OK, so I'm sort of a traitor

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Thu Jul 18, 2013 8:46 pm

Yeah, that fitness plan that my daughter is so successful at... I signed up for it. It was a battle with myself, down to the last minute (deadline being Tuesday). So my plan is this. I still do need the framework to keep me accountable for exercise and food choices. Those two things are what my downfall *really* is. Turns out they don't make snacks mandatory, and there is private coaching, so I'm going to do both, this program and No S. I'm finding that I'm still stuffing myself with crap for meals, and I'm not feeling well *at all*, probably because of that. Remember I said how hungry I was when I started? Well, I've made up for it that's for sure. So in the last couple weeks, even though I'd thought I was going to try IE, since I did it on Independence Day and on the weekend, I don't know, have just felt like crap, dull hunger headaches or whatever, etc. So I thought I'd augment No S with other stuff I really need to pay attention to. The accountability with that program is pretty stringent, and with the way my life is going right now I need it.

End of confession!

Jammin' Jan · Post by **Jammin' Jan** » Thu Jul 18, 2013 10:15 pm

I wish you all success! Please keep us posted on how it goes for you.

jw · Post by jw » Thu Jul 18, 2013 11:23 pm

No-S combines with so many other approaches, Christine -- keep trying until you find what is right for you! And do keep us posted!

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Fri Jul 19, 2013 11:32 am

Hey y'all, thanks for the encouragement. I truly do believe in No S, really. I am tired of pouring myself into my pants. Having been a career yo-yo-er, when I lost all the weight "for once and for all", five years ago, I vowed that I would NEVER buy a bigger size again to accommodate my lack of discipline. Well... I started a new job a week ago Monday and yep, that's what I did... two sizes bigger to be exact... because I was so uncomfortable in my original pants. OK, it was only four pairs, but still. I have actually done so well on No S; it's so much of a no-brainer to me, that it's sort of too easy. I have a lot of conflicting feelings about this. I'm a breast cancer survivor, and the thought of "any" kind of weight gain frightens me, because of the link they say fat has with breast cancer. I'm dealing with the prospect of "never" being able to retire so I need to keep myself as healthy as possible. (I'm 62) I know the concept of "good enough" pretty much IS good enough, but there's still this nagging feeling, egging me on. And hopefully, my participation in this will somehow encourage my husband, bless his heart, to give up or at least cut down on his bad habits too.

Yeah I know. Who am I trying to convince, you or me? Aahh, just had to vent that's all.

BrightAngel · Post by **BrightAngel** » Fri Jul 19, 2013 1:56 pm

Reinhard has always been very supportive of people
who choose to combine No S with other diet plans,
both in his Book and on the Forum.

One of the most positive things about the No S Diet,
is how easily it can be modified individually,
including combining it with other diet plans.

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:02 pm

Yes, that's why I thought I could try this fitness program and fit it into No S. I just read yesterday, a post from a No S-er whose trainer wanted her to eat six meals per day, and she refused. Well, I can do that too. I just need some extra motivation, and, shall we say, paid-for accountability; i.e. now that I'm paying for this I need to get my money's worth. I still have mixed feelings, but I will give it my best shot and I think I will feel better playing student. I know what is healthy to eat, and I know how much to eat. I just need a BIG kick in the butt. By the way, if anyone's heard about this, it's called Precision Nutrition.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Sat Jul 20, 2013 5:15 pm

Can't you just use it for the exercise part? As you say, you already have an idea of what to be eating. but maybe you feel you need someone else to tell you to actually eat it? Maybe that will work long enough for you to be reminded of what it feels like to be eating well, and that can tip the balance in the long run.

Good luck.

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:23 pm

Yes, that's a big part of why I signed up, the exercise part. LOL, I probably do need someone else to tell me to actually eat it... I'm such a stubborn person. I fall back into my old bad habits so easily, it's not even funny. In fact it's pretty shameful. I really gotta wonder if I do want to fix myself up, since I'm usually so resistant to it. My whole adult life has been: every once in a while, get on this diet/exercise kick, do really well for a short period of time, then get bored with it and fall off the wagon. Then I gain back the weight and a little more, until I get disgusted again, and yo-yo again. I guess I'm just holding out hope for this; I've never paid for a trainer or dietitian or anything like that. The average for these six weeks is no weight loss at all; Yeah, I know, it takes a long time with No S, but I'm soooo sick of being so uncomfortable in my too-small clothes! And there's a personal aspect to this; if someone can talk me out of this successfully, that would be great. As in, I'm such a failure if I can't even lose weight and keep it off. If I'm not slim and fit I don't feel like I'm good for anything much. Yep, it sounds pretty ridiculous as I type it, but that's the way I feel, even after all these years. (even though I know I'm pretty good at other stuff!)

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Sun Jul 21, 2013 8:54 pm

I hope you can get over that. I'm a little skeptical that a trainer will help you get over feeling like a failure if you can't lose weight. Little bit of conflict of interest.

I sent the rest of my response to your personally as it's a bit of a rant against the thin machine.

But I'm big on eating and exercising for a sense of vitality and zip! You might get a lot smaller aiming for those.

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:52 pm

Ha, I never thought of the trainer/conflict of interest point of view! Well, I've been busy the last few days, including a couple of days of mandated exercise from the PN program, when all I really rather would have done was come home from work, have a couple beers, and veg out. I don't know why I'm constantly fighting with myself. But I do know, I can't eat sanely, even on No S; I started out losing a few pounds but I was hungry all the time. Now that I've upped my intake (still sticking to No S), I'm back where I started. Sometimes I feel that unless I'm conflicted and angry and depressed and obnoxious, I'm not alive.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Wed Jul 24, 2013 3:48 am

Sounds tough. Hope something shakes out for you soon.

finallyfull · Post by **finallyfull** » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:31 pm

Christine you are too hard on yourself! Everyone likes to come home and relax. I doubt you "need" to feel those negative feelings to feel alive. I think you are just tired of trying so hard on diets, and, as oolala aptly notes, the "thin machine" takes its toll.

I think you may have "scale sickness." It's a mental disease caused by the delusion that some random number defines who we are. No S is healthy and sane and lovely, but it requires you to have enough food on your plate at each meal. Otherwise (in my opinion, not looking to provoke anyone who has a different opinion) it is a diet, and diets make people crazy and sad.

Throw the dang scale out, eat three meals a day, and come rejoin the peace train Christine. You are a keeper, not a traitor.

SuperMysteryCat · Post by **SuperMysteryCat** » Wed Jul 24, 2013 3:23 pm

Oh, lord, sister friend! This just breaks my heart. We've all been there. I was especially pained by the phrase "mandatory exercise." That sounds awful. Please, be kinder to yourself.

I think you need to focus on your stress. Stress hormones increase appetite and fat storage, so I don't think you're doing yourself any favors by making yourself feel worse with this new draconian plan.

I've never seen a fitness plan that inspires nothing but dread help anyone, including me. I think being active is great (I'm an urban ranger!), but only when it's either fun or relaxing. I love listening to an audiobook on a nice, long walk, but I would rather die than go to the gym and "feel the burn" ever again. Yuck. In other words, I think you should stop beating yourself up for not wanting to do what no one wants to do!

la_loser · Post by **la_loser** » Wed Jul 24, 2013 4:11 pm

Oh my goodness. . . bless your heart. I will ditto what FinallyFull said:

Throw the dang scale out, eat three meals a day, and come rejoin the peace train Christine. You are a keeper, not a traitor.

You are beautiful and smart and committed (no, I didn't say you need to BE committed!

) and seem to be able to focus on a goal really well--who else could have stood to rely on Medifast for so many years!? Not me, for sure. I can stay on one of those diets for about . . . uh, till the next meal time comes around!

I know you said your pic is a year old, but believe me, you're a really young 62! You're carrying a lot on your shoulders right now but you CAN do it. . . and when the going gets tough, hop on here and shout out to us!

Finally, a couple of quotes from other members way back when. . . I went back and found them on the thread I started with No S Catch Phrase Glossary.

"If hunger is not the problem, food is not the answer." (resting52)

and

"If you start to slip, tie a knot and hang on!" (Mimi)

By the way, any of you who are relatively new to No S might want to take a few minutes to browse through that thread-lots of great inspirational tidbits.

Meanwhile, Christine--you need to tie a knot and hang on!

jw · Post by jw » Wed Jul 24, 2013 5:58 pm

Oh Christine -- so much wisdom on this thread! I hope you can make your stubbornness work for you! not with more discipline (that will only make you want to rebel eventually), but by cultivating a sense of fabulously stubborn entitlement --

You deserve to do what makes you happy. The world is full of delightful food that you really are allowed to eat three times a day, enjoyable activities that take you outdoors and keep you fit whenever you want, and beautiful clothes in whatever size you happen to be. It's your right to enjoy all of it! No S provides a structure where pleasure is allowed -- so have a beer! And then have another one tomorrow. And then go dancing --

I just get such a strong sense that the last thing you need is more discipline!

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Wed Jul 24, 2013 11:37 pm

Ahh - ha, you ladies are being so nice. I wish I could reciprocate... I'm so grateful for everything you're saying. Ya know, I sometimes think that I'm just in the middle of this "last chance on the stairway" before I just give up. I do need to get through this initial panic with signing up for this program and just follow their directions, and not think about it. But even though I ate a real crappy dinner tonight, it was still compliant with No S. Even though I felt like cheating in the worst way, I didn't. oolala said something about, why can't you just use it for the exercise part? Well, yes, I think I can do that... in fact they don't even start counseling you on the nutrition part until after the first eight weeks. I do trust the program. I'm just feeling overwhelmed with starting it, and other stuff in my life that I have to deal with, but it's like getting in shape is sort of the only thing I have to look forward to right now. Aahh, sorry. Again, it will take time but I think I can get back on an even keel, somehow. Love y'all!

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 3:52 am

That's 8 weeks of more chances to let N days help moderate your appetite.

I hope you can find a way to magnify your successes. You stuck to one plate and didn't cheat when you really wanted to. This is progress!

How many uncrappy meals of your 15 N day meals a week do you think you're supposed to eat? All 15? How many do you eat now? Could you improve that by 3 meals each week for at least 3 weeks? I have a feeling you're letting yourself be disappointed in yourself for not eating "healthy" meals ALL the time, when it's not actually reasonable to expect that. This is a weaning process, not surgery.

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:55 pm

oolala53 wrote:That's 8 weeks of more chances to let N days help moderate your appetite. ... I hope you can find a way to magnify your successes. You stuck to one plate and didn't cheat when you really wanted to. This is progress!

Yes, and I intend to stick to No S at least for the 8 weeks. Actually I usually don't eat stuff like last night during the week (chicken tenders & Stacy's pita chips + dip). So, for me that was kind of an aberration. But a pasta meal for me now is still a "guilty" pleasure, having been used to eating plain meat & veg for dinner for years as prescribed by Medifast. Such as the one I had tonight, chicken fettucine alfredo, with some tomatoes on the side with olive oil & basil on top. Yum!

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:01 am

If you don't let yourself eat chicken tenders on N days, you are setting yourself up for even more overeating on S days, I think. It's more likely you'll go wild on everything! And it's very diet head-y.

And how did that plain meat and veg eating work out for you? No wonder Medifast long term recidivism rates are so high.

You may actually find that after a year or so of No S, you have some meals of plain meat and veg and find them satisfying! But that won't likely happen in 8 weeks.

I actually eat a fair amount of take out and convenience foods. But when I buy a meal, the entree and starch parts often last me for three meals in total. Last night, I got Chinese food at one of those 2 entrees for $5.99 places. They let me have veggies instead of rice or noodles. I had enough of a meat choice for that meal, lunch today, and even another serving of meat left. But I did eat all the veggies.

Take the long view.

la_loser · Post by **la_loser** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 2:29 am

chicken fettucine alfredo, with some tomatoes on the side with olive oil & basil on top. Yum!

Now, that sounds like a good one plate meal! See, you CAN do this!

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:34 am

Well, the chicken tenders were four big pieces, so... anyway, yeah, I know, that's what was happening to me at first with No S. I was eating "diet-size" three meals, and was hungry all the time!

Yep, as far as Medifast, like I said I was shocked to see how often I'd been eating Medifast for the past few years just to keep the weight down. You can't keep doing that forever. I need real food! They do have a maintenance program and the assumption is that if you wean yourself off of Medifast gradually, you will keep the weight off. I couldn't go through their maintenance program; by the time I'd lost the weight I didn't want to look at another Medifast meal. But I kept on going back to it, feeling that it was my "failsafe" weight-loss tool. Again though, you can't/shouldn't do that forever.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:12 pm

I don't think the chicken tenders sound like that bad a meal. Maybe not the greatest, but not bad.

I've refrained from adding to this thread, mostly because I didn't feel that I had much to add to it. But as I've read through, it seems to me you have a bad case of "diet head" and maybe unrealistic goals.

I think we all know exactly what we need to do. It's just that we want to continue what we've been doing and get different results. I also think that something like No-S is it.

oolala53 · Post by **oolala53** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 1:30 pm

When I buy those meals and bring them home, I usually add at least some raw or cooked veg. I keep fresh and frozen veggies, so it's pretty fast. It started with just a serving, but now it's usually 2-3. It's a process. This time 4 chicken tenders, next time 3, and a handful of lettuce or some pea pods, etc. I serve myself and put the leftovers away before I start eating. I take bites of the prepared food with the veg so I don't add any more salt or dressing.

There's got to be a middle ground between a plate of dense processed food and a plate of celery sticks. This is the journey to experiment to figure out what balance will bring you satisfaction in the moment and hours later. It sounds like the pendulum is still swinging, but at least it's not locked on one side.

Christine · Post by **Christine** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 2:32 pm

Yes, wosnes, that I do! ...have a bad case of diet-head. Although I am seriously trying to work through that.

Which leads me to your comment oolala, that is sort of what I'd tried to do last night with the chicken fettucine alfredo. I took about 2/3 as much as I would have before, and added a bunch of small tomatoes with some olive oil & basil. The plate was about half & half. And I was just as satisfied. There's hope for this kid yet!

Seriously though, just wanted to say that I'm very sorry for being such a drama queen lately...

finallyfull · Post by **finallyfull** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 4:44 pm

Wosnes said "I think we all know exactly what we need to do. It's just that we want to continue what we've been doing and get different results."

This is so true! I have to regularly fight not to turn this into a diet, because I KNOW if I do that I will fool myself into thinking I'll get different results, which of course, I will not. I still catch myself heading into denial and trying to sneak onto a diet.

I want the No S results: being a moderate eater, which includes thoroughly, fully and without a twinge of guilt enjoying my deserved treats and holidays, and letting my body decide what size that turns me into. That is my whole "goal" -- I am AT my goal today, right this minute. If I stay at this goal, my body will be the size it is supposed to be. (For me, any other plan will maybe get me to some other "goal", but I am convinced, from overwhelming science, that they will steal my enjoyment of food, give me diet head, and ironically fatten me up.)

Diets are an extremely convincing mirage that disappears when you get there.

Kittykat150 · Post by **Kittykat150** » Fri Jul 26, 2013 7:00 pm

finallyfull wrote:Wosnes said "I think we all know exactly what we need to do. It's just that we want to continue what we've been doing and get different results"

Finallyfull:"Diets are an extremely convincing mirage that disappears when you get there.

Love these two comments. True, true, true!!
Kat

Everyday Systems

OK, so I'm sort of a traitor

OK, so I'm sort of a traitor

Tie a knot!

Yum, indeed!

Both quotes so true