Pangelsue's check in (back to try again)

Counting carbs/calories is a drag. Obsessive scale stepping is a recipe for despair. If you want to count something, "days on habit" is a much better metric. Checking off days on a calendar would do just fine, but if you do it here you get accountability and support. Here's how. Start a new topic in this forum called (say) "Your Name Daily Check In." Then every N day post a "reply" to that topic as to whether you stayed on habit. A simple "<font color="green">SUCCESS</font>" or "<font color="red">FAILURE</font>" (or your preferred euphemism if that's too harsh) is sufficient, but obviously you're welcome to write more if you want. On S-days just register that you're taking an S-day. You don't have to do this forever, just until you're confident you've built the habit. Feel free to check in weekly or monthly or sporadically instead of daily. Feel free also to track other habits besides No-s (I'm keeping this forum under No-s because that's what the vast majority are using it for). See also my <a href="/habitcal/">HabitCal</a> tool for another more formal (and perhaps complementary) way to track habits.

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Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:29 pm

Thank you Nosnacker for the support. I need it.

I made the right decision to take a break here and get my head in order before adding to the stressors in my life. I read once that stress is like a glass of water, the trick is to keep the water from running over the top of the glass and making a mess. To that end, it is important to keep the level of water in the glass manageable. My glass has been gushing over the top for some time now. I couldn't understand why it was so hard to eat healthfully when it has become important to me to do so. I think it was because the glass was full to the top with things I had to deal with no matter how uncomfortable or stressful they were. I was trying to add more water by trying to restrict food. All my efforts were running all over the table and onto the floor. All it was accomplishing was making me feel out of control and like a total loser. So, this week, I have been sticking with one plate. That rule I can do. It is the easiest one for me. Mission accomplished. That feels good, not stressful. I am snacking but it has been small and healthy snacks. I am not thrilled with the number of snacks but I am glad they have decreased in size and increased in quality.

I have had sugar. That one rule is still more out of control than I would like. I am eating sugar more than once or twice a day. Ideally, I would like to end all sugar and never eat it again. I just don't think that is realistic. Allowed treats is one of the things that attracted me to this site in the first place. I also know that sugar is such a security blanket for me, that it would create too much stress right now to go cold turkey. All my life, my treat after the doctor or dentist is a candy bar. I wait for it like a 5 year old and savor every bite. When I am feeling stressed or depressed lately, I have been obsessing about a sugary treat until it is almost unbearable. Yet, it can not continue the way it has been. So I am going to eat one plate, snack healthfully and work on one sugary treat a day after supper. Temporarily, I am going to ask my DH to hold the treats for me until I am feeling more in control. We don't ever go into each other's dresser drawers (a plan we worked out when we first got married. Everybody needs their separate space) so I am asking him to hold the treats in his drawer for now and each night I will choose one treat. Hopefully, this plan will allow me some measure of control while I work on reducing the stress levels in my life and getting my moods elevated. Baby steps.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Who Me? » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:55 pm

Sorry to hear that your cup runneth over. I hope things level out soon.

My ultra-slim father had a sweet dessert every night after dinner his whole life (well, probably not during WWII...).

He stayed active, and was strenuously opposed to between-meal snacking.

But his sweet tooth was sacred. It worked for him.

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hey

Post by tobiasmom » Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:51 pm

Just want you to know I'm thinking about ya!

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Post by gk » Thu Sep 29, 2011 1:24 am

Good luck with your new plan and your baby steps. Wishing you contentment.....hang in there!
SW (as of 3/25/13): 172 lbs.
CW: 171 lbs.

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Post by determined » Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:55 am

Thanks for sharing what you're doing to manage while you work on the stress in your life. It certainly sounds like you're doing very well....good for you!

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:01 am

Worked hard today on a party we are having tomorrow. We have a group of 6 who get together for wine tastings. It has been great fun. We choose a wine and we each bring a bottle of that wine. Then we taste them and pick a winner. Whoever hosts the tasting furnishes the meal. We are the hosts tomorrow and we chose a slightly different format. We are serving a 9 course dinner and each of 8 people are bringing a wine for each of the courses. It should be great fun. Never did something like this before. DH and I had a great time today making the food. It is the most fun I have had in a very long time. Hope tomorrow is just as great.
Last edited by Pangelsue2 on Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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determined
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Post by determined » Sat Oct 01, 2011 2:02 am

What a fun way to spend a Saturday night!!!

Enjoy...

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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Post by NoSnacker » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:33 am

Hi there,,,,I hope you are finding yourself in better spirits. I read your post on another person's tread and really could relate to what you said to her...could have been me you were talking to. It is so funny how we are all in this same battle, came to point in our lives that food became our comfort.

After 2+ straight days not including the S days of binging I had a green day...as I was driving home yesterday I kept thinking I need to stuff something down food wise and then I thought wow, wait a minute....stuffing does not help..feel the urge and then move on...

Knowing others have the same struggles makes one not feel so all alone...

Baby steps among the stresses of life.

God Bless,
deb
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by Strawberry Roan » Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:36 pm

Morning, hope the wine tasting dinner went well. Sounds like so much fun.

I read your post above and admire you for realizing that you need to find your own path - and walk it. Walk the walk, as they say.

I don't follow No S exactly because I never was in the all or nothing mindset, it doesn't seem healthy to me. If I want a bit of dessert on a Wednesday, why would I save it for Saturday when I might not want dessert then?

Do what works for you, maybe a sweet now in then is the little sip at the top of the glass that keeps the water from flowing over......

:wink:
Berry

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Post by Who Me? » Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:26 pm

Nine course meal? Zowie!

What did you serve?

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Oct 10, 2011 1:44 pm

Nine course meal turned out awesome. We stretched it out over 5 hours and the portions of wine and food were very small. I don't think we ate anymore than we would have a traditional dinner. Great time.

I am getting closer to coming back here, I think. I am not putting any pressure on myself to diet at all and I am maintaining so I am accepting the fact slowly that without a diet I will not rampage into a frenzy that will end in being lifted out of my house with a crane. Whew! Spent a lot of time worrying about that. So I now trust that I love myself enough not to get larger than I am. Good to know. That knowledge is occasionally leading to stopping myself from having a treat or more of something not out of guilt but because I don't really want anymore. I am hoping that is a trend. I know nothing can work unless I am behind it 100 %. That might mean I will find peace being the 202 pounds I am now. Or I could decide to bring that weight down. For me it can't happen by writing down what I eat, or by obsessing about food. I think for me it will only happen when, decision by decision, I go with what I actually want not what I am afraid I might want. I am finding what I actually want and what I am eating are many times entirely different things. I always thought I was too lazy to make good food and too self centered to deny myself pleasure. Turns out it couldn't be farther from the truth. I am never too lazy to make healthy meals for my friends and family. But when I am feeding just myself, I grab any old crap. Also, I don't really usually eat for pleasure. I eat to distract myself from thinking and feeling things I don't want to think or feel. I really feel I am finally at the meat of the matter. Not sure yet what I will do to change these 2 things yet but I am working on it. My solution will lie along this path, I think.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by snapdragon » Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:13 pm

Don't have much to offer in the way of deep insight just stopping by to say hi and let you know you are being thought of and I am cheering for you!
Starting weight 185
Healthy BMI 139
Willingness without action is fantasy

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 1:08 pm

Thanks for cheering for me, Snapdragon. I love the support.
I wonder all the time if I should stay on this forum because I haven't been doing No S for a couple of months now but it is still helping me figure out things I should have figured out a long, long time ago. I am taking time off from all diets until I know what I am willing to do about healthy eating. I just came to the conclusion that if I have been dieting for 50 years and am still fat. Something ain't working. For that whole time,

1) I felt awful about whatever weight I was.
2) I decided I HAD to do something about it.
3) Searched all around for the next best diet.
4) Then I bought the book, purchased the membership, signed up on line etc.
5) I tried to follow the plan.
6) Inevitably, something didn't fit and the diet would end.
7) I felt bad about my FAILURE and let everything go, gained weight
8) Returned to #1 and repeated over and over again for 50 years.

A couple of months ago, the absurdity of it all really hit me. I am now appalled at the amount of time I have wasted working on this seemingly unattainable goal. So I stopped everything until the next choices I make are mine, not some book, website or magazine. But I am also not just eating whatever I want whenever I want. I am eating without the support of any plan but observing what I eat, when and why. It has been informative and will hopefully also become helpful. Just checking in. Have a good weekend everyone.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Who Me? » Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:50 pm

Good for you!!!

Have a great weekend!

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sun Oct 16, 2011 7:41 pm

Wow! My husband and I are reading a book together called "You Can't Afford the Luxury of a Negative Thought". Absolutely awesome book for anyone but especially for anyone facing life challenging situations.

A rather long section resonated so much with what I am trying to do, I will add it here because I want to see it often. And I thought some of you might find it interesting too.

The book states:
"We firmly believe that the way to more health, wealth and happiness is to focus on health, wealth and happiness. This may sound simplistic, but many people try to obtain health, wealth and happiness only by trying to eliminate disease, poverty and unhappiness.
One problem with this approach is that the lack of disease is not necessarily health, the lack of poverty is not necessarily wealth and the lack of unhappiness is not necessarily happiness. Sometimes we successfully eliminate a negative and discover we still don't have what we want. 'After all that work!' we sigh. And, discouraged, sometimes we return to the negative.
Another problem with trying to get rid of something negative is that we must pay attention to the negative thing we're trying to eliminate. This attention gives it more energy--our energy--and sometimes makes the thing seem too great to overcome...
When eliminating the 'bad habits,' always keep in mind why you are eliminating them. Focus on your goal. Rather than saying, 'I want to lose weight,' tell yourself, 'I want a slim, vibrant, healthy body.' Rather than, "I want to give up negative thinking, tell yourself, 'I want to enjoy all the positive things in my life.'
Breaking bad habits can be difficult, but it's easier if you remember that what you're adding to your life (the goal) is more valuable than what you're eliminating (the habit)."

There's lots more but it ends with:
"We live in a negative-feedback world. Often, the signal that tells us something needs attention is a negative one. Noticing these signals is not negative thinking. Doing something corrective about them is positive action. Getting upset about them is negative thinking."

OK, so what did all that mean to me? I think No sugar, No snacks, No seconds is catchy and it reached all of us because of that. It is easy to remember and doesn't involve complicated planning etc. But the guidelines are all stated as negatives. So the opposite of eating sugar is no sugar, the opposite of eating seconds is no seconds and the opposite of eating snacks is not eating snacks. We are forced daily to think, "Don't think about eating a snack. Don't think about eating sugar. Don't think about the leftovers still in the kitchen." All negative energy and all focusing our brains on exactly what we don't want to think about. So again, going with the suggestions in the book, we can instead take positive action. What is the goal? Healthier, slimmer, more in control, or whatever, right? Is that goal better than sugar, overeating or snacking? Or is the joy we get from eating sugar, overeating and snacking our real goal? If it is, then we should stop dieting and think "eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow we die." And we should be happy with that decision, live it, love it and not be defensive about it. We should also be aware that we are saying if these pleasures shorten our lives, so be it. We had fun. But if our goal is truly to be healthier, slimmer and more in control, then we should start supporting that belief in the most positive ways possible and stop saying "I can't stop thinking about that birthday cake. I am so weak. I failed again today. That is the 4th failure this week, month or whatever. I can't resist anything" or "I want a snack. I can't stop thinking about it." Thinking that way, we give in. And then later hate ourselves for eating it. That is what they described as negative thinking in the book. A lot of the population of this country is overweight and maybe even obese. If we approach dieting with the thought that we are denying ourselves everything we love and want, we can never succeed. We have to want a healthier lifestyle more than anything or we are just making ourselves miserable. So I guess I am saying that I should happily accept the status quo or I should happily move toward a goal of a healthier thinner me with a positive attitude and not think of it as denying myself but of giving myself the best food my money can buy. So I am redefining No S for me. From now on it will be No need of sugar, snacks or seconds except for the occasional planned, guilt free indulgence.

Happy Sunday everyone.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:20 am

Yesterday I needed no sugar, snacks or seconds. By choice, I went with 3 meals and 2 snacks.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Oct 19, 2011 2:35 am

There was also no need for sugar, snacks or seconds today. Went with 3 meals and 2 snacks again. Positive feels good.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by NoSnacker » Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:10 am

That truly sounds like an interesting book..I'll see if I can get it on my kindle..I'm definitely a negative thinker...see :)

But I like your attitude here...okay, so let me ask, you are having 2 snacks...can you define that for me, are they healthy snacks between meals, or after dinner?

I'm so struggling and I guess right now I want the pleasure verses the health outcome and I'm guessing it is from all the life stresses I'm under now. Maybe I can start to find some positive things to do instead of sitting in front of the TV from the minute I get home from work until bed eating..non-stop.

Like a smoker doesn't think something will happen to them, or ignore all the health messages, a dieter does the same..at least I'm living in partial denial.

Woooo...sorry, didn't mean to dump on your page....I started out to say thankssssss for stopping by my page and sharing this book.

deb
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by moderatemeals » Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:12 pm

Pangelsue2 -
Thanks for stopping by my thread and offering encouragement! I hope you are off to a great week too. I read in one of your posts that you don't really eat for pleasure. Have you ever read the book 'French Women don't get Fat?" It's a great read and I found it helpful because there are a lot of similarities between the French lifestyle and No S.

Good luck!
ljk

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:12 am

Thanks for the book reference. Actually, I think I started to read it at a friend's house once but didn't finish it before the weekend was over so I just never got around to it. I remember what I read fondly so I will probably look it up again.
Today was like the last 2 except that I had an extra snack right before supper. That snack was smaller than it would once have been because I caught myself thinking negatively about the day and ate the snack emotionally. I am happy with the day because it could have been worse, because I caught my negative thought mid thought and because I stopped. That is progress. It wasn't about the food. It was about anger, frustration and a feeling of helplessness. These insights are useful to me. Calling today a failure is not.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:14 pm

Catching your thoughts definitely makes a successful day! I'm truly sorry you were feeling those things. You were so wise to recognize that eating more wasn't going to help.

Well done...

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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Post by freegirl » Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:15 am

Pangelsue2,

Keep doing what works for you. Three meals and 2 snacks sound perfectly fine to me. I am eating three meals and an evening snack.

Sweets are my drug of choice, too. I am emotional eater - when I am stressed and unhappy, I eat sweets. I find that this structure helps me with emotional eating. I am also learning to accept my hunger, and stay with it for awhile. Maybe it can help with accepting negative emotions and let them run through me knowing that they will end.

I am rooting for you!

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:22 am

Thanks, determined. I think so too. It is movement in a forward direction.
Today was also a good day with the exception that one snack was spread out and unplanned so I don't feel it can be explained away as emotional eating. Just took a sample in a store and hadn't planned to and then finished the snack later at home. It was very small but the point is it wasn't planned. Otherwise good.
Did some more reading in my most recent favorite book and I found something that might help more people than me. Very interesting.
When we're breaking an addiction or overcoming a bad habit, there are times in which the willpower loses its will. Temptation becomes stronger than resolve. Our discipline seems suddenly exhausted and the habit returns with renewed energy. All the "good energy" we generated seems to reverse itself. This is known as the Law of Reversibility. ....
When you first consider giving up something you are addicted to, there is often a wavering. "Maybe yes, maybe no. I'm not sure." "I'll try it for a while and see what happens." I'll do it if it's not too hard." When working with addictions, such attitudes almost always lead to failure. As soon as the first wave of habitual desire comes along, these half-resolves are washed away.
Finally we say, "This is it. No matter what, this is it. I'm through with this thing that's dragging me down." At that point, the Law of Reversibility begins.
The Law of Reversibility is not the enemy. Far from it. It is the Tester. It tests us to see how strong we have become. It tests us to make sure we have overcome that which we said we would overcome. The tester not only tests; it also awards the diploma of freedom.
The initial enthusiasm of a firm declaration of independence from a bad habit usually lasts about three weeks. Then it's time for the first test. If you get through the three-week test, things settle down until about three months after you started. Then another test. If you pass the three-month test, things go along relatively smoothly until six months. Then it's time for the mid-term exams.
The mid-terms can be rough. You may find some of the most powerful-and tricky-testing to date. If you succeed at the six-month shakedown cruise, it's generally clear sailing for another six months. Then --one year from when you started- it's time for the final exams....
Here are some thoughts that often come during the periods of testing (which are also, by the way, the periods of strengthening.)...
Sample thoughts during testing:
"I can take this, but I'm afraid if it gets any worse I won't be able to take it, so I'll do it just to keep it from getting any worse."...
"I've had it. I've done enough. If I haven't mastered it by now, the hell with it."...
I know I'm going to fail-- I always do-so I might as well quit now."...
"I'll regret not doing this later."...
This is too much work. I'm tired. I give up."...
"I'm bored."...
The book talks about what causes these thoughts and that the best thing to do when they arise is ride them out and move on.

I can't take this --is fear talking. We are afraid we are going to get more afraid if we stay on track so we just give up.

I've done enough--adds anger, fear's older brother.

I know I'm going to fail-- unworthiness rears it's head. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. I always fail, so why bother trying, therefore I'll fail, therefore I was right, I always fail.

This is too much work--Tired and cranky.

I'm bored--They found that people often experience boredom just before they take a step they don't want to take but know they must take. It is usually a step of growth, of movement into their own magnificence.

They recommend riding out all of these phases and moving on regardless.

I thought this was brilliant. First off, it made me realize how often over the years my resolve was just half way like they described. I often gave up diets because they were too hard, or I thought I'd give it a try and see what happens. I can now see that fighting something as ingrained as my eating patterns needed far more resolve than I was usually willing to give it. Then I found No S and I knew I had found the place I was meant to be. But, I was still constantly failing or thought I was because it seemed like the cravings and thoughts of eating I was having were sooooo strong. Turns out I was being tested for my resolve. I need only to persevere. I always thought when I was plagued by thoughts like these, I was weak and wishy washy and just wanted to quit. It turns out, this is a natural progression of events when trying to change a habit. I am following a well trodden path of people who succeed. I just need to believe I can pass the test and move on.

The time frame of 3 weeks (Reinhard's 21 day challenge), then 3 months, 6 months, and 1 year seems to be such a pattern, the authors suggest the reader mark the calendar when starting to break a habit or addiction and watch for these test periods to show up. Forewarned is forearmed they say. I, for one, believe them and intend to buckle down when these test periods come and be supportive of myself.
Wonderful read. Really needed to hear this right now. I am right where I am supposed to be, doing what I am supposed to be doing.
I move on tomorrow armed and dangerous.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by NoSnacker » Fri Oct 21, 2011 8:01 am

Hi, are these excerpts from the negative thinking book? I did order it but was not available for kindles? If not what is this book?

Thanks for your stopping by my post. I think I'm not going to be so strict for now and because of my medical condition I'll try to eat smaller meals and include a couple healthy snacks.

Yesterday wasn't too bad of a day which encourages me! Was it green, not by the No S standards but for me not bingeing it surely was green.

Have a great day...
deb
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by NoSnacker » Fri Oct 21, 2011 6:22 pm

Great then I ordered the right book...

I truly need to change my eating like my doctor suggested..no more full plates, even if I use my 8 inch plates...after my meals I was trying to get in my sweetness with a piece of fruit only to be stuffed. My tummy can't handle too much food at once anymore, let alone the bingeing and I have to start thinking of my body a tad for now.

I hope you are cancer free now! You surely had a lot on your plate...

Thanks for the encouragement...for you surely are!
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 2:18 am

Thank you No Snacker. You are always so supportive of all of us here on the boards. Really appreciate it.
By the way, Freegirl, I was whirling through my messages and missed yours totally. It is nice to know there are people out there who are going through the same challenges I am. I am hanging in there because of that very fact. I need the support and encouragement.
No Snacker, I didn't need treatment for the cancer because it is a blood cancer and my levels are low so for now they are just tracking those levels. If they take a big jump or if the cancer settles somewhere, I might need treatment down the line. For now it is watch and see. My husband has the same kind of cancer and hasn't needed treatment for 16 years. I think it is due to our chemical free, mostly organic diet. It would also help if I lost some weight. The oncologist says I can't depend on my cancer following the same path as my husband's because everybody's case is different. What positive thinking huh? I could have waited until it got worse before hearing that. I suppose they have to tell it like it is but I have never believed we need to every detail of our health and prognosis. I like to think God plays a hand in the decision if we live or die. I am staying positive and dealing. That really is the only choice.
Well, tomorrow is Saturday and I am buying my one caramel apple of the year. I love them so much that about 5 years ago, I decided I would only eat one a year and I'd make it the best one I could find. So off to the chocolate store tomorrow to buy one covered in caramel and chopped peanuts. That will be my one treat for the weekend. Can't wait.
Have a good weekend all.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by NoSnacker » Sat Oct 22, 2011 8:12 am

Glad to hear that you are doing well...and girl I hope you totally savor every single bite!

I have a bag of apples I have to use as they are going bad..I might find a low -fat version of apple pie, with just the bottom crust...that will be my weekend treat..hopefully I can make it as healthy as possible.

Your goal to beat negative thinking has inspired me as I know I have to change my thoughts around about ME...

Have a great weekend!
deb
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:15 pm

Many of your positive thoughts to me and others have inspired me as well.
May you also have a good weekend and enjoy your pie.


I talked to my husband last night about the fact that because of bad knees and the dizziness, I can't move as much as I'd like to. He gave me a list of things I could still be doing and reminded me that when we marched in a protest walk recently, I did just fine. So I guess I have been making excuses about exercise too. Hmmmm. Thought about it last night and this morning and realize I have been depressed this year because so much has gone wrong with my health. I started giving up on myself and because of that, I have been making excuses for sitting around and brooding. The balance and dizziness issues along with bad knees have really become an excuse to not do anything I am too down in the dumps to do. So I am going to have to start to separate the bad health days from the lazy, feeling sorry for myself ones.

Final note before disappearing for the weekend--I also forgot to mention yesterday that I had no need of sugar, snacks or seconds yesterday. It was a good, healthy clean day. Yay!
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:58 pm

Pangelsue2...

Enjoy that chocolate & caramel apple....sounds DELICIOUS!!!

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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NoSnacker
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Post by NoSnacker » Sun Oct 23, 2011 12:01 pm

Hi there...sorry about the exercise and the limitations.

I was watching The Biggest Loser and when I contestant has bad knees and can't work out I've seen the sit and have this machine they use to grip and they turn it like bike pedals....and what about sitting and lifting small weights quickly to get a sweat started, not so much for the muscle but cardio.

Yesterday was an off day for me, but that is okay, today is a new day.

Can't wait for my book, I'm thinking it will be here this coming week.

Soooooo, how was the caramel apple?
Age 56: SBMI=30.6 (12/1/13) CBMI 28.9 (2/2/14) GBMI-24.8

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Oct 24, 2011 12:32 pm

Thanks for coming to my board, guys. Really appreciate the support. It helps me stay focused.
No Snacker, I know what machine you are talking about on Biggest Loser, unfortunately, that will mess with my neck and shoulders. I have arthritis in more than my knees. According to my doctor, I should keep moving but avoid anything repetitive. As far as I know, that leaves walking and my knees, at least for right now will only allow that once or twice a week. Yoga is out because of the dizziness. I intend to go on line today and research exercise for people with these issues to see what other suggestions there might be. I am sure I will find something.

The weekend was just OK. I did good on Saturday until night time. I ate my caramel apple which was good, not great, but good. We were going to a surprise birthday party and were told there was going to be snacks. I made supper before we went so we wouldn't be eating a lot of junk food. I made it to the end of the party and then had 2 slim pieces of pizza. No cake though. Almost, but then reminded myself I had the caramel apple and opted out. Good for me.

Sunday we had a friend over for brunch. We skipped lunch. We had supper and then after supper, I had some cookies, some grapes, some cashews and then more cookies. I was going to go get even more cookies and then asked myself what I was doing and why. The cookies were no where near that good to overeat on them. I decided skipping a meal wasn't a good idea because I thought it gave me the OK to graze later. Also, the friend we had over lost her husband this last year and talked for a while about how hard the year has been and how rough planning the funeral was, getting rid of his clothes etc. She needed to talk so we let her. She said it is hard to talk to her kids about it so she took a grief counseling class and didn't tell them because they would worry. I felt so bad for her and then as is my habit, I personalized it later. I pictured myself doing all of those sad things and, of course, started eating to take my mind off the unpleasant thoughts. The good news is I stopped myself at some point and stopped eating to just stuff down the feelings. That is progress toward new habits so I am OK with it. I know it was an S day so technically all the food I ate was OK. I was only thinking it through because they were mindless calories I didn't enjoy in the least. I didn't even taste them. I know now I have to investigate that kind of eating because for me, that is the habit I need most to overcome. Reasons for the stuffing: Unpleasant thoughts about mortality, sadness for my friend and what she has been through, neck and back were brutal this weekend and were wearing me down and since my friend's husband died of a blood cancer, I was panicky about my own blood cancer. There, I feel better. I know my problem is not about food. I need to find out why I eat. I did and I feel better for it. I will work on stopping myself sooner next time and thinking through what is going on in my head instead of beating myself up about what I ate. For me it is definitely why, not what I eat. Having figured out all of that, I now consider the weekend successful. Stopped myself twice, thought through the emotions and moved on. Yay, me.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:58 pm

Yesterday was good but not great. Did some sugar after lunch and it was because my balance was nasty yesterday. It was reactionary. I stopped because I realized that the cookies were not connected to the problem at all and they didn't make it any better. I was going to stop buying stuff like the cookies but I think it is good to have the stuff around so I can make daily decisions about what goes in my mouth. I am still allowing a couple after supper but the lunch thing was unplanned and needed thinking about.
Rest of the day was good except a new problem has arisen that I remember from a couple of years ago and it's come back to haunt me through my own fault. My husband used to work out a lot. Then he stopped and has been gaining some weight lately. He was unhappy about it and I could see it was affecting his self esteem. He was never overweight and he wasn't dealing with it well. So I talked him into going back to his exercise and we set up an area in our small house where he can work out. However, he comes home from work, does his emails and relaxes, waters the garden and then starts to exercise. Last night he wasn't ready for supper until after 7:30. That is way too late for me to eat. My food doesn't settle well and I am ready to eat everything in sight by the time supper rolls around. If I make something that can be reheated, I just eat alone and he eats later. That is the only meal we share during the day so I don't care for that solution but that's the way it is. The real problem arises with meals like the one last night. I made salmon and a stir fry. He can't reheat it without it being dried out and awful but he didn't finish exercising until 7:30. So I ate leftovers from the night before and he made the salmon for himself later. Hmmmm. This is posing a problem for me. I don't want to discourage his exercise but I don't want to jeopardize my eating because I have to put off supper every night. We will have to discuss this and come up with something that works for both of us. Any ideas, anyone?
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determined
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Post by determined » Tue Oct 25, 2011 2:36 pm

You're so good at thinking things through! And good for you that you've encouraged your hubbie to exercise again!

Could you ask him to set aside a couple of days when you both eat early & he either exercises after that, or he takes a break? Perhaps on the days you have to eat earlier, you could also sit down & chat with him when he eats later.

I wish I had better advice....

Hugs...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Oct 26, 2011 1:36 am

We must have been on the same page, determined. I talked to the DH tonight about planning on eating together some days and not others. You gave me some good advice though and I am going to take it. There is nothing stopping me from sitting with him while he is eating. I could have some tea or something.

Today had it's good and bad moments like all days, I guess. I made some flax muffins, some whole wheat bread and some garlic naan for Tom to take to the Pakistani student we are mentoring when they get together tonight. Unfortunately, I tasted all three breads. I don't regret it and I ate a smaller supper because of it but there was nothing planned about it. AT one time, I would have eaten the breads, still had a large supper and gone nuts after that because the day was shot anyway. This is definitely improvement from that so progress of a sort. I have a lot of progress to make and a lot of emotion to get over so I am happy when the direction is any sort of forward motion at all. Eventually, I hope to move even farther forward.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by oolala53 » Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:50 am

Sounds like you are finding a solution to the dinner problem, but I wanted to vote for your not compromising the quality of your dinner because you eat it alone. On the contrary, be sure the meal you have alone is very good. It will go a long way to your being happy with that cup of tea while your husband eats.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

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Post by Who Me? » Wed Oct 26, 2011 5:06 am

I wish you lived nearby, because I'd love to let you try my partner's recumbent trike. Because of his paralysis, he has lousy balance, but the trike work really well for him.

Can you swim? That might be easy on the joints as well.

Brooding ... I know all about that.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:47 am

Yes, I am finding a solution to the dinner problem, Oolala but I am still working on the feeding myself well. I don't eat very healthy lunches and I know it is because I am only making the food for myself. I definitely need to work on that.

I looked up recumbent bikes on line, Who me, and the main problem for us would be where to store it. We have a garage that is barely big enough for our car. I will check them out for portability but size will be an issue. Since the dizziness and balance issues, swimming is out. Even slow dancing is hard. There is very little of my life the dizziness has not affected. It is really a game changer. I was on a board for people with this disease for a while but it just got too depressing. Those of us who had lived it for a long time were very jaded and the newbies were begging for information to cure it. Then they slowly moved to acceptance. Yuck. Only stayed a while and gave up on it.

Moving on, today was OK but the snacking continues to be a problem. I added the 2 snacks and I am still grazing. I honestly don't think I am eating a large number of calories but I find myself eating 3 snacks instead of 2. The amount of food is going down and that is good.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by snapdragon » Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:58 pm

Haven't checked in for a while I will pray for you and send some cyber hugs your way.
Starting weight 185
Healthy BMI 139
Willingness without action is fantasy

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:57 pm

Don't know much about the dizziness issue except that I've had two bouts of labrynthitis. The last one kept me in bed with my eyes closed for two days and then still not a lot of moving around. Not fun.

What about floor exercise, like some Pilates moves? Or Callanetics? I remember being able to use a wall or chair for balance if needed in the versions I did.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Oct 28, 2011 10:07 pm

Good thoughts everyone and thank you for the cyber hugs and support. I am so out of exercise at this point and my back and knees are so bad, that even getting on the floor would be major. I found a senior's exercise website with exercises that can be done while sitting in a chair. I am going to start with those and if (or I should say when) have more strength and flexibility, I can investigate something more vigorous. Looks like No S and exercise are in the "face-reality-and-start-where-you-are" stage. I want to set goals I can attain.
Yesterday and today, I reverted to old habits. Calories OK but too much random grazing. I am going to try and stay on track tonight when we have our foreign students over for supper. I am proud that I am aware of the grazing and I try to keep it to a minimum of calories. They are little grazes. I hope this is forward movement.
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Post by r.jean » Sat Oct 29, 2011 12:15 am

Water exercise is also an option. The class I go to varies from my husband who regularly runs half marathons to people who come with walkers. The oldest person is probably 80-90 and the youngest in her 20s. They have belts that help people with balance issues in the shallow end or for those of us who stay in the deep end but are not good enough swimmers to do the exercises and stay afloat without help.

Our class is at the community college, but the Y also has classes.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sun Oct 30, 2011 3:06 am

Thanks for the information rjean. My next move however has to be finding a reservoir of hope that something can still be changed health wise. For a long time, I have been using whatever reserves of courage I could muster to just survive the stuff that was happening to me. That kept me very busy and it felt like I was doing all I could at the time. Now it is time to trust that the worst is over and start trying to actively rebuild my health. First I have to believe strongly that is still possible. Not an easy feat. A glimmer of hope is all I feel right now. Most of the time, I am scared to death that something will happen to take away all the progress I have worked so hard for. So when you guys talk about swimming or biking or walking, it seems like some kind of dream. That is why I am starting slowly so I can build on my courage and confidence. I wish I were like some of these poor soldiers who come home without legs or arms and teach themselves to mountain climb or something but I'm not. Panic and depression have always been my enemies and they are really slowing me down at present. I am also fighting complacency, laziness and procrastination. I am functioning now, if barely and I always tell myself to wait to do these active things until I "feel" better and they don't seem so hard or scary. That kind of thinking is not helpful. So I am going to stop whining about these problems until I actually do something about them and it doesn't work. Until I try and fail, I have no right to complain. So, subject closed on exercise, I guess until I find my courage.
Today was good for an S day. Did the senior exercises. On to Sunday.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Oct 31, 2011 2:59 am

Well, this is a weird one for me!! For some reason, I thought it was an N day today in which case it was a resounding failure. About an hour ago, I realized it was actually an S day in which case it was a resounding success. Intent is probably nine tenths of the law in this case. But really funny~
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:09 am

Monday was a mess but today was a very satisfactory day. Exercise, meditation and moderate eating. I am pleased with myself.
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Nov 03, 2011 12:14 pm

Another good day. Exercise, meditation, moderate eating. I made bread again and ate 2 pieces of that. One I intended to eat, the other unplanned. I may have the DH to slice it up and put it away. Just smells and looks too good.
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:51 pm

Still very much a work in progress, I'm afraid. Actually gained a couple of pounds this week and deserved them.
New thoughts found on the internet and going on my fridge:

Valid reasons to eat:
Food is necessary to maintain life.
Food is necessary to repair the body.
Food is the fuel the body runs on to move muscles and help the brain function.

(I don't see any need for junk food in the list above. In fact, junk food would be counter to those needs)

Moving on:

Food tastes good and we all experience happy feelings when contemplating food based celebrations. They are a pleasurable part of life and all foods can be enjoyed sometimes but unfortunately, too much food is stored as fat in the body.

This creates a conflict in deciding overall how much food is enough and especially how much less-than-healthy food is too much. One of the ways to tell the difference is realizing that we rarely crave too much lettuce or too much broccoli. Cravings usually involve the foods that fall into the category of high fat, salt and sugar (including high carb healthy foods like potatoes and bread.)

Because food tastes good, it also acts as a restorative and temporary calmative when we are stressed somehow emotionally. Our minds say "the body is in trouble (sad, anxious, over-tired, unhappy etc.) When we don't deal with these issues by resting, relaxing or otherwise managing the problems, the brain asks for more food to help keep the body healthy while stressed. A constant state of unhealthy emotions leads to constant eating to protect against the perceived threat to the body.

Food and our emotions become entwined and it is very easy to begin confusing hunger with emotional needs.

True hunger (when there is actual need within the body) is best met with healthy food choices. During "supposed" hunger, if healthy foods are continually passed up in favor of foods high in sugar, fat and salt, it is almost certainly not true hunger. It would be better to try to figure out what is really going on and seek a non-food related solution. It might be necessary to deal with the problem or it might simply involve finding a distraction. That distraction could be something active like exercise, talking to a friend, working on a fun project or it could be something comforting like meditation, tai chi, listening to music, watching a favorite movie or taking a hot shower/bath. Look for the trigger of craving fat, sugar and salt as a signal that real hunger and emotional need are getting confused.

Decide that the next time you are feeling "true" hunger, you will have a big bowl of broccoli or a large salad without dressing. If that doesn't sound good, suspect the "hunger" feeling.

I gleaned most of this from a number of articles I read about true hunger. I am hoping to put them to use this week. I am also begrudgingly going to start listing what I am eating because all the websites I read said it is particularly helpful when initially trying to control eating. It always seems obsessive to me but I have never really given it a chance. Maybe the real reason is that I get to the point I don't want to list what I have eaten on a given day. So here goes.
Last edited by Pangelsue2 on Mon Nov 07, 2011 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:55 pm

Day 1

Breakfast- Lender's bagel and peanut butter. Coffee. This is my Monday morning breakfast every week. I enjoy it, relax and then read for a while. I look so forward to this breakfast, I know it is good for me. I even dream about it on Sunday night. I eat Lender's "hole" wheat bagel and organic PB and jelly. All in all a healthy breakfast.

Lunch: The foreign student we are mentoring made supper for us on Friday and he made a wonderful chicken dish with rice. I had some leftovers from that for lunch along with a raw cut up carrot and an apple.

Snack- flax muffin with about a teaspoon of cream cheese

Dinner- Dijon mustard pork, caramelized onion and potato tart, green beans. 3 small cookies for dessert (about 90 calories).

I am happy with the results of today's eating. 3 meals, 2 snacks. I don't think I will ever totally eliminate sugar or snacks from my diet and I am not sure I want to but I fully intend to keep both minimal even on S days. I am hoping that will stop my obsessive thinking about treats and sugar. It might also stop a pattern for me of 5 days of craving and obsessing followed by 2 days of binging. Possibly that means I don't really belong here anymore since I am not following the No S format but I still feel Reinhard set me on this path of personal discovery. He helped me realize how obsessed I was with dieting and how simple eating should be. When I read his description of this diet plan, I was hit immediately with the fierce independence of it. There was a conviction that we shouldn't be making the process of eating so hard. And having once been here, it is next to impossible to go back to any other more restrictive dieting.
Last edited by Pangelsue2 on Tue Nov 08, 2011 3:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
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hey

Post by tobiasmom » Mon Nov 07, 2011 7:11 pm

Your breakfast sounds delish. Peanut butter on some sort of carb with coffee......necessities in the morning!

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Nov 07, 2011 7:28 pm

I agree. It isn't breakfast without a carb of some sort. Anytime I tried anything low carb, I just hated the breakfast eggs because there was no toast. Ah, those carbs.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Nov 08, 2011 3:27 pm

Day 2
Breakfast- oatmeal with blueberries, toasted almonds. Yummy.

Lunch- Found out a good friend from work has been let go. A group of us went out to lunch to commiserate and cheer her up. She chose A&W ( I don't care for chain restaurants). I had a .99 coney dog and small fries and a root beer. What a waste of calories but everything else was so expensive and I was a little short this week. Oh well, I think we helped her accept the blow a bit so it was a good thing.

Snack- flax muffin

Dinner- Fish with yogurt sauce and pecans, sweet potato, cauliflower and 3 small cookies. I also had a few pita chips and hummus while finishing supper. My husband made a batch of his famous spinach feta hummus and I didn't resist. The chips I had would have fit easily on my supper plate but at the very list, they were hinky.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Nov 10, 2011 3:36 am

Day 3
Breakfast- 2 eggs, toast, sausage

Lunch- 1/2 pork sandwich, pineapple and bananas

Snack- flax muffin

Dinner- Almond crusted chicken, rutabaga/potato mash and green beans. Also 4 gingersnaps with my DH's new cherry almond hummus. Wonderfully yummy.
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Nov 11, 2011 2:09 pm

Day 4
Yesterday was a messed day for eating but it was sort of my fault.
Breakfast- I was going to have a half bowl of cereal and a piece of toast. I ate the half bowl of cereal and forgot to make the toast.

We went shopping. We had groceries to buy and lots of other stops to make all in the mall area of a nearby city. The only food available would have been fast food and expensive. I wanted to get the random stops done before we went grocery shopping so it went way past noon. Around quarter to 2 I started feeling lousy. Shaky and light headed. We were in a store where all we could buy was a cookie. I bought it and ate it. I started feeling better. Then we headed to the grocery store and the only place nearby to stop for lunch was Subway. I didn't want that many calories because of the cookie so I opted for a bowl of soup. It was terrible and I only ate a little of it. I bought a bag of chips. This was frustration eating by this point. Then I felt guilty so when we stopped at our natural health food store, I bought and ate an apple. Then we got home and I had some chips and hummus. Threw in the towel I guess.

Supper- made a healthy meal of vegetarian chili over spaghetti squash. Had 4 gingersnaps.

I take responsibility for not making the toast (actually when we got home, the bread was sitting in the toaster), and I take responsibility for wanting to get all the stops we had planned instead of taking a break and going to lunch in another part of town and then coming back to finish the errands. The food is not the issue here. All in all, I was happy with the calories for the day but none of the errands we were running were dire emergencies. In fact, they should have been enjoyable because we were doing some early Christmas shopping and looking for new silverware for us. Long and short of it, there was plenty of time to do these things. It could have been a relaxing fun day with lunch in the middle. Instead it was harried and unpleasant. RELAX more Sue. Someday, I may actually get that principle into my life.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:48 pm

Another possibly long quote from the book I love and have been leaving posts about here.

The subject is GUILT in all areas of our life but the example they give is food related:
"Say we are on a diet. We want to lost some weight. Chocolate cake is not on our diet. We eat the cake. We feel guilty.
What images or beliefs about ourselves might have been violated by eating the cake?
'I am a good person. and good people take care of their body, keep commitments with themselves, have willpower, only eat things that are good for them, care about how they look, follow through on plans, meet goals, set a good example for others and care about the loved ones.' Something along those lines.
...When we describe our guilty actions to ourselves, we tend to exaggerate...
'I'm getting big as a house, and still I ate the fattening, empty-caloried piece of cake after having too much to eat at dinner anyway. I ignored all inner guidance to the contrary. I broke a solemn agreement with myself not to eat fattening foods. I have no willpower. I damaged my body by adding extra fat to it. I already look terrible, but now I'll look worse. I can't accomplish anything. I never do what I tell myself I'm going to do. I hurt my loved ones by setting a bad example of how to diet after I told them I was going to lose weight. If I don't care about myself, at least I could care about the people I love. And that's just round one...What to do? Well, the small print at the bottom of the 'I am a good person...' contract reads, 'And when I'm not, I'll feel guilty. Feeling guilty lets us prove we're still a good person.

After all, who feels bad about doing bad things, good people or bad people? Good people, of course. Bad people enjoy doing bad things! Bad people feel wonderful doing bad things.

To prove we're good, we punish ourselves with guilt. This allows us to maintain the image that we are all of those wonderful things...

Guilt not only protects an erroneous gilt-edged image we have about ourselves, it also lets us do it again. When we have 'paid the price' for our 'crime,' we're free to do it again as long as we're willing to pay the price. The price? More guilt. How badly do I want the cake? Is it worth two hours of guilt? No. I'll take a smaller piece and only feel guilty for an hour...

What can we do about the 'bad' guilt? The answer lies in six magic words--Change the image or the action...
Take the chocolate cake for example. You have lots of options for changing the image. You could change your belief to include occasional forays into cakedom, or you could decide your weight is fine as it is and call off the diet, or you could promise to take a long walk after dinner, or any other alteration of the image that currently says, 'Chocolate cake is verboten.' Changing the action is simple: don't eat the chocolate cake. (Once again: simple, but not necessarily easy.)
If you do one of those two things-- change the image or the action-- you will not feel guilty about eating the chocolate cake. If you don't change the image or the action, it's back to the old cycle of crime and punishment."



I love this passage. I have been on the image related guilt wagon all my life. And, yes, I have been buying forgiveness and playing crime and punishment all my life. I think this passage also supports the road I am on that says, this is a journey. I will be my own best friend and try to understand and encourage myself. Guilt and negative thoughts about myself are totally counter-productive and not at all helpful to my ultimate goals. Yay!
I'm baaaack.

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~hf
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Post by ~hf » Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:30 pm

Thanks to No S we have the choice of eating the cake while remaining on plan. I love S days. swooning.... ;-)

Thanks for coming over to my check in to welcome me back.
SW 236.4
10/26/11 restart date
1st goal 21 day club !accomplished! 11/24/11
2nd goal 10% loss
3rd goal...????

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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:03 am

You are right about the cake. Thanks for the insight.

Today started off well and then went awry.

Breakfast- 2 eggs, 1 bacon, 1 toast and jelly.

Lunch- leftover chicken and rice and 2 little cookies (first mistake followed by others)
Grazing sort of day. Calories were probably ok but no structure to the day.
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:08 am

Calories good, no structure to the day. Also, no guilt. It might be down to change the image or change the action and I seem to be changing the image. I may be back, I may not.
I'm baaaack.

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Post by kccc » Fri Nov 18, 2011 12:08 am

Hope to see you here... but if not, hope it's because you've found another path that is working for you.

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Post by freegirl » Sun Nov 20, 2011 3:39 pm

Sue, I hope you'll stick around. You don't know how your journey will unfold. Maybe you'll never follow vanilla no S, maybe you'll be close to it, maybe you'll find your own structure that works for you. I think the keyword is 'structure'.

Also, I think that in order to be succesfull, we need to be flexible. Our thoughts are often limiting us like 'I have to have something sweet every day' or 'I have to eat when I am upset'. Those are just thoughts - we don't have to beleve our every thought. I choose to beleve just the positive ones!

Whatever you decide, I wish you peace in your heart, and everything else will follow :)

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:32 pm

I love the phrase, with peace in my heart everything will follow. And yes, KCCC, I am looking for my path still. Both ideas fit in well with where I am heading right now. I am reading several positive thinking self-help books and more and more I am finding that first, my inner self has to be at peace. I have to be in touch with my spiritual self. open to being shown my path, and willing to follow what I am taught. I have been thinking about No S and why success has eluded me on this obviously sane plan.

I think there are some assumptions here on No S that have led to failure for many of us.

First assumption, the rules are easy and so we think the diet will be easy. It is not easy. If done well, it is hard work. I kept waiting for it to get easy. The plan is easy. Following it is not. I have also learned from people who were successful here but regained the weight, that even if I lose the weight, I will need to be vigilant the rest of my life to keep the weight off.

Second assumption, we think if we can make it 5 S days a week, we can have whatever we want on the weekend. Reinhard never said that. He says "No sugar, no snacks, no seconds except sometimes on S days." He never condoned a free for all on weekends. By allowing that, I think we negate all our hard work M-F. Bad habits aren't changed, they are scheduled with that kind of thinking. Most of us delude ourselves into thinking we can do 3 days a week of so-so vanilla no S, 2 or more days of binging and lose weight. That just is not realistic. The truth is that successful people here have 7 No S days with 1-2 allowed treats a week.

Exercise is important with this diet as with any other healthy eating plan and successful people here exercise.

And finally, many of us think that we can eat anything we want at our 3 meals a day as long as it fits on one plate and follows the rules. That would mean that a person who ate a plate of vegetables would lose at the same rate as the person who has a bacon double cheeseburger with a large order of fries and onion rings. Obviously absurd.

Initially, it may be good to keep the weekends loose and the meals large and heavy to get the habits down. Maybe it is even good to spend a couple of weeks getting each S down. Many successful people here did just that. They took about 6 weeks to adopt all 3 S's. From that point on, they were on track eating 3 healthy meals a day, eating only 1 or 2 small sugary treats a week and fasting between meals. There will always be slip ups but they are on track at least 80- 90% of the time.

None of this is intended to discourage anyone but for me, a reality check was long overdue. I wasn't doing any of this really. I was constantly playing with the rules, never really giving up sugar, having snacks all the time, and still taking my weekends as "well-deserved" breaks and eating whatever I wanted.

I am now eating healthier than I was but I am no where near where I need to be. I still think No S is doable, simple to follow and realistic but easy??? No.

I will continue to browse and learn from all of you and I will continue to find my way through the maze to a place where I can (vigilantly) live forever at peace with eating and food. I don't think anyone who was ever over weight can let their guard down once the weight is lost. Like an alcoholic will always want that drink and the drug addict will always want that drug, a former obese person will always want that cake or those cheetos. Sucks but a fact is a fact.

I will probably be back but not until I am ready to do the work necessary to be a success here.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:11 pm

Pangelsue...

Such a well-thought out & wise post from you. You're so right...this is just plain hard work. The plan is amazingly easy, but the work is so hard.

I hope your thoughts & ponderings bring you to a very content place...

Hugs...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:00 pm

Thanks, determined. I hope they do too.

I have something really strange to tell. On the weekend, we had friends over and the dish we served had pine nuts on it. That was Saturday. On Monday, I was eating lunch and everything tasted really off. I ate celery, carrots, snow peas and a slice of ciabatta bread. The vegetables all tasted very bitter and the bread tasted awful. All afternoon, I had an terrible sour taste in my mouth. Supper was a nightmare. I started googling and got all worried because taste changes can mean a lot of things. Then by accident, I found "pine mouth". It comes from eating a bad pine nut and the effects on taste can last up to 2 weeks!! ABC did a piece on it as did Webmd and lots of other medical sites. The description of what was happening to me was exact. Sweet stuff tastes so horrible, I could throw up. Seriously, this sooooo sucks!
I found out on the sites that there is a fungus or something on the pine nut (primarily from China and Korea) that attacks the taste buds. It takes about 2 days for it to grow on the tongue and is not harmful but it takes about 4 days to 2 weeks to go away. It attacks all the tastebuds except the ones for bitter. That is why everything tastes so bitter and why it affects sweets the most. Everything I eat also leaves a disgusting, lingering sour taste in the mouth that only constant rinsing with water can help. It is some better today and I hope I am one of the lucky ones who get better in under a week. Anyhoo, just a warning to those of you who like pine nuts. Don't buy foreign ones. I bought mine at Trader Joes and so did about 60 people who blogged about it on line. TJ's now has a warning on their pine nut packages that some people may have a reaction to them. So be forewarned. It doesn't happen to everybody and it can happen by eating just one pine nut. They said the effect is longer lasting but similar to brushing your teeth and then drinking orange juice. Weird, huh
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:58 pm

WOW! I've never heard of such a thing! That's so strange. I love pine nuts, but I think I might be passing them by now...

I hope this resolves quickly...

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

determined
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Post by determined » Thu Nov 24, 2011 3:19 pm

I just wanted to stop by and wish you a Happy Thanksgiving. I'm thankful for such great friends who have been so supportive in this NoS journey. I'm convinced I would have given up by now without the encouragement I've received here. Thanks for all your kind words...they've meant more than I can express.

I hope you have a lovely Thanksgiving...

janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

oolala53
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Post by oolala53 » Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:47 pm

It seems like it would be convenient to have something make us want to curtail our eating until it happens. Here's to voluntary moderate eating with no pine nuts to ruin the pleasure.
Count plates, not calories. 10 years "during"
Age 67
SBMI Jan/10-30.8
1/12-26.8
3/13-24.9 +/- 8-lb. 3 yrs
9/17 22.8 (but more fluctuation)
3/18 22.2
2 yrs flux
6/21 22

There is no S better than Vanilla No S.

snapdragon
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Post by snapdragon » Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:08 am

Pine nuts who knew? I hope your testbeds are back in action.
Starting weight 185
Healthy BMI 139
Willingness without action is fantasy

Okaybear
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Post by Okaybear » Tue Nov 29, 2011 3:33 am

Holy cow, that pine nut reaction sounds so strange, and not at all fun. Hope your taste is back to normal.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:40 am

Taste buds were mostly back on Thanksgiving. A few things still taste a little weird, like apples. Glad it is almost over. I sure won't be eating any pine nuts again soon.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:49 am

Did really well today until tonight. My shoulder really acted up and nothing seemed to take the edge off. So I covered it up with chocolate chips, cheese and crackers. To top it off, the sore shoulder was partly my fault. I worked too hard at computer stuff today and I knew I was overdoing it. But I just kept trudging on even though it could have waited until tomorrow. Speaking of overdoing the computer, it is 11:30 and I am signing off.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:14 am

Did really well until tonight again. I ought to move away from the TV earlier in the evening. I get sleepy and it is too early to go to bed. I get too lazy to do anything and eating is easy. I need to work on that.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Dec 01, 2011 1:56 pm

Again, did well until at night and even the night was the best all week. Less snacking. Forward motion.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:20 pm

Forward motion is the way to go!

How's your shoulder? I hope that's better.

After-dinner eating has always been my downfall, but what's helped me is the moment I finish the dishes I go in the bathroom and brush my teeth. No exceptions. Somehow it helps me to signal the end of eating for the day. Don't know if that will help you or not, but it's worth a try...

Thanks again for all your kind words on my check-in. I'm so thankful for all your encouragement....

Hugs to you...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:17 pm

Thanks, determined. The shoulder is a chronic thing. Sometimes good and sometimes bad. The other night it was bad, today pretty good. Thanks for asking. Aging is not for the faint of heart.

Brushing my teeth after supper would be a deterrent and I will give it a try. I sure can't hurt. Yesterday was great again until night. Seems to be the pattern I am in. It is allowing me to maintain but I would like to move to actual weight loss again. I should probably just be glad I am doing this well during the Christmas season. Ha! I was reading stuff about the Mayo Clinic Diet yesterday because they were giving away their program on PBS over the weekend. They start with 5 habits to overcome, 5 habits to adopt and 5 habits to work towards. It was interesting that many of them were very similar to No S. No snacks except fruit or vegetables, no sugar, and 1 healthy plate of food. Course, some of the suggestions were a little harder to cope with. They suggest we never eat in front of the TV. That would be very hard for the DH and me because we have done it for so long. Also they suggest that we watch TV for the same amount of time as we exercised that day. Yikes~ I wouldn't get to watch much TV. I think that is the idea though. I will work on watching less TV. It is probably part of the problem with the night time snacking.
Last edited by Pangelsue2 on Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:17 pm

I don't watch a lot of TV, but I certainly don't exercise as much as I watch! I've been keeping a knitting project in the living room to pick up when I do get the chance to sit and watch something. It helps me keep my hands busy. Eating and watching TV is a hard habit to break, isn't it? Ugh...

We'll get there!

Hope you have a great day...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:10 pm

Another good idea. I used to knit. I don't really need anything but just buying a skein of yarn and knitting to give to charity or something would work.

I just placed a challenge (sort of placed it because I don't know how to do that. If someone else does, please help me out and set it up or tell me how to). It is a Christmas and beyond challenge.

This is day 1 on this challenge for me. 3 simple meals I won't obsess or write down here and a list of things to do instead of eating.

Take a long wonderful shower instead of rushing in and out of the shower.

Find the Christmas cards and write notes in each one instead of just signing and mailing.

Finish the decorating and vacuum and dust.

Make of list of presents left to buy.

MEDITATE

Use the senior exercise DVDs I bought and get healthier and possibly ache less. That's why I bought them.

Make the phone calls I have been meaning to make and claim I have no time for.

Do the dishes (ugh but I like how a clean counter looks)

Play a song on the piano even if it messes with my balance. It is good balance practice and will make me feel good.

I made some home made Chai tea mix. It is delicious and I have only had one cup so far. Take a reading break and have a cup.

Wish me luck although luck has nothing to do with it. It is planning and determination.

You picked the right name, determined.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:18 pm

Pangelsue,

I just read what you wrote on Tobiasmom's check-in about this journey. You're so right. We have determination to achieve so much in our lives, but when it comes to this, we sometimes lack a stiff backbone. We need to make decisions for our health & happiness & stick to them. I FINALLY got the point that I realized I had to put my need to exercise before the needs of my kids. Now I'm healthier & so much more content about where I'm at.

Thanks for the great thoughts...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Wed Dec 07, 2011 4:29 am

You are so right and the stiff backbone thing was my undoing tonight. I did great all day and then caved and made dessert when my daughter stopped by for supper. I take full responsibility for the decision. It was an excuse. Dumb idea. I will do better tomorrow. My list of things to do instead of obsessing about food worked well. I will do it again tomorrow.
I'm baaaack.

idontknow
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Post by idontknow » Wed Dec 07, 2011 5:45 am

Pangelsue - thanks for your recent posts on various threads. You have echoed a lot of my recent thoughts - not so much about the baking (I don't bake much so it's not much of an issue. Plus there are always teenage boys around who seem to be able to eat with no consequences!!)
- but about the obsessing with food and the honesty with ourselves. No one is stuffing food down my throat. I am choosing to eat and I need to take control and make different choices. Yes, I can always start again tomorrow, but we need to view this as a way of changing our eating habits - not as a diet that we can start over and over again.
Thanks for the thought provoking posts - here's to honesty and perseverance :D

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:19 pm

Thanks for the kind thoughts idon'tknow. I really appreciate them. I feel like I am moving in a good direction lately and it is mainly dogged determination and the support of all the people on these boards.

I had a good day yesterday. It is day 1 of my challenge accomplished.
I'm baaaack.

snapdragon
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Post by snapdragon » Thu Dec 08, 2011 6:04 pm

I like how you focused on what you did instead of eating....so important to stay productive and have a little fun.
Starting weight 185
Healthy BMI 139
Willingness without action is fantasy

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:33 am

Thanks, Snapdragon. So far it has been working for me too. I had another good day. I have been having 3 meals and 2 small snacks because I find I get shaky if the 3 meals get too far apart if I don't. I am happy with the progress.]
Also, no sugar today. That is a milestone for me.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:42 pm

Good day until after supper. Lunch and supper were too light, I think. Also didn't do enough during the day. Was taking a relaxer. Night before last, I thought I had lost my wedding ring and thirtieth anniversary ring (made with the diamond from DH's mother's ring). I always take both of them off when I'm doing something messy like making bread and mixing something with my hands because they are filigreed and get all gunked up. I also take them off when I shower (don't know why). Anyway I couldn't find them anywhere. The DH (who is such a keeper, by the way) helped me tear apart the house looking for them. We literally moved all the furniture, tables, used the flashlight to look under and around everything. I went through all the Christmas boxes, one paper at a time. We went through all the drawers etc. We searched for hours. I was a mess and crying and couldn't believe I had been so careless with something so important to me. Anyway, woke up yesterday morning and decided there was nothing to do but hope that someday they surfaced. I said a prayer, asked for help from my mom and the DH's. I was going to go on line and received a message that we had lost our server. That was the last straw. My daughter had told me when this happened that sometimes it helped to reboot the modem so I decided to try that. I bent over to unplug everything and noticed something was sparkling on the tray of the printer. Then it all came back to me. One day last week, I got out of the shower and was going to put the rings on but before I did, I wanted to use some body lotion. I set the rings down on the tray of the printer, got dressed and then something distracted me and I never did put the rings on. We must have jostled the printer and the rings slid back into the printer out of sight. I called my DH and DD and cried off and on half the morning. What a lovely, lovely find. So needless to say, yesterday was a bit emotional.
Long story longer, I did some nervous eating after supper. Otherwise, I was incredibly happy with the day.
I'm baaaack.

determined
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Post by determined » Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:34 pm

Phew! I'm so happy for you that you found your rings! I once thought I'd lost my wedding ring & I can absolutely understand how upset you must have been. What a huge relief to see your rings sparkling near the printer.

Wonderful news...

Hugs...janie
"Rivers know this: there is no hurry. We shall get there some day."
Winnie the Pooh

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Post by freegirl » Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:11 pm

Hey Sue,

I have some questions for you. I am not trying to be judgemental or critical, I just want to trigger some thinking that may help you get over some obstacles. And you don't have to post your answers.

You are saying that it would be very hard for your husband and you not to eat in front of TV because you have done it for so long. You are trying to change your habits, not your husband's. Can you do something else while your husband watches TV? Maybe something that will improve the quality of your life: call a friend, read a book, take a relaxing bath, do a manicure.....or all of the above.
I know that watching no TV sounds radical, but try it for a week. Nobody can convince me that watching TV improves anyone's life.

Do you see watching TV with your husband as a bonding time? If yes, maybe you can find other ways to spend time together. Maybe start a new hobby together? Or spend time in long walks when the weather is nice. Would your husband feel threatend by your new habits? When one spouse changes ( even for the better) the other can feel threatened, and needs some reasurance and time to adjust. Hopefully the change triggers some positive changes in him or her, too.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Fri Dec 16, 2011 8:54 pm

Thanks for the ideas Freegirl but the person who is addicted to eating in front of the TV is me, not him. My husband and I talked about it just this morning and we are going to work on eating in the sun room or kitchen from now on. He will be an extremely happy camper if we do. We already spend a lot of happy, fun time together and eating supper away from the TV will suit him just fine.
The reason we got started eating in front of the TV is that we enjoy watching certain shows together and also the occasional movie. He gets up early in the morning and if we start watching a movie after 8, he usually doses off before it is done. If we get started early enough, he makes it through. He gets home at 4:30, does his business and Master Gardener email for half an hour and then exercises for about an hour. We always eat around 6:30. With eating and clean up, we would be ready to watch TV around 7:30. That is too late for him to last more than an hour or so. Choices, choices. I asked him if it would bother him to watch the shows on his own and he said he probably just wouldn't watch them at all. I always waited to watch them with him because it was fun and because I thought he wanted to watch them too. I got the impression today that he doesn't really care if he sees them or not. So, when he makes it through, fine, when he doesn't, fine too, I guess. It will be a good change for both of us. I do love TV though and have no intention of giving it up totally. I love the escape. My overactive mind shuts down when I am engrossed in a good plot or cooking show.

We are getting rid of cable in January anyway so it won't be an issue much longer. We are buying a Roku and streaming hulu to watch TV shows. It will save us lots of money on cable costs and saving money is always good. Then we can watch what we want, when we want. Also, my daughter loves TV and currently can't afford cable. When she comes over, she loves catching up on the shows with me and is also a night owl like I am. It'll all work out, I am sure. Thanks for caring and sharing ideas.
I'm baaaack.

Pangelsue2
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Post by Pangelsue2 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:00 pm

Just popping to say hi. Have been browsing occasionally but not posting. Things have been OK. Dizziness is still dogging my steps and I have had several relapses since last was here. Balance is still also an issue. Had an MRI recently and all was stable and normal with it. Saw a neurologist last week and he made an appointment with a physical therapist to hopefully get some of the balance issues addressed. He said he thinks I have labyrinthitis and that it tends to repeat for some people. I see the oncologist this week for my 6 month check up and I hope all will be good there. I have mostly maintained since last being here but have not really been No Sing. I have been researching some of my health issues and it seems like going with an anti-inflammation type diet might be beneficial for some of my health woes. Hope it helps. It is a healthy eating plan but I am still learning more about it. I think for now it is more important that I eat for my health than actually diet although it seems like this diet will also encourage weight loss since it is heavy on vegetables and fruit and low in fat, protein and refined carbs. Wish me luck.
Hope you are all well, happy and enjoying life.
I'm baaaack.

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NoSRocks
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Post by NoSRocks » Tue Feb 14, 2012 3:58 am

HI THERE TO YOU, TOO !!

Hope all is well with you, hon.
No S-er since December 2009
Streamlined S Days: 6/25/12
SW: 170 /CW: 127
Weight loss to date: 43 lbs

kccc
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Post by kccc » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:05 pm

Sending best wishes for your health. Good to see you here.

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Post by Strawberry Roan » Sat Feb 18, 2012 8:37 pm

Hi Sue,

Just wanted to stop by and continue to support you. :wink: I so appreciate your kind words on this board, you have been a big encouragement to me.
Berry

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