Thinking of dropping an S rule! (No sweets)

No Snacks, no sweets, no seconds. Except on Days that start with S. Too simple for you? Simple is why it works. Look here for questions, introductions, support, success stories.

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alicerabbit
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Thinking of dropping an S rule! (No sweets)

Post by alicerabbit » Tue Jun 10, 2014 1:02 am

I am having a compliance problem! I've gotten into a bad habit of having an extra s day every week (a fail day). Every time Monday comes around I think 'oh no, 5 'n' days in a row coming up! How will I survive'. Pretty pathetic, I know.
The snacking isn't really a problem, I enjoy eating at meal times now. Eating a regular plate sized meal is also easy enough (even if I don't use one physical plate). I think my problem is the 'no sweets' rule. I don't think its good to allow yourself sweets everyday, but if I can't comply with vanilla, maybe I should do something.
I would take away the 'no sweets' rule making it just 'no snacks, no seconds'. I would do this by leaving room on my dinner plate for a dessert. I don't usually eat on one physical plate anyway and I have become good with eying meal sizes (or virtual plating).
This makes it a bit inconvenient for eating dessert but still an option.
I am hoping by just knowing I am allowed sweets will be enough,. And I won't need to actually have a dessert each day.

I know including dessert (on my virtual plate) will probably mean I am eating more calories. ..

Baby steps.

What do you think? I'd appreciate any advice.
One step back, two steps forward!:)

wosnes
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Post by wosnes » Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:56 am

Well I do the same thing, but for different reasons. I allow one sweet daily, but usually don't have it.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

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noni
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Post by noni » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:33 pm

Every now and then I tweak Vanilla No S. It normally involves a treat or dessert after lunch and/or dinner. It starts out slowly and balloons (no pun intended). I then go back to vanilla and things work out fine again. Altho' I gain pounds in the process, I also gain some wisdom about myself. I probably will keep trying to tweak sweets to see what works, because that's just the way I am and I have to live with that.

But what doesn't work for me doesn't mean it won't work for you. Wosnes is a good example. You can experiment with scrutiny, realizing there may be that possibility of returning to Vanilla if that particular tweak fails you.

finallyfull
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Post by finallyfull » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:38 pm

I think experimenting (occasionally!) after really giving vanilla a good long try is a great idea. There is so much experimenting on these boards. I have tried various mods, and some were good for short periods of time. Sometimes you "train" yourself and need different things at different times.

Maybe you can do a "2 S" for a few weeks or months and see how it goes. See what you learn from it? Learning is good, and it's the journey, not the destination, anyway.

uschi
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mini sweet?

Post by uschi » Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:14 am

My dessert/sweets conditioning is so strong I haven't yet made it go away entirely for No-S days, but I have cut it down to size. A Dove or similar sized individual chocolate, a hard candy, a tiny portion of ice cream, or other tiny portion satisfy the "need". It's kind of ridiculous that I can't just do without, but ironically, in KNOWING that I "MAY" have it, I do actually go without more and more often.

Other mod is that husband and I often delay dessert when we do have it on S days-- "I'm full now, maybe later"-- and more often than not, we forget about it. Yes, if I baked a pie or cake, it's the elephant in the room, and it will be eaten... but with the more casual weekend schedules, it's more likely to get pushed into the next meal or even replace a meal later on. Unless the teenagers polish it off first of course. :)

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Thu Jun 12, 2014 8:31 pm

Depends on how long you were green on No S before making this mod. And also, if it "works" or not. If having a little dessert on Monday keeps you green T-F, and you aren't an idiot on weekends, then it's likely working for now. Ideally, you'd get to the point at which you can take or leave sweets almost any day of the week. If you feel you are moving towards that, mazel tov!
Count plates, not calories. Three a day. 9 years & counting
Age 65
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
Jan/12-26.8
Mar/13-24.9 Stayed at +/- 8-lb. for three years Sept/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
Mar/18 22.2

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

ksbrowne
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Post by ksbrowne » Fri Jun 13, 2014 9:41 pm

I think it sounds like a sensible plan. Your taste buds will eventually adjust to fewer sweets and, in time, you probably won't even want the little dessert after supper.

I do real well with no seconds and no snacks, but I love a few bites of something sweet after dinner. Lately I'm satisfied with less and less. I'm down to just a couple of bites of sherbert now.

It will add a few extra calories each day, but you can make up for that by not going crazy on S-days.

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bonnieUK
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Post by bonnieUK » Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:25 pm

I've had issues in the past with "needing" something sweet after lunch in order to avoid an afternoon slump, but I overcame it by ditching the "no snack" thing instead, I just find that I can manage my energy better eating more frequently and feel less need for sweet things. That said, a small glass of apple juice as a "dessert" after lunch seems good for my energy levels. My usual modified No S is to eat about 4-5 times a day, whereas most people I think stick to 3. but I'm pregnant at the moment so am just perma-snacking these days :D

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bonnieUK
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Post by bonnieUK » Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:33 pm

Another thought, a friend recently showed me a healthy menu that is offered to her kids at school, the lunch meal (real food, no chicken nuggets and french fries!) always comes with a simple dessert like home cooked pudding and custard or fruit salad. It seems that traditionally (here in England anyway), a small dessert with a meal is considered normal - I grew up eating like that, and back then (early 80s) childhood obesity was rare and only started becoming an issue when fast food restaurants sprouted up everywhere, at least that is how I remember it. Maybe it is something that can be added if you're not eating too much food generally?

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Fri Jun 20, 2014 1:56 pm

You can add or subtract anything you want. It's just not Vanilla. Also, what children do and what adults do are often different in slim cultures. And some things are easier to do when the whole culture is doing it and when there is no history of overdoing it. Children in France have a dessert at lunch much like the ones you describe, but they can't take two or five servings nor eat all afternoon, either.

No S is about sustainable habit that curtails the behaviors that have put weight on Americans over the years. Frequent eating of intense sweets (often to the exclusion of lighter foods that the body uses better) is one of those habits. A reasonable serving of apple juice doesn't qualify, I don't think!

However, when a woman is pregnant, Vanilla may not be appropriate, but moderation is. Whatever actually works to promote consistent, honestly moderate eating trumps three meals.

(BTW, it's my understanding that French women don't change their habits much during pregnancy. Unlike Americans, and I am not saying you are like the typical American, they don't think of it as a time to [over]eat for two or relax their standards for the quality of the foods they eat. Their average weight gain during pregnancy is far lower than ours. The cultural imperative is so strong that people often think a man who strays if his wife gains weight that stays on her after delivery is justified!)

In my experience of years on this board, I've seen a few people add back small servings of mostly the less intense sweets more frequently and succeed. I've seen many more think that's a better tactic than waiting for the weekend and end up going back to eating a lot of S's all week long. They come back to Vanilla, often wishing they had never messed with it. Just sayin'.
Count plates, not calories. Three a day. 9 years & counting
Age 65
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
Jan/12-26.8
Mar/13-24.9 Stayed at +/- 8-lb. for three years Sept/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
Mar/18 22.2

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

bjalda
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Post by bjalda » Fri Jun 20, 2014 2:38 pm

Hey alicerabbit,

I was just wondering - what is so bad about 1 failure a week? I acutually think that you are doing very well (and probably better than without No S)? 4 days a week of perfect compliance is still very good. At least to me it sounds like a lot! But I understand that the red day can be hard on the eyes.
But if it's just a little 'fail', just the little dessert you are talking about, why worry at all?

If you'd just keep on doing it the way you do.. in a few months time you might not even want that desert anymore! Just don't beat yourself up about those failure days.
Do you really need perfect compliance? I don't think so! Just keep enjoying No S, this sane way of eating, and don't obsess about a few failure days. Wouldn't it be nicer to just sit back and enjoy your food and wait until you just don't needing that extra dessert anymore?
Last edited by bjalda on Sat Jun 21, 2014 8:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
Expectation exists when there is fear.
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bonnieUK
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Post by bonnieUK » Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:38 pm

oolala53 wrote:You can add or subtract anything you want. It's just not Vanilla. Also, what children do and what adults do are often different in slim cultures. And some things are easier to do when the whole culture is doing it and when there is no history of overdoing it. Children in France have a dessert at lunch much like the ones you describe, but they can't take two or five servings nor eat all afternoon, either.
I think the dessert after lunch thing in England and France is so the children have energy for the whole afternoon, you're right it is less accepted for adults to have desserts, as we're supposed to be able to go longer without eating and not really need it. But some will anyway (maybe just not everyday).

From what I've observed in Greece, children have desserts but adults usually don't. They (adults) do often have something sweet with coffee in the afternoon/early evening, but usually a small thing like a little pastry or something - the coffee is the important part, the sweet is just the accessory :) there is actually a name for this kind of mini dessert but I can't remember it.

CuriousAT
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Post by CuriousAT » Sat Jun 21, 2014 6:58 pm

I have an enormous sweet tooth and am practically in the same boat. But I'm afraid that if I skip the no sweet rule, I will balloon up. :( And so what if you have a compliance problem. You know that it is a problem, that solves half of it.

So my advice is that you try to eat some fruit after lunch/dinner. It is something I'm going to try so I don't know if it will work. Fruit is sweet but doesn't contain sugar. In fact, even carrots are sweet. You can also check for your sweet trigger. I have two. One is habit so even if I am full I want something sweet. Gah! The second is when I have not had enough water or haven't slept on time. Discovering your triggers would help resolve the problem.

Wish you luck!!

Cheers!!!

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sun Jun 22, 2014 4:34 am

I suggest that you think of the fruit as PART of your lunch or dinner, even if you eat it last.

Just want to say that I had a "sweet tooth" as well before No S 4 years ago. I would eat a 20-oz. bar of milk chocolate at one sitting. Half a 9-inch cake. Nearly 1/2 gallon of ice cream at a time. I now sometimes have whole weeks go by with no sweets because I just don't see a reason to have them. And I also eat and enjoy them, as I did tonight. It has been a process (rocky for 2+ years) but I just kept going.
Count plates, not calories. Three a day. 9 years & counting
Age 65
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
Jan/12-26.8
Mar/13-24.9 Stayed at +/- 8-lb. for three years Sept/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
Mar/18 22.2

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

r.jean
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Post by r.jean » Mon Jun 23, 2014 11:15 pm

Do you keep a habit cal? If you do three calendars instead of one, you can track your compliance for each S. If you have good compliance for snacks and seconds then compliance for sweets will not matter as much. A separate calendar might keep you in check mentally without making you feel like a failure for having a few reds. Giving up the sweets rule is a personal choice though and may work for you. It would not be a good idea for me, but we are all different.
The journey is the reward.
Maintenance is progress.

leafy_greens
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Re: Thinking of dropping an S rule! (No sweets)

Post by leafy_greens » Fri Jul 11, 2014 4:29 pm

alicerabbit wrote:I am having a compliance problem! I've gotten into a bad habit of having an extra s day every week (a fail day). Every time Monday comes around I think 'oh no, 5 'n' days in a row coming up! How will I survive'. Pretty pathetic, I know.
The snacking isn't really a problem, I enjoy eating at meal times now. Eating a regular plate sized meal is also easy enough (even if I don't use one physical plate). I think my problem is the 'no sweets' rule. I don't think its good to allow yourself sweets everyday, but if I can't comply with vanilla, maybe I should do something.
I would take away the 'no sweets' rule making it just 'no snacks, no seconds'. I would do this by leaving room on my dinner plate for a dessert. I don't usually eat on one physical plate anyway and I have become good with eying meal sizes (or virtual plating).
This makes it a bit inconvenient for eating dessert but still an option.
I am hoping by just knowing I am allowed sweets will be enough,. And I won't need to actually have a dessert each day.

I know including dessert (on my virtual plate) will probably mean I am eating more calories. ..

Baby steps.

What do you think? I'd appreciate any advice.
Alice, We sound like twins. My issue is not with portions or seconds but with sweets. I crave them all day long every day of my life. Even during successful bouts of No S where I have lost weight, I feel imprisoned by my desire for sweets.

I will add that during successful No S weight loss I did not include any kind of sweets. But Sunday nights, despite my bloated weekend belly, are pretty miserable, knowing that I can't have what I want the next day.

I haven't figured out a solution. I just thought I would share my experience. I would err on the side of not putting any sweets in your meals. I haven't reached this point yet, but supposedly you can learn to live without them if you try long enough. I hope to get to this point one day.
"No S IS hard... It just turns out that everything else is harder." -oolala53

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Fri Jul 11, 2014 5:32 pm

I humbly suggest that you spend some time and mental energy concentrating on how delicious the food you DO eat is before, during, and after you eat it. Be sure you are including savory foods you feel are knockout good. Revel in them as you eat. Be honest with yourself at the end of the meal: would this experience really be that much better if I had a sweet, too? Would LIFE be that much better? All things considered, isn't my life sweet enough just having eaten such a great meal?

Minimizing the sacrifice and maximizing the benefit in your mind can be very effective.
Count plates, not calories. Three a day. 9 years & counting
Age 65
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
Jan/12-26.8
Mar/13-24.9 Stayed at +/- 8-lb. for three years Sept/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
Mar/18 22.2

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

Lyra
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Post by Lyra » Sat Jul 12, 2014 11:46 am

Once I was traveling with a friend and her Swedish (funny, autocorrect wanted to change that to "sweetish") boyfriend and we stopped for breakfast. Lars ordered pancakes and ate them dry (no butter, no syrup) until the very last bite. The last mouthful was loaded up with butter and syrup.

I've never been able to eat many sweets because of a health condition, but what Lars did was ingenious.... It's the last bite that counts, and that's really all you need to feel psychologically satisfied. I've never eaten pancakes any other way.

Sooooo, what you could do is have one mouthful of desert after dinner. Make it a really great mouthful and then close up shop. Alternatively, you could finish with a piece of dried fruit, which are very sweet but not an S. At least, I don't think they're an S?

leafy_greens
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Post by leafy_greens » Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:56 pm

oolala53 wrote:Just want to say that I had a "sweet tooth" as well before No S 4 years ago. I would eat a 20-oz. bar of milk chocolate at one sitting. Half a 9-inch cake. Nearly 1/2 gallon of ice cream at a time. I now sometimes have whole weeks go by with no sweets because I just don't see a reason to have them. And I also eat and enjoy them, as I did tonight. It has been a process (rocky for 2+ years) but I just kept going.
You're my hero.
"No S IS hard... It just turns out that everything else is harder." -oolala53

heatherhikes
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Post by heatherhikes » Wed Aug 13, 2014 8:36 pm

leafy_greens wrote:
oolala53 wrote:Just want to say that I had a "sweet tooth" as well before No S 4 years ago. I would eat a 20-oz. bar of milk chocolate at one sitting. Half a 9-inch cake. Nearly 1/2 gallon of ice cream at a time. I now sometimes have whole weeks go by with no sweets because I just don't see a reason to have them. And I also eat and enjoy them, as I did tonight. It has been a process (rocky for 2+ years) but I just kept going.
You're my hero.
Mine, too :wink: :D
__________
h

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sat Aug 16, 2014 4:03 pm

I'm humbled. Been failing a bit lately, but this is bolstering me.
Count plates, not calories. Three a day. 9 years & counting
Age 65
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
Jan/12-26.8
Mar/13-24.9 Stayed at +/- 8-lb. for three years Sept/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
Mar/18 22.2

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

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