Hunger

No Snacks, no sweets, no seconds. Except on Days that start with S. Too simple for you? Simple is why it works. Look here for questions, introductions, support, success stories.

Moderators: Soprano, automatedeating

Post Reply
wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Hunger

Post by wosnes » Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:28 pm

The first thing I want to say is that I'm in no way affiliated with Dr. Fuhrman. I have followed his program in the past (about six years ago). While I was never hungry when following his program, I was also never satisfied with my meals. Eating satisfies more needs than just filling the belly and other needs were not met by his program -- at least for me.

While I think there's a lot of truth to what he says, I think most of it is too extreme for the majority of us to follow -- at least not without worrying about what you eat daily.

I've noticed a lot of people talking about hunger, almost overwhelming hunger. Dr. Fuhrman talks about "toxic hunger." Toxic hunger has nothing to do with how much or how often you eat, but with what you eat. Toxic hunger is like an addiction that needs to be satisfied. The addictive substances are the foods most of us routinely eat; and the "hunger" we feel is more like symptoms of withdrawal than true hunger.
Dr. Fuhrman wrote: Now if a person who has acclimated to or become tolerant to eating unhealthfully, stops eating, even for a few hours, they may feel ill, they may start feeling withdrawal from their toxic eating habits and excesses. The body cannot manifest symptoms or engage in right directed withdrawal symptoms from their disease causing diet while eating and digesting food. This begins when digestive activity diminishes.

If you were drinking 5 cups of coffee a day or of caffeinated soda, you will get a withdrawal headache when your caffeine levels dip too low. You can take more caffeine again (or other drugs) or you can eat and the food can make you feel a little better as it retards detoxification or withdrawal. The caffeine withdrawal symptoms can contribute to you eating more frequently as a means of managing the symptoms from caffeine withdrawal.

A few hours after eating most people begin to feel "hungry". They feel weak, headachy, tired, mentally dull, and have stomach spasms. Is this real hunger? I call it "toxic hunger" because these symptoms only occur in those who have been eating a toxic diet. They are withdrawal symptoms and they force people to eat more frequently and take in more calories than they would have if they were eating healthfully.

Symptoms of Toxic Hunger

headaches
fatigue
nausea
weakness
mental confusion
abdominal and esophageal spasm
fluttering and cramping

When we consume toxic or noxious substances or a toxic diet our body reacts to it rather violently attempting to remove or deal with the damage it may cause. This concept is called withdrawal. It represents an attempt by the body to detoxify from a harmful diet. It is this harmful diet that results in half of all Americans dying of heart attacks and a third dying of cancer. Nobody escapes from the biological laws of cause and effect from eating American food. If you eat the American diet you will develop and die of American diseases. Plus, you will feel ill before you die, you might feel ill every day eating this way. In fact, you might have been calling these sickly feelings of withdrawal, hunger and it may be the reason you have become overweight. Withdrawal occurs when not ingesting toxins. Withdrawal is inhibited by eating, exercising, and imbibing in stimulating substances. If you eat when you are withdrawing and not really hungry then you will be consuming more calories than your body needs to maintain its lean weight...

... True hunger would not have occurred so early after the meal. True hunger signals when our body needs calories to maintain our lean body mass. If we ate food demanded by true hunger and true hunger only, you could not have become overweight to begin with. We actually require less food than most people realize. Once we get rid of the perverted toxic hunger our central nervous system can accurately measure and give us the right signals for maintaining our ideal weight on the right amount of calories. Cravings are not the result of hunger they are the result of toxic habits.

In a portion controlled (calorie counting) diet it is likely that the body will not get adequate fiber or nutrition. The body will have a compounded sensation of hunger and craving which for most is simply overwhelming. It invariably results in people losing then gaining back their weight. Calorie counting simply doesn't work. Diets based on portion control and calorie counting generally permit highly toxic, low nutrient foods and then requires us to fight our addictive drives and attempt to eat less. This combination toxifies and undernourished the body. The resultant is uncontrollable and frequent food cravings. Without an adequate education in superior nutrition and solid principles to stick to; these individuals are forced to flounder and fail bouncing from one diet to another, always losing a little and regaining. Frequently regaining more than they lost.

True hunger is gleefully satisfied by almost any wholesome natural food. No special food is craved or needed. The food also tastes better when the body is physiologically ready to digest and assimilate, when hunger is present. Digestive juices are ready to be released and the enzyme secreting glands have had time to refill and are ready for action resulting in the most efficient and healthy digestion.
The way to avoid toxic hunger is to eat real food: vegetables, fruits, whole grains, beans and so on. Though Dr. Fuhrman would encourage limiting them to a few servings weekly or eliminating them, I'd include meat, dairy and some fats. (I do limit meat to one serving daily and 0-2 dairy.) But not things like "processed cheese food."

Avoid overly processed and refined foods -- instant anything, almost anything that comes "ready to eat" or only needs to be heated up. Be wary if it comes in a package -- especially if the ingredients list a) has more than 5 ingredients or b) has ingredients you don't recognize and can't pronounce. If the ingredients list looks like a chemistry experiment, it's a good sign that you shouldn't be eating it. Save these things for S days or S events.

As I stated in another post, I've not given up many of the things Dr. Fuhrman suggests (caffeine, salt, alcohol, butter, cheese and so on), but find that when I cook from scratch at home, even using white flour, sugar, and rice, I have far less problems with hunger than when I eat away from home or eat processed foods. Bread that I make using white flour is far more satisfying than white bread purchased at the store. Cookies or other desserts I make are more satisfying than those bought at the grocery. Stir-fry made at home is more satisfying than Lean Cuisine or Healthy Choices or the like. And so on. There are a few exceptions to that, but that's what they are: exceptions. Hunger is less of an issue when I cook using mostly whole foods.

As Mark Bittman says in Food Matters, "The goal of eating sanely is not to cut calories; it will happen naturally. Nor is the goal to cut protein, though again, you'll wind up eating less. The goal is not to cut fat, either; in fact, you'll eat more of it, though different fat (the same is true of carbohydrates). And the goal isn't to save money, though you probably will; think of the cost of rolled oats ($1 a pound) and, say, Honey Bunches of Oats (about $5 a pound). Rather, the goal is to eat less of certain foods and more of others -- specifically, plants, as close to their natural state as possible."

To sum up, if you're having problems with hunger, try eating real food. The only times I've had issues with hunger, my weight (and health!!) was when I ate overly refined and processed foods -- the Western diet.
Last edited by wosnes on Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

User avatar
Mavilu
Posts: 319
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 11:57 pm
Location: California

Post by Mavilu » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:02 am

Amen to all that, sister.
As you might remember, I'm one of those "two meals a day" people, just like you, I spend several hours in between meals, with one big gap between dinner and lunch next day and also I love the whole eating healthy shebang and I'm not having any "toxic hunger" issues.

This last december, however, I ate anything I wanted every day and much of that included the refined, ready-made stuff that is so readily available for the holidays and after I stopped on the 28th of december or so, it took me up to this week to stop having weird mixed hunger signals, in which my body was telling me that "it was hungry-it was not-it was!-no it wasn't!" over and over.
I truly believe that we do great harm to our organisms and digestive systems in particular by eating all the time and the toxic hunger signals (along with other digestive functions being out of whack) are our bodies' cry for help.
Now, whether people chooses to acknowledge that or not is another story on it's own.

kccc
Posts: 3957
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:12 am

Post by kccc » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:16 pm

I think there's real truth to this. Like you, when I make homemade sweets - even with refined flour, etc. - they are MUCH more satisfying than commercial.

And I just posted on another thread about a recent S-day visit to a buffet restaurant, where I finally figured out I was continuing to eat desserts because they just weren't good enough! I was "searching" because I wasn't satisfied.

I also agree there's an addictive quality. I used to drink tons of diet soda, and couldn't imagine giving it up. Nine years ago, I gave it up temporarily because I didn't want to drink caffeine and artificial sugars while pregnant. (I was ultra-careful because of prior miscarriages, so had extra motivation.) After my son was born, I took a swig of my old brand of soda and nearly spewed it across the room - what a nasty chemical-tasting syrupy brew! So my "temporary" became permanent after that detox period.

Also, prior to No-S, I also used to do "sugar de-toxes" on a regular basis. The amount of sugar would creep up in my diet until I could see that I was eating way too much, and I would go on a "sugar fast" (no refined sugar, minimal refined flour, otherwise eat normally) for a bit. It would usually take 3-5 days before the cravings stopped. Then I would eat normally for a while, until the sugar sneaked up on me again... lather, rinse, repeat. One of the things I love about No-S is that it keeps sugar from ever getting to that level.

wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Post by wosnes » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:50 pm

Over the last couple of years I've given up a number of purchased foods because they started to taste like a brew of chemicals rather than "food." Usually it was something I hadn't eaten for a while and when I did eat it, it tasted awful -- totally unlike I remembered it. The first thing was a flavored yogurt; I now buy plain and add whatever flavoring I want. (I'm very fond of the Fage Greek yogurt with honey and nuts. So good.)

There's so much I don't buy anymore. I either make it or it's gone from my diet. As I predicted some time back, bread is next on my list! I am making some, but not all, now.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

apomerantz
Posts: 282
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:22 pm

Post by apomerantz » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:26 pm

Thanks for sharing this! It's great information. I've really cut back on using processed foods for meals - - I make pretty much all my meals from scratch.

But I was eating all the snacks in between - - and often those were processed. And the sweets I'd eat for dessert too.

I think I'm definitely going to treat myself to an ice cream maker so I can make my own (hopefully more satisfying) ice cream. I think you are all onto something with your comments.

wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Post by wosnes » Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:23 pm

apomerantz wrote:I think I'm definitely going to treat myself to an ice cream maker so I can make my own (hopefully more satisfying) ice cream. I think you are all onto something with your comments.
I've gotten as far as getting the ice cream maker, but haven't made any yet. I'm still buying ice cream, but only those with high quality ingredients. It's funny, I barely read nutrition labels anymore, but I check those ingredient labels carefully! Any chemical additives and back on the shelf they go.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

apomerantz
Posts: 282
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:22 pm

Post by apomerantz » Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:32 pm

My sister has an ice cream maker, and we made some together during a recent visit -- it did taste very awesome! Which brand did you get?

wosnes
Posts: 4168
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 3:38 pm
Location: Indianapolis, IN, USA

Post by wosnes » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:12 pm

apomerantz wrote:Which brand did you get?
My daughters bought me a Cuisinart.
"That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do. Not that the nature of the thing itself has changed but our power to do it is increased." -- Ralph Waldo Emerson

"You are what you eat -- so don't be Fast, Easy, Cheap or Fake."

apomerantz
Posts: 282
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:22 pm

Post by apomerantz » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:24 pm

That's the one my sister has too! It seemed to work well :).

Post Reply