Swapping S-Days while still establishing N-Days

Becoming · Post by **Becoming** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:18 pm

Opinions please!

I'm a few days away from making my first 21 day stretch. I've been trying to stick to Vanilla No-S, and so far I'm very happy with how I'm going.

I'd like to swap my S-Day, or have a NWS-Day. Circumstances dictate that the 'event' would be restricted to the morning. I feel (fairly) confident that this will not lead down the slippery slope of completely falling off the wagon.

I'm going to be honest and say that I am having a bad craving for homemade chocolate chip cookies (worst craving since I started). There's no birthday or anything legitimate that I can claim a NWS-Day for. If I don't bake today, I am not going to be able to endulge this craving for a week and a half, as I wont be able to bake this coming weekend. I'm sure this is making the craving worse. I don't think I can handle waiting that long.

I feel like I would be cheating. Do I already have my answer?

sarah.grace · Post by **sarah.grace** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:22 pm

My opinion: taking an NWS day just to indulge this craving would be 'cheating' on vanilla NoS. I would also strongly advise against 'swapping' S days- I feel it would detract from the habits you're trying to form.

My suggestion: make the cookie dough today, and freeze it until the weekend. You can freeze it in pre-portioned balls- just add 2-3 minutes to the cooking time when you bake them, on an S day. If you don't have access to an oven this weekend, you could also bake the cookies today, and freeze the finished product until the weekend. (Though this would provide mucho temptation with the smell of cookies baking.)
Then, enjoy!

Kathleen · Post by **Kathleen** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:30 pm

Double post

Kathleen · Post by **Kathleen** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:31 pm

You already have the answer: the secret to this diet is that waiting eventually means eating less, and the motivation to wait is that you reliably have a time when you can eat what you want. Bake today, freeze, and eat on the weekend!
Kathleen

kccc · Post by **kccc** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:49 pm

Swapping S and N days is very much Not Recommended. Refer to the "strictness" podcast for the rational .

As far as a NWS day... I'm less inclined to say "don't" than the others. I took one at a party that I normally wouldn't have considered "special" just because I knew there would be something I considered a rare and wonderful treat and I wanted it. (Amusingly, I didn't even finish that slice of cake... but it made me happy to have some.) If you are not taking more than 1-2 NWS days per month, AND you don't think it will lead to binguing OR undermine habit... it could be okay. I prefer the bake and freeze option. (I always have frozen dough in my freezer to make quick cookies for guests.)

Of course... you can listen to all the recommendations you like, but ultimately you get to (have to?) decide.

Good luck!

NoelFigart · Post by **NoelFigart** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 9:26 pm

Becoming wrote:I feel like I would be cheating. Do I already have my answer?

Yep. Thing is you CAN wait that long. You won't wake up tomorrow morning with that craving. I guarantee it.

I would NOT drive myself nuts making that cookie dough, either. (I lick beaters) I'd wait till the weekend to do it, and if I knew I wasn't going to have time to do that, I'd promise myself a great cookie at the best bakery in town.

Becoming · Post by **Becoming** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:14 am

Thanks for the voices of reason everyone. You have all confirmed what I was trying to deny! I probably could have made the cookies and spent the rest of the day justifying it to myself, so you have made it impossible for me to delude myself.

So the good news is, the window of opportunity has passed, AND SO HAS THE CRAVING!! I definitely still want the cookies, but I'm happy to wait until an S-Day when I can bake. I'm proud of myself for withstanding my strongest craving yet. The feeling that I have now is way better than cookie-induced stupor.

I'm 4.5 weeks into my No-S journey, and I am learning something new about myself every day. Amazing!

NoelFigart · Post by **NoelFigart** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:26 am

Becoming wrote:So the good news is, the window of opportunity has passed, AND SO HAS THE CRAVING!!

Rawk.

Here's the cool part. It keeps getting EASIER.

NoSRocks · Post by **NoSRocks** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:22 pm

Hi! I'd say for now - especially as you're new to No S - only take S Days on days beginning with S.

I know it can be easier said than done when you have cravings but as the others have said on here, it does get easier, hon, so try to hang in there!!

Best wishes, Rox

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:40 pm

I plan my S days in advance at the start of each month. I let myself add one in later if I get a social invitation, but I don't let myself add one just because I'm craving something or feeling hungry, or because I'll have a chance to eat something I really like. I know that, if I let myself do that kind of thing, pretty soon every day would be an S day. People are good at coming up with justifications for doing what they want to do.

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:04 pm

I'm fighting a battle very similar to this right now. It's a little different. My problem isn't food cravings, but that I'm a stress eater. I like to eat when I feel stressed. I'm taking a Red Hat Linux certification exam tomorrow (wish me luck), and I am feeling extremely stressed about it now (sorry if I'm not totally coherent, I didn't sleep much last night).

As an aside, No S is good for stress eaters, because it doesn't require that we distinguish between stress hunger and genuine hunger. I feel something that feels an awful lot like hunger, when I am stressed. It's very hard for me to tell this feeling apart from genuine hunger. Fortunately, on No S, it's not relevant when you are hungry, it only matters if it is meal time or an S day.

Back to the point (I did have one, really), it's very tempting for me to give myself an S day because I'm particularly stressed on a given day. I don't do it, though, because I know what would happen if I did. The problem is, there's no clear and unambiguous definition of a "really stressful day". I'd probably end up taking a couple of NWS days every week, because I felt stressed. That version of No S would probably be too lenient to work, or at least to work very well. The same kind of thing might happen if you gave yourself an S day every time you felt a really strong food craving. Think about it.

You might think you could get around this by exchanging a weekend S-day for a weekday S-day. But I think, if I let myself do this, I'd have exchanged all my weekend S-days up through 2020 or so. A promise to not eat snacks, sweets, or seconds sometime in the future is not particularly useful for losing weight now. This is why exchanging S days on the fly is so dangerous.

There's also the fact that I don't want my stress to control my eating. I know, intellectually at least, that eating when I am stressed is not a good thing. I don't want to be a stress eater. Do you want your food cravings to control your eating? If you don't, you have to say no to them sometimes, just like I have to say no to those impulses to eat when I am stressed. There's no other way, if you want to get more self-control over when and what you eat. Self-control is very much a use-it-or-lose-it thing.

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:36 pm

Another problem is, for most people in most situations, there really is no such thing as "just this once". If you let yourself give in to your food craving once, you lower the bar to doing the same thing again when you get another food craving sometime in the future. Everything you do and don't do sets a precedent for what will happen the next time you're in the same situation. It's kind of like being a judge, or a parent (those of you who are parents probably know what I am talking about, here).

Ask yourself if this situation is likely to happen again. If it's a food craving or stress, it's as near certain as anything ever is that it will happen again. Ask yourself what you'd want to do every time this situation comes up, not just this time. If you're thinking of being lenient, ask if you'd want to do that every time. If the answer is no, then the answer needs to be no this time, too.

Becoming · Post by **Becoming** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:43 pm

Nicest of the Damned wrote:There's also the fact that I don't want my stress to control my eating. I know, intellectually at least, that eating when I am stressed is not a good thing. I don't want to be a stress eater. Do you want your food cravings to control your eating?

Short answer: Absolutely not.

Stress-dictated eating is actually more of a problem for me than food cravings are, so I can completely relate to everything you wrote, Nicest. I am learning that it's not a good idea for me to place even a little toe on the slippery slope of modifications at the moment. I know how good I was at making excuses for myself in the past, and I think I'd just be making it harder on myself in the long run if I start tweaking at this stage.

Also, best of luck for your exam!

Let me know how you go.

wosnes · Post by **wosnes** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:31 pm

My vote on this one is "no." You can wait.

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 4:42 pm

Becoming wrote:Also, best of luck for your exam! Let me know how you go.

I failed my exam, but managed to stick with the No S rules. Failing the exam isn't really such a big deal now, though, because I've got a job.

Becoming · Post by **Becoming** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 7:48 pm

Nicest of the Damned wrote:I failed my exam, but managed to stick with the No S rules.

Sorry to hear about the exam, but congratulations for sticking to No-S! Failing an exam would probably have been enough for me to justify breaking the rules, even though I know it would be cheating.

Nicest of the Damned · Post by **Nicest of the Damned** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 8:43 pm

Becoming wrote:
Nicest of the Damned wrote:I failed my exam, but managed to stick with the No S rules.
Sorry to hear about the exam, but congratulations for sticking to No-S! Failing an exam would probably have been enough for me to justify breaking the rules, even though I know it would be cheating.

It felt good to be able to have some control. I wasn't in control of the exam, but I was able to control what and when I ate. It made me feel like I had at least a little bit of control over how my life is going, if that makes any sense to anybody.

Everyday Systems

Swapping S-Days while still establishing N-Days

Swapping S-Days while still establishing N-Days

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Re: Swapping S-Days while still establishing N-Days