Starting yet again--Day 1 tomorrow

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:22 am

I've been trying to start this nearly every day for a couple of months now. I guess I just haven't been strict enough or tried hard enough. I have this horrible bingeing habit (always on sweets) that is causing me to gain weight like crazy, and I know that No S can help me get out of that.

So...

Tomorrow is Day 1 for sure!

Any suggestions?

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 3:54 am

Check out the podcast on strictness - one of my favorites.

Also, the sticky thread above "phases of No-S".

Best wishes, hope it really clicks for you!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:13 am

Thanks! I just listened to it, and it's great! I think if I get through the first couple of days I should be golden.

Sould I post what I eat on here or daily updates?

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:11 am

I recommend starting a daily check in thread and post there. You don't have to post everything you eat unless you want to - it's up to you. Some folks post all their meals. I only post what I eat if a) it's a red day or b) it's something that I really enjoyed / was looking forward to.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:35 pm

No S has definitely been key to greatly reducing a 38-year bingeing habit. I love, love, love my N days. Never thought I could go days without sweets. Now I prefer it. I just like other food more!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:38 am

And her goes my 21-Day challenge!

Day 1 - pretty good day

Wasn't really hungry at all, but after dinner started to crave sweets. To fight it off I chewed a stick of cinnamon gum, text messaged my friend that I was having a caving (he's my little cheerleader and agreed to be the angel on my shoulder for this), and took a shower, then did some homework. Doing alright so far!

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:45 am

Hope you made it through the evening. Can you believe you will reach a day on which you will be surprised to remember that you used to night-eat? It will happen.

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:21 am

Nice work - sounds like you have a few good tactics up your sleeve.

The first few weeks were hard for me too, but with strictness it really does get easier and easier, I promise! I'm a big believer in Reinhard's "starts hard, gets easier" instead of the usual diet "starts easy, gets harder".

Keep up the good effort!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:17 am

Day 2

Today was a failure. I was so hungry when I got home from school and I tried really hard to fight it off... Then ai had some grapes and it immediately slipped into a binge. ):

On the bright side, though, I am getting better--I was able to fight off the binge for a lot longer than I usually can.

Any advice?

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:54 am

I guess I should also post what I ate today, since I failed.

Breakfast (7am): multigrain Cheerios and almond milk

Lunch (11am): a large Honeycrisp apple, a whole turkey and hummus sandwich on wheat bread

*4pm: binge (waaaaaaaaay too much food to even try to remember it all)

Dinner (6pm): salad with chicken breast

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:26 am

Heya BritishFool,
Well, my first comment is not to beat yourself up. As you say, you delayed your normal behavior, so you are on your way to a better result next time. Mark the red and move on to a successful day tomorrow!

Just wanted to mention that your meals sound perhaps a little on the small side, especially if you're just getting started. I don't know how tall you are, so perhaps you are eating tiny, but if I had your breakfast and lunch, I'd be starving by 4pm as well. Letting yourself get really hungry while you are trying to break a snacking habit makes it even harder. For example, my breakfast this morning was a bowl of oatmeal with almond milk, some raisins, a small banana and half an apple spread with peanut butter.

Perhaps tweak your breakfast or lunch a little to include a bit of fat or protein, whatever helps you feel full longer - experiment for a while and you'll work it out.

Don't feel that you have to eat "dietish" meals - if you really love salad and chicken breast then fine, but if you are eating it out of duty, not relish, then I'd consider changing to foods you really enjoy. While you are trying to get the habit going make sure your meals are both filling and satisfying.

Good luck for a successful day tomorrow!

Over43 · Post by **Over43** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:55 am

That is what is so neat about this. Anyday can be Tag Eins.

My suggestion, sorry for all of you who have read this before, breakfast, breakfast is the key. Protein and fat in the morning seems to help keep me satiated through the rest of the day. And since you, I assume, are from the Empire, I would suggest eggs and bangers. Maybe some beans with that as well. All on one plate.

Good luck!

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:58 am

I agree that you're not eating enough at your meals. I also agree that fat in your diet is not the enemy.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:41 pm

You guys are probably right. This is hardly more than I ate while I was dieting last year.

Alright, so today, so far so good. I've just eaten breakfast, but I had a whole serving of oatmeal made with almond milk, and I added a tablespoon of almonds and 2 tablespoons of golden raisins. It filled me up pretty good. I also had some coffee.

Today is thanksgiving, so it's an S day and I'm planning on having some of my aunt's strawberry rhubarb pie right after dinner. It's occurred to me that my sweets consumption should be with a meal so it doesn't feel out of the norm and it builds the whole meal habit. Also, eating sweets on an empty stomach is just... Bad.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Nov 23, 2012 4:28 am

Day 3

Another failure. I did PERFECTLY up until nine o'clock. Then I got an urge to eat sweets and gave in and ended up binging. Again...

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Nov 23, 2012 5:47 am

I'm seeing my doctor on Monday. No doubt he'll be disappointed in me; I've gained 30 pounds in a month.

I'm going to try to stay green until my meeting with him. Maybe it will motivate me more.

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:48 am

Maybe I'm misunderstanding because of the time difference, but wasn't this an S day? You can't fail on an S day.

It's fine to have S day plans (e.g. having dessert with a meal), but at this early stage treat them as plans, not rules. You can't get a red S day - they're yellow because they're exempt. The only rules you need to stick to are no sweets, snacks and seconds on N days.

Also, your sweets were 5 hours later than the previous day, so you did hold out longer. How did you go making your meals larger / more satisfying?

Only three days in, try not to think about being perfect / failing, think more about learning what works or what doesn't, and how you can improve over time.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Nov 23, 2012 7:02 am

I've been considering any day on which I binge to be a red day. But yes, it was technically an s-day. Since you mention it, I should probably just focus on my behavior on n-days, and when those are habitual then focus on the s-days.

I did very well with my meals today. I had a very substantial breakfast, and was barely hungry when lunch came around, so I just had something light. Dinner was great, very satisfying and controlled.

It occurred to me today that most of my family members are buying me clothing for Christmas, and if I don't get my eating and my weight under control now none of it is going to fit and I'll feel even worse about myself. ):

What are some things I could tell myself when I go to start eating when I'm not supposed to in order to stop myself? Something on the harsher side would work with me (I've tried the "self-love" garbage and it's the reason I began the binge habit in the first place--I would say "oh it's okay, you're having a rough day. Go ahead and eat that brownie." Or "it's okay that you binged today; it's a learning experience". Essentially I ended up justifying all of my absurd eating with that self-love hogwash. It just doesn't pair well with my rigid personality.). For instance, when I was losing a bunch if weight last year I used my ex boyfriend as a kind of incentive--if I went for a piece of cake or something of that nature I would say "You know you're never going to get Mike back if you keep eating that crap. You'll only get him back if you get skinny first." I don't really know if this is the way to go, but it certainly worked last time.

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Sat Nov 24, 2012 7:25 am

I know some people set up two HabitCals, one for No-S and one called "NoBinge" or something like that. So, you can track your vanilla No-S compliance, and also track your binges, if you feel so inclined. I don't do this, but I've seen it mentioned a few times.

BritishFool wrote:What are some things I could tell myself when I go to start eating when I'm not supposed to in order to stop myself?

Perhaps I'm not the best person to comment, as I consider myself to be someone who overeats, rather than binges. I fall into neither the "self love" nor the "be a bitch to myself" categories. I don't find it helpful to let thoughts linger and try to fight or comfort myself, I set myself as many distractions as I can so that thoughts about food are as brief as possible. My strategy on N days is as follows:
1. Random thought that I'd like some PB&J on toast, or that last chocolate biscuit.
2. Realize it is an N day, therefore not an option.
3. Go and do something else immediately, that is not compatible with eating, e.g. laundry, dog walking, take a shower, gardening.

Alternatively, if it is an S day, it goes like this:
1. Random thought that I'd like some food.
2. Eat food, enjoy it.

Over time, and I mean months, I've found that I think about food less and less, except at meal times or when I need to (e.g. grocery shopping). If I do happen to think of a sweet thing I really want, I think "awesome, I'll get me a yummy one of them this Saturday", and that is generally the end of it.

I wouldn't worry about trying to control S days yet, especially big S's like Thanksgiving and Christmas. Use your willpower to get your N days down pat, don't use up precious energy trying to resist goodies you only see once a year at Thanksgiving dinner.

Have a great weekend!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:31 am

Those are excellent suggestions, ironchef (as always!). I also think my parents are bad influences on the way I eat... My mom always nibbles, and nearly every every day she brings home chocolate of some kind. And my father literally has cookies or muffins for breakfast every day, then doesn't eat until he gets home from work... And when he does get home from work, he has a cocktail and two or three snacks before dinner. Then he has dinner (usually two helpings), and immediately--and I mean not even fifteen minutes later--he's snacking again, and snacks continually until he goes to bed, which is three or four hours later. Also, he asks me to bake all the time because he and my aunt (his sister) recently passed down to me the family recipes, and I'm not exactly a bad baker... It's so frustrating. I can feel myself exploding out of my jeans as I type this, and I'm disgusted with myself.

Day 4 - yesterday
It ended up being a good day. I slept in really late because I didn't get to sleep until four o'clock (because I had so much sugar in my system from binging most likely), so I had a little yogurt and about five hours later I had dinner, and that was it.

Day 5 - today
Horrible day. Here are the food details:

Breakfast: caramel apple bagel with cream cheese, coffee
Snack: samples at Le Gourmet Chef store at the mall (a LOT of samples...)
Lunch: black bean soup in a bread bowl, apple
Snack: cookie dough (it was time for Christmas cookies... What a surprise, me, binging while baking...), about five pumpkin sugar cookies, a bunch of chocolate chip cookies, a couple of big dark chocolate peanut butter cups, 3/4 of a box of peanut butter bark
Dinner: an enormous slice of tomato basil pizza (I don't even like pizza and I wasn't hungry! Wtf!)
Snack: more peanut butter bark, about three or four more dark chocolate peanut butter cups, three more chocolate chip cookies, iced coffee, and a pickle

I'm trying to convince my mother to start No S with me because it's really hard when everyone around me eats sporadically. I don't know if she's going to though. Probably not. ):

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:22 am

Sounds like a tough environment. My husband is someone who can snack and nibble but stays thin. There is no point taking my lead from him, I have to develop my own meal habits.

BritishFool wrote:Also, he asks me to bake all the time because he and my aunt (his sister) recently passed down to me the family recipes, and I'm not exactly a bad baker

You can say no. Or say "sure, I'll bake this weekend". You don't owe anyone sweets on demand.

Day 4 - yesterday
It ended up being a good day. I slept in really late because I didn't get to sleep until four o'clock (because I had so much sugar in my system from binging most likely), so I had a little yogurt and about five hours later I had dinner, and that was it.

I wouldn't get in too much of a habit of skipping meals. Let three be your maximum and your minimum, it really helps you get the habit quicker.

Day 5 - today
Horrible day.

Again, this is an S day, and in fact your first weekend. I really, really wouldn't get hung up on it at this early stage. Perhaps have a listen to Reinhard's podcast on "S days gone wild" - I got a lot out of it.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:00 pm

BritishFool wrote:I also think my parents are bad influences on the way I eat... My mom always nibbles, and nearly every every day she brings home chocolate of some kind. And my father literally has cookies or muffins for breakfast every day, then doesn't eat until he gets home from work... And when he does get home from work, he has a cocktail and two or three snacks before dinner. Then he has dinner (usually two helpings), and immediately--and I mean not even fifteen minutes later--he's snacking again, and snacks continually until he goes to bed, which is three or four hours later. Also, he asks me to bake all the time because he and my aunt (his sister) recently passed down to me the family recipes, and I'm not exactly a bad baker... It's so frustrating. I can feel myself exploding out of my jeans as I type this, and I'm disgusted with myself.

That's difficult, but much (most?) of our population eats that way, which is a large part of the reason we have a problem with obesity. Neither your parents nor any other person is responsible for what you choose to eat or when you choose to eat it. You alone are responsible for that. And you need to make better choices.

For now, concentrate on the N days and don't worry about S days. You cannot fail on an S day.

While you're eating a lot of higher calorie food, you're not getting a lot of nourishment. There are some who believe that much of our overeating is because our bodies are responding to the lack of nutrients in our diet. We keep eating because our bodies tell us that we need more nutrients.

Try adding more nutrient dense foods to your diet -- more vegetables, especially leafy greens, and fruits. The more color, the better.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:42 pm

Day 6 - S-day (but I still binged)

Tomorrow I see my doctor. The last I saw him was a month ago, and I was concerned that my weight had shot up from 117 to 129 as a result of binging. He wasn't too concerned, but since it's gotten WAY worse... Now, only a month later, I'm 148 pounds... I'm so disgusted of myself and afraid of what he will do and say.

As predicted, my mom will not attempt No S. I understand that it is her decision, but I have been asking her nearly every day since July to help me in some way and she won't. Not in the slightest. For example, I asked her not to bring home chocolate, and she still does, and then she'll yell at me when I ask again. I'm so afraid that I'm going to get diabetes it's not even funny.

The last time I talked to my doctor he suggested that I call a therapist. I called the one he recommended (the only one in my area) twice and both times left messages, and haven't received any reply. I think I need one not so much for my eating, but as some kind of outlet.

How do I bring up No S to my doctor?

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:35 am

First, tell you doctor that you've called and left messages with the therapist, but had no response. You might also ask if his office could make an initial appointment for you (sometimes doctors get a better response). Second, the worst thing your doctor is going to do is lecture you. He might suggest seeing a dietitian or nutritionist.

It's unfortunate that your mom won't join or help you. It could be that joining or helping you indicates to her that she has a problem with food that she's not ready to face and deal with. Plus, it points out that she's the one that taught you how to eat.

How to tell your doctor about No-S? Just tell him. Since it focuses on behavior rather than exactly what you eat, it should be ideal for you.

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 3:57 am

BritishFool wrote:Day 6 - S-day (but I still binged)

You can't fail on an S day. Put your focus and energy onto a successful Monday - Friday.

As predicted, my mom will not attempt No S. I understand that it is her decision, but I have been asking her nearly every day since July to help me in some way and she won't. Not in the slightest. For example, I asked her not to bring home chocolate, and she still does, and then she'll yell at me when I ask again.

The only person who knows I am on No-S is me. Support is great, but you can do this without it. Also, remember that with family and friends, your actions speak louder than words. So, you tell your mom "no, no more chocolate", but every time she brings some home you eat it. The message she gets is that you actually *do* want the chocolate, so she keeps offering. The only way I've found to change this is to politely and consistently turn down offers, until people get the message and stop offering. It takes a while.

We live in a pretty toxic food environment, that's what makes this challenging, especially to start off with. Some people have family members offering sweets, some have coworkers who always bring baking, others have a desk right near the vending machine. All you can do is manage your own behavior, keep on exercising your right to choose what goes into your body. You can do this!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 4:05 am

Thank you so much! That is pretty much how I lived when I was losing weight, long before No S, except I turned into such a tight-wad that when it was actually "acceptable" to eat sweets I couldn't do it... And when I finally had had enough, this is what happened. So I just need to establish a good relationship with food.

If tomorrow is a good day (which it will be!) how will I get through the second day? I usually struggle with the second day more than the first, I'm not sure why.

Also, would it or would it not be a good idea to bring up No S to my doctor tomorrow?

clarinetgal · Post by **clarinetgal** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:40 am

BritishFool, I do empathize with you. I still have about 35 pounds left to lose from my pregnancy last year, and it hasn't come off, because of my choices. For example, from Thanksgiving-today (Sunday), I've eaten so many sweets and rich foods that I feel sick and hung over every evening. I've exercised two of those days which has helped some, but I've got to nip this bad eating in the bud starting Monday morning. I don't have the best eating environment, either. I have a LOT of sweets around my house right now, and I need to make the choice to not eat them. Starting tomorrow, I will also go back to eating lighter foods (like lots of veggies, etc...) because I think that will also help me feel better.
I would go ahead and tell your doctor about No S. I don't see why he/she would have a problem with it, but if your doctor does, just explain how you're trying really hard to change your eating behaviors, and you think No S would be a good way to do it. If your doctor still doesn't like it, see if he/she has any other suggestions to help you change your eating behavior, and maybe you can combine it with No S.
Good luck tomorrow!

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:39 am

I'd tell the doctor about No-S, but I have a feeling the (s)he'll object for two reasons:
1. No Snacking
2. No defined eating plan (as in eat this, not that)

Having said that, most physicians have no training in diet and nutrition. Their knowledge is as informed by popular media as is that of most folks. Whatever dietary guru they like is the one they'll recommend. They are as influenced by the dietary science as anyone else, much of which is based on faulty science.

However, history and tradition is on your side with this. No-S, or some variation of it, is how people ate prior to the 1970s when overweight and obesity were rare. It's also the way the French, Italians and others who tend not to have problems with obesity eat. While their food choices might be different, the habits are very similar.

Blithe Morning · Post by **Blithe Morning** » Mon Nov 26, 2012 6:51 pm

You were 117lbs?

How tall are you?

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 3:53 am

5'5"

Day 7 - failure

I really don't know why I decided to eat. I was on my way to bed, and not hungry at all. And suddenly, another binge later, here I am...

Blithe Morning · Post by **Blithe Morning** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:30 am

I think I know why you are bingeing. 117 lbs is way down on the BMI. This may have been too low for you to maintain without a lot of calorie restriction.

The body does not forgive this easily.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 11:49 am

Blithe Morning wrote:I think I know why you are bingeing. 117 lbs is way down on the BMI. This may have been too low for you to maintain without a lot of calorie restriction.

The body does not forgive this easily.

I'm not sure about that. Admittedly, I pay absolutely no attention to BMI. But at 5'5", "ideal" weight is about 125, +/- about 12 pounds, depending on bone structure, etc.

I agree that the body isn't forgiving, but from a different viewpoint. Though BritishFool is eating a lot of food and consuming a lot of calories, there's not a lot of nutrition in what's consumed.

If I remember correctly, BritishFool wanted to lose weight eating the foods she's accustomed to eating. She didn't want to eat "healthy" because it would feel like being on a diet. However, I think that might be at least part of the answer to ending the bingeing.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:14 pm

Actually I'd say neither of you are correct. I eat very healthy at all of my meals and always have because, quite frankly, I just don't like "junk food" (except sweets)... It's just what happens when I eat and it's not mealtime--I hae no boundaries. My doctor also says that 117 was a good weight for me based on my bone structure, etc. And why does it matter now what I weighed several weeks ago? Now I weigh a wopping 150, which is way too much for someone my size, and it's appeared practically in the blink of an eye.

Keep in mind, I have successfully lost weight before, and this binge eating is part of a rebound to not eating sweets at all for about eight months.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 1:14 pm

BritishFool wrote:Actually I'd say neither of you are correct. I eat very healthy at all of my meals and always have because, quite frankly, I just don't like "junk food" (except sweets)... It's just what happens when I eat and it's not mealtime--I hae no boundaries. My doctor also says that 117 was a good weight for me based on my bone structure, etc. And why does it matter now what I weighed several weeks ago? Now I weigh a wopping 150, which is way too much for someone my size, and it's appeared practically in the blink of an eye.

Keep in mind, I have successfully lost weight before, and this binge eating is part of a rebound to not eating sweets at all for about eight months.

My comment was based on the meals you said you ate the other day. A bagel with cream cheese, soup and an apple, and a slice of pizza. The soup and apple are good (especially if the soup was homemade), the pizza is iffy, and bagels and cream cheese are about the equivalent of a doughnut or two. There's precious little protein, not many vegetables (don't know what was in the soup) and one fruit.

Maybe that was a rare day, but those aren't healthy meals.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 8:14 pm

It was indeed a rare day. The last time I had a bagel was in August, and I don't even remember the last time I had a slice of pizza. Like I said, which I was criticized for, it was a bad day.

Really, I'm not some idiot who believes that pizza and cream cheese are healthy. I appreciate the analysis, but it actually kind of... Hurt.

Anyways, so far today so good. I even got up early to exercise.

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 9:56 pm

BritishFool wrote:Like I said, which I was criticized for, it was a bad day.

In saying "you can't fail on an S day" I was never intending to criticize. I was trying to suggest that you go a bit easier on yourself. I'm sorry that got lost in translation. I realize that words on a screen don't have tone.

Anyways, so far today so good. I even got up early to exercise.

I'm really pleased to hear this - keep on going! Just focus on each day (or even each meal).

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Nov 27, 2012 10:48 pm

Haha ironchef--too true! Things definitely get lost in translation when you're on the web; I've definitely had my fair share of encounters with that!

I felt pretty good all day since I exercised. I think I'll exercise tomorrow too. (:

I need to keep reminding myself that this is a process, that it's not going to magically happen overnight. This bad cycle of mine is just a bad habit that I need to break, and I will gain more momentum with more green n-days. Soon enough I won't even have to think twice about No S. (:

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:55 am

Day 8 - Success!

Now if I can get two days in a row that would be great! I can do it! (:

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:30 am

Well done! Here's to a successful next day

You asked before how to get through the second day - just think of each day as building a habit, making it that tiny bit easier for you the next time!

Isn't it amazing how a bit of exercise can lift your mood? I find that even just a quick walk with the dog makes me happier and less likely to reach for snacks.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Thu Nov 29, 2012 3:42 am

Day 9 - Success! Weeeeeee! ^.^

I exercised again today--I had dance classes. I feel wonderful!

Here's to another great day tomorrow!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Nov 30, 2012 3:40 am

Day 10 - Another success! Three in a row!

I didn't exercise today because, quite frankly, I didn't have time. I was craving sweets toward the end of the evening, but it was much easier than it has been to use them aside and forget about them. (:

One more day until the weekend! Woohoo! I'm so proud of myself. (:

emmay · Post by **emmay** » Fri Nov 30, 2012 6:37 am

Well done! That's so great

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Fri Nov 30, 2012 7:13 am

That's brilliant - well done! What a great week

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Sat Dec 01, 2012 12:07 am

I was such a sweets binger before No S. Years before, I had tried to go days without sweets or even cutting down to ONLY 500 calories' worth of chocolate a day but with no success. Now I prefer my days without them. And three days off seems to be a short-term turning point.

No matter what, just keep "getting back on the horse," and by next year, you'll be "jumping fences."

heatherhikes · Post by **heatherhikes** » Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:27 am

oolala53 wrote:No matter what, just keep "getting back on the horse," and by next year, you'll be "jumping fences."

Well said Oolala

________
Heddi

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Dec 04, 2012 12:50 am

I agree. Thank you, oolala. (:

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Tue Dec 04, 2012 3:15 am

Day 13 - Success! ^.^

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:53 am

Yay! You are building your bank of successes.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:05 am

Yes! However, today wasn't the best day. ): My mom was making my favorite cookies and... Yeah.

Oh we'll, I guess. Onto the next day...

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:02 am

I guess I'll post some details about today.

I had a very good, filling breakfast: oatmeal with some nuts sprinkled on top. Kept me full until about five minutes before my lunch period, which was great.

Had a good lunch, although it was bigger than I'm used to. I had a ham and Swiss sandwich on wheat bread with an apple and a little baggy of mini pretzels.

I ended up staying at school an hour and a half longer than I had anticipated (working on AP Calc homework, weeeeee! Really though, I absolutely love calculus. I'm such a nerd.), so I got home at the time I would have been finishing my workout... So I decided to postpone my workout until after dinner, and had my usual 4:30 coffee and chat with my dad.

Dinner was good. I had a few rolls of sushi. It filled me up pretty good too.

After dinner I figured I should start on the mounds of homework I still had yet to begin, so I put off my workout again. Eventually I decided to take a shower, and when I came downstairs my mom was baking cookies (I had asked her to because my academic decathlon team had requested I make my delightful peppermint crunchies for our practice on Thursday, and when I bake I binge; she knew the situation), and for some reason I thought it would be a good idea to have one, and an entire binge later, here I am.

I made a mild effort to minimize it... At least I did something, I guess. I interrupted my crazy sweets load-up with an orange, and then again a little later with some popcorn. Also, I went to bed at the same time my mom did because it's ALWAYS the worst after my parents go to bed and I'm the only one up.

I've had this book since September now called Overcoming Binge Eating, and I really like it because it preaches the same principles as No S. The only reasons I haven't fully adapted its method are that 1.) it requires me to write down everything I eat, the time I eat, and where I eat (which I totally understand, but I've always been against strict monitoring like that and the last time I did it it didn't do anything for me) and 2.) it requires me to carry around a list of things to partake in when I feel the urge to eat when I'm not supposed to, and I'm afraid that I'll whip it out and people will see it. But at this point, after all this time, I think I really do have to dive in 100% because the things that are screwing me up could easily be prevented I just did those things... Thoughts?

Also, my mom recently bought me a pocket book called "Little Ways to Keep Calm and Carry On". It's pretty scary how much it applies to me because, first of all, I'm already obsessed with that phrase and the meaning that surrounds it, and the book is about overcoming anxiety (which I believe is one of the two biggest factors that contribute to my binge eating problems... For a little background on that, I'm an only child with two loving parents who work their butts off all the time so I can have a better future and many close acquaintances but no true friends who lives in a disturbingly rural community, and I constantly feel like if I'm not perfect I'm a failure... It kind of runs in the family). I don't really know why I'm posting this little tidbit. I guess I'm just hoping I'm moving in the right direction.

Also, I bought a dress a little over a week ago to wear at my band concert tomorrow. I just tried it on and it doesn't fit me anymore, just to demonstrate just how distressing this situation really is. So now I have to find something else to wear, in less than 24 hours, because I haven't yet stopped shoving food down my throat on a practically daily basis. ):

On the bright side, the three weeks prior to last week all had the same record: 5 bad days and 2 good days (binge wise), but last week I got it to 4 bad days and 3 good days, which I haven't seen since the end of October. So I guess I'm getting somewhere. Slowly but surely. (:

As yet another side note, I've been trying to drink the standard eight glasses of water a day, and the last two days I have gotten to six. Do you think the other two glasses may help me out at all?

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:30 am

Regarding the water, my opinion is no. Another reason I love Reinhard: he's not a water pusher. I got no details on this.

Telling yourself you can have just one sweet on an N day is the "crack" talking. Just accept this for the next 6 months. Or year. In fact, all random eating on N days is a ruse. It is the old brain pattern- the food OCD-er- defending, rationalizing. It will say ANYTHING. Until you have given your body many, many routine experiences of being fed meals on N days, regard all thoughts to eat randomly as the song of the Sirens. You know the Sirens from the Greek myth, right? It's really just simpler to just say no, especially since they're all LYING. There is no good reason to eat between good meals. Even though I've mixed my metaphors shamefully.

Since you asked for honest opinions on Overcoming Binge Eating (I've read it and tons of books on BED and many anti-diet books) Commit to No S for eating for 6 months, and look for other specific means to handle your anxiety as its own issue. I know it's popular to link the two, but see if you can resist the urge to justify eating with mental explanations. You eat because you put food in your mouth, chew it, and swallow it. Do this at mealtimes and don't be chintzy. No one starves eating three meals a day, so you can go without food at all other times. The stimulus is irrelevant. It doesn't come from a real need for food, so it can be ignored. It's possible you may spend the time you are not eating working on other problems in your life or just finding pleasurable activities that are also health- and life-affirming. Regard eating as a non-option.

If you have actually been diagnosed with anxiety, get help. People with real anxiety have differences in their brains that can be managed. A good book I read this summer on it was The anxious brain : the neurobiological basis of anxiety disorders and how to effectively treat them / Margaret Wehrenberg, Steven Prinz. I don't think it went long enough on the re-thinking strategies but it was an eye-opener for me. I wish I had read it years ago. Meds, consistent exercise, progressive relaxation, ACT, DBT,(neither of those from the book, but from other helpful ones) a spiritual life, etc. You said you live in a rural place? No access to local counseling? There must be Skype counseling these days. Or a campus facility?

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:10 am

Day 15 - Success.

I took not of all the moments I got the urge to go off track. There were quite a few more than I thought!

Thank you so much oolala for all of your wisdom--it's much appreciated!

Here's to another successful day tomorrow. (:

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:27 am

Well done BritishFool!

You said it yourself, your percentage of green days is improving

simmstone · Post by **simmstone** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 4:39 pm

BritishFool,

You are wise to listen to oolala53 - she is a wonderful, experienced voice for those of us who struggle, specifically, with Binge Eating. Her words come from a good place, always include a hefty dose of reality, and drip with experience. I, as a fellow eater who struggles with binges, view her as a big success and inspiration.

Though I still fight the battle of the binge daily and do not consider myself an example of someone who has beaten it yet, I do have one additional experience-based offering of something that tends to work for me:
When you 'fail' on your chosen normal eating plan (No S), figure out WHY you failed, treat yourself lovingly, and try to use the information to 'fail forward'.

Much of the literature tells us that binge eaters tend to be perfectionists - we are either 'on plan' or 'off plan'.... and any straying from our eating plan is usually accompanied by self-talk that says we are worthless, weak, incapable, and destined to repeat ourselves because we are incapable of perfection. When these times occur, I have found it really helpful to try and work past this initial perfectionist voice and treat failure unemotionally and inquisitively for a moment. For instance, when you or I see our mom baking cookies and choose to have one, why does it invariably lead to a binge? No S is a helpful structure, but if we fail and have an S, what drives the need for us to have SO MANY S items?

I have done the same thing you did in the 'mom baking cookies' scenario MANY times... and, recently, after my first year following No S, I started trying to figure out what I wanted to accomplish with the first bite/item of a slip up (because every bite/item after that first one is usually just a manifestation of me punishing myself for not getting what I really wanted from the first bite). Did seeing your mom baking cookies seem comforting/nostalgic? Did you want to participate in that comfort? Did partaking in them serve as a way for you to share something with her? Was it simply the excitement of the taste of a sweet treat? A means to procrastinate? Something else? Asking myself questions like these - either when the urge to binge arises or after a binge - has been helpful for me in reducing my binges. As a result of asking them over and over, I have learned that my slip-ups often escalate into binges when I (1) feel the need to rebel against a self-imposed eating plan, (2) have over-deprived myself, or (3) stubbornly keep trying to use food to do something it cannot do.

No S has been a WONDERFUL plan for me in attacking the first two causes of my binge eating - it is quite 'gentle' and offers great potential for individual variation, so the need to rebel against it/feeling deprived on it has diminished for me over the last year. But, No S has not, on its own, killed my desire to 'use' food, though it has certainly made me aware of WHEN I am using it. It is just a plan to reintroduce you to sane eating, but it cannot tell you WHY you slip when you do. So, after a year spent committing to the structure of HOW to eat normally (which was necessary for me, as attacking the HOW and the WHY at the same time is a lot to ask of anyone) , I have realized that it is also important for me to, as often as it is possible, figure out WHY the desire arises when I slip/or want to slip.

Sometimes, I just want a treat, or the occasion calls for a treat. These times are rare and, I have learned over the past year, are not the problem - I view them as 'acceptable slip ups'. A fresh baked cookie offered by your mom is a normal, wonderful item/moment that, though not part of the No S structure is, to me, an acceptable 'slip up'. You may still mark the day as a red one, but only in the context of 'perfectly' following the No S structure. I would venture to say that any binge eater would regard a 'slip up' like that (one cookie) as a success, relative to the normal quantity consumed on our binges.

And here's where the distinction comes in for me: A fresh baked, homemade cookie is just a cookie... and here is what it CAN be - a delicious treat. But a TRAY of cookies eaten after everyone is in bed is not a treat... it is an attempt to turn a treat into something it CANNOT be (comfort, love, escape, acceptance, rebellion, freedom, etc). Continually reminding myself of this over and over and over has really reduced my binge incidents (though it has not eliminated them, yet). In my experience, binges escalate to their WORST out of frustration that each bite I am taking is not accomplishing what I want it to until the feeling of fullness/guilt/relief replaces the original feeling I was looking to satiate. Realizing this over and over and over hasn't killed my urge to have one cookie, but I find myself eating the 3rd, 4th, or 12th cookie MUCH less often than I used to...

Stick to No S and aim at success each day. Avoid "Day 1" re-starts... they only give you the illusion that, this time, you can be perfect... and the perfectionist in you will punish you if you do misstep after proclaiming you will be perfect this time, and then you wind up binge eating again until the next 'Day 1'. Realize that failures are a part of the journey for binge eaters - that doesn't mean you shouldn't develop strategies, as oolala53 suggested, to use every possible means to avoid them, but, if they do occur, they need not lead to re-starts, or complete tailspins - a slip up and a binge are NOT the same thing.

Binges, I truly believe, can be overcome. And, for me, finding the plan for HOW to eat normally (No S) AND investigating the WHY I want to deviate from that plan (emotional investigation of Binge incidents) has been a helpful combination in the battle against the binge.

God bless you, and all of us, on the journey to a binge-free life!

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:23 am

Thanks for the lovely words!

Looking back at my post, I was surprised I sounded as hard-nosed as I did. I made it seem you just decide not to fail and it shall be so. Ha!

Learning to regard failures as opportunities to learn, not mourn, is also extremely beneficial! I think most of us here would say that learning to 1) NOT go overboard after small fails, and 2) become benignly curious after small and big fails are skills that are pure gold, here and elsewhere.

Off to dinner.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Dec 07, 2012 4:36 am

Simmstone - Thank you so much. I have indeed been pinpointing why, and I continue to. I think it's very helpful in the grand scheme of recovery. The binge eating started up around the time I started working the hardest I've ever worked in my life, in July. I thought it was just me getting off the diet wagon, but in late-ish October it occurred to me that the vast majority of the binge eating was stress-driven. I was, and still am, using food as a distraction. I'm particularly concerned about this next week (I'd rather not discuss, but for reference purposes I'll mention that it's the result of all the work I have done). My doctor knows what's up in the stress department of my life, and he believes that regardless of this next week's turnout I will find myself with a huge weight off my shoulders and much more capable of overcoming this ridiculous disorder.

I'm such a perfectionist it's not even funny. For as long as I can remember I've been one. For instance, when I write my name on the heading of a paper, if it is not flawless I erase it and do it over and over until it is--it's a habit of mine. Today I was determined to have a "perfect" day, but my academic decathlon coach's husband made me brownies because I had baked him cookies, so obviously I couldn't be rude and say no, so I had one and that one brownie turned into a binge of everything in my house when I got home. All because my day's perfection was given up for a brownie...

I love participating in comforting experience, as most people do. I just don't understand why that always has to turn into something totally uncomfortable, like a binge. Why can't I just have ONE COOKIE, feel the nostalgia, and move on with my day?

Today after I had the brownie... I got that feeling like, "Oh wow, that brownie was good, I haven't had one in a long time... time to eat everything in sight," if you know what I'm talking about. It disgusts me. Why can't I eat normally like EVERYONE ELSE? Also, today my friend and I were talking about how skinny I was at the prom last year (I had ordered my dress in a twelve and they had to alter it to a two because I had lost so much weight), and she was saying how scared she was about my health (yeah, I was disgustingly skinny)... but now I'm overweight again... Wtfffff.

Yeah, so... Good day tomorrow? I hope so. When I get home I'm working out. And usually when I work out I have good days...

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:36 am

You think everyone else eats normally?

This has been discussed on the board other places, but it's hard to find, so I'll repeat. Researchers have found that it is the NORM for those attempting to diet or change eating habits to way overeat as soon as they have slipped even a little bit. It's called the What the Hell reaction. Yes, really. You may have seen it here: WTH. It's totally against what anyone would think is logical but it is the default. I think we have a better chance of confronting it on No s and learning to get over it because this is one of the sanest boards I've seen and we have fewer restrictions. That being said, I overate on S days for literally years. N days saved me. And time.

And I think you have to be convinced that your eating plan is fair. If you don't think it's fair, you will keep rebelling.

You're normal. And you just have to bite the bullet (instead of the extra brownie) and at some point NOT keep eating when you make a mistake. That's what it pretty much boils down to. You do it once, and then a few more times, and eventually, it becomes more common not to WTH than it is to do it. But for most of us, there is will involved. It doesn't just go away on its own. But you are bigger than it. You just don't know it yet.

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:21 am

Wise words again, oolala. (:

Even though today is red on both my No S and No Binge HabitCals, I feel pretty good. I was able to stop what would have been an all-out binge in its tracks. The reason I marked it a red on the No Binge cal is that I had a brief moment of "must eat food now", which is irrational thinking, and that caused me to have some coffee cake and M&Ms. Actually, I think I might use the yellow on my No Binge cal to mark mediocre days...

Here's to the weekend!

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Sat Dec 08, 2012 11:50 am

That was such an insightful post oolala, I've never really thought about it, but really, who does eat "normally"?
A bit like asking who has a "normal" family...

Well done again BritishFool - glad to hear you sounding so positive and moving in the right direction.
Have a great weekend!

BritishFool · Post by **BritishFool** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:07 am

Hello again everyone!

It's been crazy in my world the past week...

Last Wednesday I found out the exact date and time I would learn of my dream college's decision on my application, so since then I've been the most on-edge and stressed out I've been in my whole life...

So this week: Monday was good. Tuesday (the day before d-day) was horrible... Stress eating to the max. Wednesday (d-day) I was barely hungry at all all day because I was so nervous, but at 6pm I was officially accepted to Duke University!!! ^.^ So Wednesday turned into an S-Day as my family and I celebrated, and that led to a shameful binge at home in private. ): Today I didn't have much of a real dinner and I had to bake for my academic decathlon bake sale on Saturday so that, of course led to another binge. Sigh.

Tomorrow I'm going to the mall and out to dinner with an old friend of mine, so it's a potentially hazardous day... Any tips at all for this week? I really want to feel happy about my accomplishment but it's so hard when I feel so crappy about my eating...

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:46 pm

First of all, props on being accepted at Duke! I had a lot of social fun at college, but I still remember the excitement of the intellectual openings as well. So much ahead of you!

Actually, there are no new tips. Accept that No S is the best eating deal out there. Go back and re-read everything in this thread, IF you want still more...

With regard to eating, it is going to help you SO MUCH to have the habits pretty solid before you go. You do NOT have to do all the crazy eating that college kids do to have a good time. Realize that now is the time to get this down no matter what life throws at you.

I'll concentrate on the thinking because that's what supports me to make any outer changes.

I'm in the camp of not feeling crappy about your eating, but definitely on concentrating on how crappy you felt physically when you ate all that food. Get that very, very clear because you need to summon it when the chance to overeat comes up, and it will. You've been using overeating as celebration, stress reducer, etc. etc. etc. IF you ciommit to NO S, you can cut all the ties. You can be stressed and eat your three meals. You can celebrate with meals and dessert if it an S day or one of your two NWS days per month, but not snacks. Enjoy your meal, you're done. No eating until the next one. Keep reminding yourself that you ate awhile ago and will again later. Just get through those hours. You'll come to PREFER it.

You've made overeating an automatic habit (as do many, and not even all heavy) and it is likely to take you awhile to make moderate eating at relatively routine times a habit, too. Using NO S, you'll be following the smart habits of millions of people, even if they don't live in the U.S, so you are not a weirdo

Try to stop thinking that there are any really good reasons not to stick to your meal plan. Not being worried, not being happy, not anything. You eat and love your food when it's mealtime, and the rest of the time, you just don't need it. You find other things that calm you or entertain you. You ate before and you will again. Food is in its place. It's a fun way to live, really!

ironchef · Post by **ironchef** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:45 pm

Congratulations on your acceptance, that's great news.

oolala is spot on - this is not the last time in your life you'll be stressed, celebrating, etc, and you can have those feelings without needing to step away from No-S structure.

BritishFool wrote:Tomorrow I'm going to the mall and out to dinner with an old friend of mine, so it's a potentially hazardous day...

When at social occasions (dinner with a friend etc) it really helps me to think about why I'm there. If you are out to dinner to see a friend, concentrate on that, and let your eating just be that one plate (unless it's an S day). You'll still enjoy seeing your friend, and have all the laughs and conversation, which is the point of the occasion anyway. Yesterday some old friends came by to meet the baby, and my sister brought a lemon tart. The fact that I didn't have a piece of lemon tart made *no difference* to the fun of our morning tea - I still played with the baby, laughed, enjoyed the sunshine in the garden. No-S has made me realize I don't need to overeat in order to be sociable or enjoy myself.

You've accomplished a huge milestone, enjoy yourself this week!