More scientific support for NoS

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Imogen Morley
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More scientific support for NoS

Post by Imogen Morley » Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:15 am

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 094844.htm

I'd say that three meals is ideal, but my observations during 7 years of NoS habits seem to be confirming the rest of the findings. Now, with the 5-month-old at home, we've already discussed that no snacking and sweets on special days is going to be the default in our house, even though my husband has a very sketchy NoS record. Mounting scientific evidence and common sense win hands down.

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Merry
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Post by Merry » Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:43 pm

Interesting. I eat such a light breakfast compared to my other meals. I could definitely make lunch the biggest meal and do a light supper I think, but I'd struggle with a big breakfast. I just don't feel like a lot of food then (and I often wait an hour or two before eating too).
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:12 am

As a practical weight-management strategy,
Whatever is deemed healthy must still be negotiated with culture and habit. I don't think in our culture trying to make breakfast big or even the midday meal be the major one will ever be practical because it is socially unsatisfying not be to be able to share the major meal of the day with others close to us. Maybe those who have a lot of discretion over their time could pull it off. I am not willing to have my big meal before I have to be at work at 7:10 a.m. even though I live and often eat alone.

What seems significant to me is that only one meal of the day is actually what we might think of as a full meal. At least one other one is often very small in slim cultures and the other is in between.

But those are refinements for once habit it established.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 67
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (more flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

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reinhard
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Post by reinhard » Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:54 pm

Very interesting. Thanks for the link!

While my breakfasts tend to be hearty, my dinners are no slouches either, though I guess I tend to eat them relatively early (5:45ish, usually).

Lunch is the meal that will not infrequently get short shrift unless I'm eating out with a friend or colleague.

I guess I eat breakfast and dinner like a prince, lunch (often) like a pauper.

I save the king business for S-days.

Reinhard

Marina
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Post by Marina » Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:41 pm

I have a small breakfast (usually fruit and nuts or fruit, a toast and a little iogurt). Lunch is my biggest meal. Dinner is a bigger meal than breakfast but always smaller than lunch and often a cold meal.

It seems my habits are good!

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Post by TexArk » Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:35 pm

My experience teaching overseas (Italy 4 months, Greece 4 months) and my daughter's experience living in French speaking Europe 2 summers in people's homes was eye opening.

1. In Italy, Greece, France, and Switzerland, the nontransplanted Americans didn't eat breakfast at all. They might have a strong coffee and maybe something sweet in the middle of the morning. However, it was not eaten in a vehicle or walking down the street. (Except maybe the espresso on the run.) And of course, they don't have all the drive through food places like we do.

2. The mid day meal was also very light...maybe a panini or small crepe or a yogurt cucumber salad or cheese and bread esp in France. Again, only the tourists ate on the street. Stores closed for a long lunch break which usually included a little nap. The children came home from school (at least the ones we were staying with) and had a long lunch break.

3. The big meal was several courses (small portions) and it was late at night by U. S. standards. People lingered over the table for at least an hour and then took a walk in the evening...a stroll really, not an aerobic walk.

4. The storage space for food was small which led to not having lots of food in the house. Even in city living, there was lots of walking or bike riding. And of course, NO SNACKING. They just didn't do it. Every meal was served on a tablecloth with fresh flowers and was never rushed. I also noticed no desserts in the homes except a serving they might pick up at a local bakery wrapped beautifully (by the way) for a special occasion or maybe a walk to the town square for gelato in the evening.

5. Sadly, they are beginning to pick up our bad habits. The birth rate is low and the children are doted on by grandparents and parents and yes, they are getting chunky, especially in Greece.

Granted, I didn't have much experience in Germany and any places we stayed in the UK were catering to Americans. I got the idea that even there they didn't eat those big English breakfasts daily like the Bed and Breakfasts all served.

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 3:20 am

Thanks for the added observations, TexArk.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 67
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (more flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There was no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

Ray E
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Post by Ray E » Fri Aug 04, 2017 2:28 pm

My oldest lived in Western France her 10th grade HS year and Face Timed with one of my daughters at home to show her host family our house in the US. When they were in the kitchen, her host mother asked what "that" room was and my daughter said it's the pantry. After explaining how we use a pantry, her host mother said- no wonder Americans are so fat!

Whosonfirst
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Post by Whosonfirst » Fri Aug 04, 2017 4:15 pm

Ray E wrote:My oldest lived in Western France her 10th grade HS year and Face Timed with one of my daughters at home to show her host family our house in the US. When they were in the kitchen, her host mother asked what "that" room was and my daughter said it's the pantry. After explaining how we use a pantry, her host mother said- no wonder Americans are so fat!
Rude by my standards.
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oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 12:08 am

Rude, true, but astute.
Count plates, not calories. 11 years "during"
Age 67
BMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8 3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (more flux) 3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux 6/20 22
1/21-23

There was no S better than Vanilla No S (mods now as a senior citizen)

noni
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Post by noni » Sat Aug 05, 2017 11:51 am

Except having a coffee, I rarely have anything for breakfast in the morning on an N-day, and it's the lowest weight I've been in years. It sounds like they like that 18 hours long fast each day. You could also do that, or close to it, by skipping breakfast.

As far as "practical" weight management in skipping supper, if you have family dinners, and especially if you're the cook in the home, how is that practical?

And concerning the American vs French pantry: what do the French do who live in the country? I could understand living close to the markets, that they wouldn't need to stock up, but driving far distances to the food supply each day or two seems impractical. I read somewhere that the French living in the country are more overweight. Does anyone know if this is true?
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eam531
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Post by eam531 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 5:16 pm

Regarding Germany--I have spent a lot of time there. In 1984 I went to a German language school in Munich and stayed with a local woman. We are still friends and I've visited her many times.

Here's what I saw--she lives in an apartment, as do the vast majority of people in Munich unless they are fabulously wealthy. Her refrigerator is tiny--less than waist high so it fit under her kitchen counter. This meant she can't store much so has to shop frequently. She doesn't own a car and takes public transport or walks or rides her bike. There is a very nice weekend habit of going for a walk (spazierengehen) after the midday meal. Lots of apartment buildings don't have elevators. Germans have been eating organic food for decades and have some of the most wonderful gourmet food emporiums I have ever seen. Their whole-grain baked goods are simply fantastic--beyond compare. On weekends my German friend has "kaffee trinken"--mid-afternoon coffee with some small cakes or cookies. Other than that, she doesn't eat sweets or snack. While I have seen some hefty Germans, I have not seen morbidly obese Germans.

Basically, I saw more movement and a more moderate intake of food in Germany than here. The same was true of Switzerland.

France--there was an article in the NY Times about the decline of small towns in France:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/28/worl ... fading.htm

It was by a French man who left Paris to live in a smaller town. He wanted to get back to "the real France". What he found was shuttered shops, including the food shops that are so charming, because everyone was driving to the French equivalent of a big box store to do their grocery shopping. In other towns, the charming speciality stores were still open, but catered almost exclusively to tourists. The locals were going to the big box store. The big box store was cheaper, and the locals found it more efficient to shop once a week than every other day.

My German friend worked full time (she is retired now), and I remember how she rushed around like crazy during her lunch hour, or the one evening per week shops were open late, in order to pick up groceries. At that time German shops closed at 5 PM except one evening per week, and were only open until about 1 PM on Saturday. Everything was closed on Sunday. If you worked full time, it made it pretty hard to shop. Shops were jammed on that one evening per week and on Saturday. I started picking groceries up for her, as I was in school and had few demands on my time.

While it is nice to think about a lifestyle which would allow us to leisurely go from the butcher shop to the bakery to the produce shop, the fact is that if you have constraints on your time, this is hard to pull off. The only place I have been able to replicate that lifestyle was in Washington DC, when I lived and worked on Capitol Hill. There is a European-style food market, lots of speciality markets, bakeries, wine shops, etc. It's wonderful .... if you can afford to live there.

ironchef
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Post by ironchef » Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:16 am

I lived several months in Germany with a family during a school exchange when I was 16.

My observations, living with a middle class family in Hannover, were as follows:
1. Both breakfast and dinner were relatively light, simple meals, usually with dark breads and cheeses and/or sliced meats. Breakfast there was usually some fruit or yoghurt accompaniment, dinner usually a salad of green leaves with oil and vinegar dressing.
2. Lunch was the main meal of the day. We came home from school, had a larger, warm cooked meal.
3. There was no snacking and no snack foods in the house.
4. On weekends, or special occasions, we would go to friends' houses for "kaffee und kuchen", literally "coffee and cake", where you would have a hot drink and a slice of cake or cookie at a kind of late afternoon time - 4:30/5pm.
5. Christmas markets were on in the winter when I was there, and there was definitely eating (and drinking) in the street at those. Hot pretzels, sausages, Gluhwein (mulled red wine) were all for sale from street stalls and eaten standing in the snow.

The family was a normal middle class suburban family, with both parents working. They had a pantry cupboard (not a whole room though) and did a once a week grocery shop like most Australians do, then a small midweek shop for fresh bread, fruit and salads. This was the norm for most of the families I visited and spent time with while I was there. Perhaps people in inner cities, or people who are not working full time, can run their lives and kitchens a little differently, regardless of which country they live in?

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