life!!! I take a kind of joy in the nourishment I feed my body, and I'm proud of myself when I make good choices. So, being routined and strict isn't all bad. It makes me happier in the long run.

I put in a plug for "automated" meals. If you eat the same thing breakfast and lunch on N Days, and similar composed meals for dinner (protein + veg), then you can still be pretty free on S days (stay clean until lunch, haha), and I'll bet you can lose weight. It makes it easier to make adjustments to the size of the meals (without calorie counting) if the meals are the same. Better data collection!

Hang in there, sweetheart.

Awwww thanks! You are absolutely right that the right mindset can turn challenge into opportunity. Sadly, I've been wallowing in self-pity for weeks. On the bright side, I did a short workout yesterday evening, and immediately felt more optimistic and energetic.

FRIDAY
B: 1/2 wholewheat sunflower seed roll spread with 20 g salmon pate, 2 hard boiled eggs, celery, handful of grapes
L: apple, 400 g potato salad
D: 50 g roasted turkey breast, 100 g mashed potatoes (no added butter), green salad with garlic dressing
BINGE: 150 g salmon&spinach roulade, 1 piece fudge candy, 4 squares of various chocolates, 3 choco chips cookies with a glass of milk, more potato salad (300 grams?)

Why am I doing this to myself??? Why is it so hard this time?
Oh, f*** calories. What I need is a habit. Solid, deeply entrenched habit. And in order to establish it, I have to forget that calories exist. Counting calories is very often dangerous for me - when I have any left over after my three carefully planned meals, I tend to think "a small treat won't kill me" - yeah, it won't kill ME, but it effectively kills my NoS habits. And because I screw up the vanilla rules, I feel bad and I binge to fix my guilt. Vicious circle.
I want too much too fast. I dunno, I guess I have to accept that I won't be losing any weight anytime soon, and all my efforts should be focused on eating just three plates of food a day, no matter how humongous, and avoiding sweets and snacks on weekdays. Premature optimisation is the root of all evil, I shall repeat to myself every morning.
I feel like I'm rambling. Time to go to bed. Goodnight everyone, and have a great S-weekend.

I’m not one for calorie counting as I have the memory of a sieve these days so I would be wrong all the time but if you would want to incorporate it could you count weekly calories as opposed to daily ones? That way when you have some leftover you can bank them for the weekend?
That said, I still much prefer the habit idea and also Auto’s suggestion of default meals that are healthy

One paragraph makes you rambling? Haha that is all my thread ever is! Stream of conscious rocks!

S Days are here, so try to enjoy the no-counting thing at least.

And, please forgive me if I sound like a prick - but you actually weigh your food? Like put it on a scale while you fix your meal? Oh the killjoy!

Nowadays the very act of logging my food (let alone weigh it) is enough for me to want to dive into the food after a few days - it becomes unbearably tedious, and the rebellious feelings start welling up.

Eschano, I'm pretty much sure that calorie counting at this point doesn't make sense in my case. I can be accurate, but I never stay within my self-imposed limits, so why bother if it doesn't work? That's just wasted time and mental energy. I'll try to reestablish firm NoS habits, and then reconsider calorie counting as a possible mod.
Auto, Ladybird, yeah, I do weigh my food sometimes when I want to be honest with myself. I don't plan on having any specific amounts, I just weigh whatever I put on the plate, and sometime later check how many calories it had.

SATURDAY 58.1 (drumroll please)

B: big bowl of nut&honey cornflakes
L: tofu spread with sun-dried tomatoes on wholegrain roll, grapes
coffee, several bites of cake (didn't like it much), 1 fudge candy
D: lasagna (ate some, felt too full, so I finished the rest later), homemade brownie

My weigh-in was downright terrifying, but realistically, most of the weight gain is water retention.
I felt uncomfortably full after eating the whole roll. I usually eat just half of it with extra spread on the side. My homemade brownie made me think I should get back to baking some special treats on weekends. I've been avoiding it, because I know we would eat an entire pan. But to be honest, I eat at least the same amount of calories in store-bought stuff. Gotta put some ideas on my "to bake" list!

SUNDAY 57.6

Quite pleasant S-day, actually (at least food-wise).
B: fried sausage, white roll, tomato, brownie
snack: oreo cheesecake
L: a bit of pasta with spinach, wasn't hungry so I left most of it
D: zucchini/goat cheese quiche (massive YUM), brownie
snack: grapes

Not bad at all! I tried to make choices based on how I would feel later and what I really, really wanted, and it worked.
Tomorrow is going to be super stressful, it's my daughter's first time in daycare. Only 3 hours, but I'm on the edge anyway. I hope I'll be able to stick to three meals, no snacks, and no seconds. Habit first!

Stressful and more so for you than her. Hope it goes well for you both

Jx

MONDAY 57.5 (I weigh less after 2 S-days than I did on Friday, LOL)

B: half a roll, some tofu spread, mango (ugh, I was too nervous to eat anything more substantial)
L: quiche, grapes, coffee with milk and sugar
D: chicken strips, potatoes, red cabbage and onion salad

1 Walk At Home fast mile (so fast it got me sweating!)

So far so good, mostly because I was too anxious and busy to eat.
Quite predictably, Nina cried a lot (so I was told), and wasn't really interested in anything the other kids were doing, including eating, BUT she didn't look half as bad as I'd expected when she came out. We just need to give her time, and I'm sure she'll be more than okay. I don't want to repeat my parents' mistake - they kept me home until I was 6, and man, the transition from a total hermit into a high-functioning introvert took me a painfully long time.